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Yes, but that's a selfish way of thinking. Everybody should thinking of others and should be choosing to stay home because it's the right thing to do. How sad that people like you can't do a very simple things for the good of others! You ought to be ashamed of yourself!
God forbid you have a sick relative or friend in need of help! Would you refuse to help that person because it infringes upon your freedom and you'd rather do something else fun, exciting and "free"? Oh how terrible it must be to make a sacrifice every now and then for other people!
Well...since we now know, based upon actual outcomes, that lockdowns as what was done in the U.S. don't work...to tout lockdowns or blame those that didn't/don't go along with that almost completely ineffective protocol is just bogus blowhole spew.
I'm a Veteran...fully willing to sacrifice myself to help others.
I just don't agree with freedom robbing, ineffective, ideas and methods that caused more pain, sickness, death, and harm (in many ways) than they prevent.
The lockdown is what caused the hurt/harm.
You need to get up to date on the facts...so you stop with the ignorant & erroneous accusations of how people "ought be ashamed" of themselves.
Be ashamed of your ignorance and bashing others based upon it:
Huh? My initial post was about worry about catching Covid in the church and then passing it to other people, especially to those that are vulnerable.
Look, I'm 36 years old with no underlying conditions. So I'm sure Covid won't kill me and I can recover at home. But what if I pass it onto my family, my neighbors or anyone else I encounter and the virus kills them??
Again, I must ask... after two years of this pandemic, do we not realize how highly contagious this virus is and how many millions of people it's killed??
Was it really about church to begin with?
Or was that just a indirect way to rag about the ineffective & terrible lockdowns that do more harm than good, that for some reason you cling to & love so much?
By your logic, and based upon your initial posts...the places of worship should have stayed open, so, in a effort to gain of few years of the mortal life they will lose anyway...they will avoid setting themselves up to suffer worse than they can even imagine for all of eternity.
Better to lose your life than your soul...right?
You should get to church right away...confess your sins & give 7 times your tithe for the next 2 years.
Well...since we now know, based upon actual outcomes, that lockdowns as what was done in the U.S. don't work...to tout lockdowns or blame those that didn't/don't go along with that almost completely ineffective protocol is just bogus blowhole spew.
I'm a Veteran...fully willing to sacrifice myself to help others.
I just don't agree with freedom robbing, ineffective, ideas and methods that caused more pain, sickness, death, and harm (in many ways) than they prevent.
The lockdown is what caused the hurt/harm.
You need to get up to date on the facts...so you stop with the ignorant & erroneous accusations of how people "ought be ashamed" of themselves.
Be ashamed of your ignorance and bashing others based upon it:
The only reason why I said people "ought be ashamed" of themselves because it's such a terrible thing to say that I want my freedom and YOU stay home. What kind of a talk it that? That's like saying, I should be allowed to drink and drive and if you're concerned about drunk drivers killing you, then YOU stay off the road! That logic is just really selfish.
And of course, lockdowns do work. It's just that people didn't adhere to them and that's why it didn't work. Basic common sense will tell you that if people don't come into contact with each other, then the virus can no longer spread. It's that simple to eradicate this virus. But people today can't do the simplest things!
And the "freedom robbing" was only meant to be short term, maybe 2-3 months MAX, but nope, people didn't want to make a little sacrifice for a few months. So here we are two years later and Covid is still with us. All because, I repeat, people couldn't do the simplest things for just a short amount of time.
Think of a basketball team. If you have one great player on the team, but the other players refuse to play well, is that team going to be very good? No. The WHOLE team needs to do their part if the team is going to be successful. Same with Covid. ALL of us need to do our part, NOT some or most of us. And that's the problem! Not everyone is doing their part! It's like the other players saying, "I can play basketball anyway I want, however I want and if you're concerned about the team winning, then YOU play well." Doesn't work that way when it comes to team effort. And eradicating Covid, unfortunately, requires team effort from EVERYONE!
The only reason why I said people "ought be ashamed" of themselves because it's such a terrible thing to say that I want my freedom and YOU stay home. What kind of a talk it that? That's like saying, I should be allowed to drink and drive and if you're concerned about drunk drivers killing you, then YOU stay off the road! That logic is just really selfish.
