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Yes some of the bible stories have morals and teachings to them, just as most other fairy tales do. Those teachings do not make the stories real, just instructional.
That's a good point, and it's why I often say that christians (and other religionists) would be much smarter to debate the wisdom of the principles of the bible (and other holy books), instead of so often trying to prove the fables are true (which they can't).
Yes some of the bible stories have morals and teachings to them, just as most other fairy tales do. Those teachings do not make the stories real, just instructional.
Instructional is what they are, correct. You are free to see them as fairy tales or whatever fits your understanding, just as others would see what fits them. Mythologies are important aspects of a culture and the underpinnings of ethics. Great civilizations that have produced incredible wisdom and beauty, art and architecture, that have become timeless, also have always been inspired by mythology.
Instructional is what they are, correct. You are free to see them as fairy tales or whatever fits your understanding, just as others would see what fits them. Mythologies are important aspects of a culture and the underpinnings of ethics. Great civilizations that have produced incredible wisdom and beauty, art and architecture, that have become timeless, also have always been inspired by mythology.
Not that huge of a difference betwen the manings of fairy tales and myths.
How many theists actually care about the myths from other religions? Did the Raven make man, are borh Loki and Coyote tricksters of the gods? Do any theists on this forum take the Icelandic Sagas as anything but a mixture of histories and fairy tales?
Perhaps the use of the term fairy tale is an insult. Perhaps he should of called them childish instead?
How instructional are much of say the Bible? Offer your daughters to bw gang raped to ease pressure on stange men? How ro buy and treat slaves? What can one learn from the Genesis myths? The Blackfoot or Haida creation myths teach us as little about this Earth as the Bible.
Many of the World's great myths are from the peoples who just lived
on the land and whose myths were discarded and destroyed by followers of these religions you want to be treated with respect and with kid gloves while you label atheism as worthless, empty and childish.
Othe r posters should be allowed to be as disrepectful ax yourself. Theism deserves no more respec than atheism and just because you are a theist does not mean that theism deserved respect and atheism does not. Yes fairytales and childish were used as disrespect. I would have called them stories which both myths and fairytales are.
Theism deserves no more respect than atheism and just because you are a theist does not mean that theism deserved respect and atheism does not.
Agreed. The marketplace of ideas should be a level playing field where every ideology and belief is both free, and obligated, to make its own case on its own merits.
The problem with a lot of religious people is they have grown very used to things being tilted heavily in their favor for most of human history, using everything from cultural / social pressure, including political influence, to blasphemy laws. In the past dozen or so generations this hegemony has been broken, first gradually, and then with accelerating speed.
What this accustomed unearned respect and deference has done is made religion intellectually sloppy and disinclined to "be ready to give an answer for the faith that is in them" as the NT commands. Or if they are ready, it is just to make assertions and not evidence them in any way. After all, they've never had to before!
It is no surprise that European countries are the least likely to have a belief in the afterlife. However, I was surprised to learn from the study that 11.5-19% of China believes in an afterlife. Due to China's stance on religion, I thought the percentage would have been less than 5%. Interestingly, many people who believe that an afterlife is possible do so independently of belief in Gods, faith, or religion. This survey was taken in 2014, but it illustrates the point.
In a 2014 CBS News poll, the most recent on the subject, 66% of respondents said they believed in heaven and hell, 11% in heaven only, and 17% in neither. Americans who don't identify with any particular religion or are atheist or agnostic are much less likely to say they believe in either heaven or hell. Just under half say they believe in neither, while 36% believe in both and 7% in heaven only. In a 2013 Pew poll, 27% of agnostics and 13% of atheists said they believed in some kind of afterlife. https://ropercenter.cornell.edu/para...is%20no%20beer
Not that huge of a difference betwen the manings of fairy tales and myths.
https://knowledgenuts.com/difference...?quad_cc&=1
How many theists actually care about the myths from other religions? Did the Raven make man, are borh Loki and Coyote tricksters of the gods? Do any theists on this forum take the Icelandic Sagas as anything but a mixture of histories and fairy tales?
Perhaps the use of the term fairy tale is an insult. Perhaps he should of called them childish instead?
How instructional are much of say the Bible? Offer your daughters to bw gang raped to ease pressure on stange men? How ro buy and treat slaves? What can one learn from the Genesis myths? The Blackfoot or Haida creation myths teach us as little about this Earth as the Bible.
Many of the World's great myths are from the peoples who just lived
on the land and whose myths were discarded and destroyed by followers of these religions you want to be treated with respect and with kid gloves while you label atheism as worthless, empty and childish.
Othe r posters should be allowed to be as disrepectful ax yourself. Theism deserves no more respec than atheism and just because you are a theist does not mean that theism deserved respect and atheism does not. Yes fairytales and childish were used as disrespect. I would have called them stories which both myths and fairytales are.
I expect neither courtesy, respect, nor manners, or anything else for that matter from you, Badlander!
Cheers.
I was surprised to learn from the study that 11.5-19% of China believes in an afterlife. Due to China's stance on religion, I thought the percentage would have been less than 5%.[/url]
It actually doesn't surprise me. Belief in an afterlife and in deities is in my view, practically speaking, a kind of natural default given the strong human tendency to confirmation bias. No government has any real control over that; they can render such beliefs non-discussable but not non-holdable.
People only release such beliefs when they decide voluntarily to, and override their natural tendency to believe what is superficially comforting rather than what is supportable. To do that, in opposition to all the social pressure even in the West, almost requires that the religious abstractions have significantly leaked for that person, or they wouldn't bother.
This is why, as a minority view in nearly all societies, atheists are going to tend to be certain kinds of personalities, and less representative of the diversity in society generally. If atheism (or at least, open atheism) ever becomes a more generally held view, you'll see a lot less of what you see now, which is that we tend to be heady introverts, non-joiners and usually iconoclastic.
I expect neither courtesy, respect, nor manners, or anything else for that matter from you, Badlander!
Cheers.
Nor should you. I follow the Golden Rule for you hence I treat you like you treat others. You show no courtest, respect, manners or honesty towards atheists.
It actually doesn't surprise me. Belief in an afterlife and in deities is in my view, practically speaking, a kind of natural default given the strong human tendency to confirmation bias. No government has any real control over that; they can render such beliefs non-discussable but not non-holdable.
People only release such beliefs when they decide voluntarily to, and override their natural tendency to believe what is superficially comforting rather than what is supportable. To do that, in opposition to all the social pressure even in the West, almost requires that the religious abstractions have significantly leaked for that person, or they wouldn't bother.
This is why, as a minority view in nearly all societies, atheists are going to tend to be certain kinds of personalities, and less representative of the diversity in society generally. If atheism (or at least, open atheism) ever becomes a more generally held view, you'll see a lot less of what you see now, which is that we tend to be heady introverts, non-joiners, and usually iconoclastic.
As a former atheist for what was now probably the first third of my life I would tend to agree. That I was able to escape and resist the societal tendency toward religion is an aberration. The predominance of religious indoctrination in early life goes to show what power societal pressure has on conformity that so many would-be atheists are religious. Of course, now in my enlightened state I realize that there is another influence at work within our psyches - the very consciousness of God.
I expect neither courtesy, respect, nor manners, or anything else for that matter from you, Badlander!
Cheers.
But he certainly has your Divinity!
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As a former atheist for what was now probably the first third of my life I would tend to agree. That I was able to escape and resist the societal tendency toward religion is an aberration. The predominance of religious indoctrination in early life goes to show what power societal pressure has on conformity that so many would-be atheists are religious. Of course, now in my enlightened state 
I realize that there is another influence at work within our psyches - the very consciousness of God. 