And of course, lockdowns do work. It's just that people didn't adhere to them and that's why it didn't work. Basic common sense will tell you that if people don't come into contact with each other, then the virus can no longer spread. It's that simple to eradicate this virus. But people today can't do the simplest things!
And the "freedom robbing" was only meant to be short term, maybe 2-3 months MAX, but nope, people didn't want to make a little sacrifice for a few months. So here we are two years later and Covid is still with us. All because, I repeat, people couldn't do the simplest things for just a short amount of time.
Think of a basketball team. If you have one great player on the team, but the other players refuse to play well, is that team going to be very good? No. The WHOLE team needs to do their part if the team is going to be successful. Same with Covid. ALL of us need to do our part, NOT some or most of us. And that's the problem! Not everyone is doing their part! It's like the other players saying, "I can play basketball anyway I want, however I want and if you're concerned about the team winning, then YOU play well." Doesn't work that way when it comes to team effort. And eradicating Covid, unfortunately, requires team effort from EVERYONE!
The only reason why I said people "ought be ashamed" of themselves because it's such a terrible thing to say that I want my freedom and YOU stay home. What kind of a talk it that? That's like saying, I should be allowed to drink and drive and if you're concerned about drunk drivers killing you, then YOU stay off the road! That logic is just really selfish.
And of course, lockdowns do work. It's just that people didn't adhere to them and that's why it didn't work. Basic common sense will tell you that if people don't come into contact with each other, then the virus can no longer spread. It's that simple to eradicate this virus. But people today can't do the simplest things!
And the "freedom robbing" was only meant to be short term, maybe 2-3 months MAX, but nope, people didn't want to make a little sacrifice for a few months. So here we are two years later and Covid is still with us. All because, I repeat, people couldn't do the simplest things for just a short amount of time.
Think of a basketball team. If you have one great player on the team, but the other players refuse to play well, is that team going to be very good? No. The WHOLE team needs to do their part if the team is going to be successful. Same with Covid. ALL of us need to do our part, NOT some or most of us. And that's the problem! Not everyone is doing their part! It's like the other players saying, "I can play basketball anyway I want, however I want and if you're concerned about the team winning, then YOU play well." Doesn't work that way when it comes to team effort. And eradicating Covid, unfortunately, requires team effort from EVERYONE!
The lockdowns DO NOT work.
This is where everything goes off the rails for you at this stage of the game.
Maybe in mid-2020, touting shutdowns and lockdowns might have been viewed as potentially reasonable...but even then, it was never standard practice to quarantine healthy people.
But we now KNOW...based upon studies of actual outcomes...that they did/do not work enough to outweigh the derivative negative effects.
As I noted previously...the only way "lockdowns" might have worked, was if you completely banned anyone going anywhere, not even out their door into the hallway of an apartment building...with supplies being delivered.
But that's impossible to do...and still may not work, because there are still a jillion people producing & delivering supplies that are in contact.
So...what does your idea of "a lockdown that works" look like...in a Nation the size & population of the U.S.?
What part of this don't you understand? You deem people "selfish & uncaring" for not doing what couldn’t even be done. You need to get hip to that.
Speaking of drinking alcohol. We know how much sickness, death, and harm to others (drunk driving injuries/death, domestic violence, etc) it ACTUALLY DOES cause. But do you see the government demanding nobody manufacture, distribute/sell, or use alcohol?
No...in fact, the same government that places all these restrictions about Covid, actually licenses alcohol manufacturer & sale...and shares in the revenue.
The same with tobacco products.
Do you say the same about the governments role in those harmful things, and toward people using them, as you lose it over Covid? I bet not. Why not? I mean, seeing that you are all so tweaked about "public health" and risks.
The only reason why I said people "ought be ashamed" of themselves because it's such a terrible thing to say that I want my freedom and YOU stay home. What kind of a talk it that? That's like saying, I should be allowed to drink and drive and if you're concerned about drunk drivers killing you, then YOU stay off the road! That logic is just really selfish.
And of course, lockdowns do work. It's just that people didn't adhere to them and that's why it didn't work. Basic common sense will tell you that if people don't come into contact with each other, then the virus can no longer spread. It's that simple to eradicate this virus. But people today can't do the simplest things!
There's a piece in the NY Times in the past couple of days (behind a paywall, I'm not a subscriber but it came quoted in their free Covid-related newsletter) ... it's about how China has imposed strict lockdowns since the beginning and has a death rate of like 1 citizen per million (vs our nearly 3,000 per million). And the Times believes these numbers are accurate, for various reasons, not least that it would be impossible to cover up the level of deaths they'd have if they were like us (it would work out to around 3 million dead).
In a weird ironic way the Chinese actually have more freedom than we do, in that when an area is not in lockdown, people eat out and go to public events and so forth. The main pain is that a sudden lockdown is always possible, but it's not nationwide, it is by city or province.
I do not think that China's hybrid capitalist / authoritarian system cares that much about individuals, so much as they have a PR bonanza from this success in imposing order on chaos and controlling the pandemic to a degree no other large nation can touch.
So while I am not endorsing China's system of government, they are living proof that actual lockdowns actually observed as needed, DO work.
By contrast though the same article says the rest of the world has decided our current losses are acceptable, and editorially, you can tell they agree with that horrible calculus. So ... we're basically screwed.
The lockdowns DO NOT work.
This is where everything goes off the rails for you at this stage of the game.
Maybe in mid-2020, touting shutdowns and lockdowns might have been viewed as potentially reasonable...but even then, it was never standard practice to quarantine healthy people.
But we now KNOW...based upon studies of actual outcomes...that they did/do not work enough to outweigh the derivative negative effects.
As I noted previously...the only way "lockdowns" might have worked, was if you completely banned anyone going anywhere, not even out their door into the hallway of an apartment building...with supplies being delivered.
But that's impossible to do...and still may not work, because there are still a jillion people producing & delivering supplies that are in contact.
So...what does your idea of "a lockdown that works" look like...in a Nation the size & population of the U.S.?
What part of this don't you understand? You deem people "selfish & uncaring" for not doing what couldn’t even be done. You need to get hip to that.
Speaking of drinking alcohol. We know how much sickness, death, and harm to others (drunk driving injuries/death, domestic violence, etc) it ACTUALLY DOES cause. But do you see the government demanding nobody manufacture, distribute/sell, or use alcohol?
No...in fact, the same government that places all these restrictions about Covid, actually licenses alcohol manufacturer & sale...and shares in the revenue.
The same with tobacco products.
Do you say the same about the governments role in those harmful things, and toward people using them, as you lose it over Covid? I bet not. Why not? I mean, seeing that you are all so tweaked about "public health" and risks.
I have to admit, I agree with you on the alcohol thing. I’m not a drinker myself, so frankly, I don’t understand this whole “drink responsibly” thing. Why not just don’t drink alcohol at all? I’m perfectly happy drinking water with my meals. And agree with you on the tobacco thing as well. Three people I know died of lung cancer because they were smokers. Its pretty sad. Our government is messed up, I admit!
I have to admit, I agree with you on the alcohol thing. I’m not a drinker myself, so frankly, I don’t understand this whole “drink responsibly” thing. Why not just don’t drink alcohol at all? I’m perfectly happy drinking water with my meals. And agree with you on the tobacco thing as well. Three people I know died of lung cancer because they were smokers. Its pretty sad. Our government is messed up, I admit!
As you see...even though smoking & drinking kill and sicken even more people every year (for decades) than Covid, and sicken & kill may others from derivative effects (drunken accidents and violence & 2nd hand smoke), many of them children...neither the government or the general population demands people stay away from those things nor bans making or selling those products.
And the reason they don't is that it is detrimental to people's freedom and the economic/financial considerations.
If people want to do things that sicken & kill themselves and others...even things that have almost no benefit, like smoking...we do not force them to stop.
Many more children are physically harmed by 2nd hand smoke than have been from Covid...but we do not even demand that adults not smoke in a house with children present. https://www.cdc.gov/tobacco/data_sta...acts/index.htm
And how many people have you ever seen up in arms and chastising others about it?
I would like to know: What is it about Covid that has people and the government so uniquely tweaked out over it?
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