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I have been here in Fairfax County about 4 months. My wife and I came from over four years in the Army over in Germany. I got out of the Army and left Germany, so we have really gone through two transitions: army to civlian life and Germany/bases to Northern VA.
It has been a tough transition on both fronts, and this area has a lot to do with it. Hopefully my experience will help those thinking of moving here.
Three things I learned:
1. Don't buy right now and don't move into a condo/apartment.
2. Don't believe the "best schools" hype.
3. Test your commute before you choose a place to live.
Don't buy right now: even the National Association of Realtors is saying home prices will drop over the next few months. Moody's Economy.com last week predicted 12% drops in the DC area over the next year or two. I believe it will be higher in the exurbs. The cost to rent is a fraction of the cost to own, and there is a glut of new construction in Fairfax and Loudoun counties. Townhouses in South Riding, 20152 rent for $1550-1700 and sell for $350-450K. If I stay here another year, I will rent again.
I will rent a townhome though: moving into a condo complex was a mistake, because condos lend themselves to "walled-off" living where you might pass the same people in the hall twice in a month. Plus there are few young couples with kids- mostly singles or retired folks. A townhouse would have been a better move, because then you have a (small) yard with easy access (as opposed to 10 feet down the hall, down the elevator, 100 feet down the hall outside, 1000 feet to the playground in the neighborhood next to us).
A condo was about all we could afford to rent in this area, because I wanted to live close to work. I hate traffic, and an hour in the car either way is an hour I can't see my wife and kids. So we took a place 5 miles from work. It still takes 15-20 minutes to go those five miles which I find frustrating but bearable.
People in this area are not especially friendly, perhaps because the commuting and dealing with traffic raises their stress level. I know it has raised mine. Catholics will appreciate this anecdote: at the church I attend, 30-50% of parishoners leave after Communion, before Mass is even over. Presumably it's to "beat the traffic." My wife is not Catholic, and we also attend a Christian service, and in that church's parking lot I have been door-dinged and cut off. Something like that happens every week. And these are the churchgoing folk!!!
~I bike in once a week and it takes 25 minutes, or 5 minutes more than driving. That tells you we have some traffic problems in this area!~
Schools: The "best schools" stat is way overestimated in this area. If you have kids, you are the biggest factor in their school performance. All the small class sizes and rich schools in the world aren't going to matter if the parents don't care. It amuses me to see people, especially childless ones, tout the NOVA school system as a reason to live here. Does it really take a Fairfax teacher to teach a 10-year-old how to add and subtract? At some point the good schools stat becomes important, but I would argue that it's around high school. So if your kids are in kindergarten, and you don't plan on living here 'til they're in high school, schools are irrelevant. As long as they're safe schools, Mom and Dad making a kid do his homework and talking to his teachers is just as good as paying twice as much for a home here as opposed to, say, the Carolinas or the midwest. Are the kids here twice as smart?
My wife and I are pretty introverted people but we always made friends in the Army. It is a small-pond culture, particularly on the bases in Germany. Northen Virginia is a very large pond, and we have made about zero friends in four months. Much of that is our fault: we have little ones, we live in a condo, and we visit our parents (1.5 hours away) every couple weekends. But the fact remains that this area does not lend itself to making friends. My colleagues are spread from D.C. to Leesburg. We have very little in common with our neighbors, who are mostly single, retired, or foreign-born (sling your "racist" replies here, and then go out for Starbucks with your other yuppie friends).
A person who was truly happy would not rip someone and stoop to name-calling, Hokie. If you love this area, good for you. I understand your getting upset about someone trashing the area you love, but personal attacks are wrong.
There aren't a lot of nice people in the immediate DC area, I'm afraid. And as jmarkd said, maybe the best we can hope for is people who are indifferent. It's very sad.
Not to sound like a broken record, but the farther you get away from DC (i.e. towards Leesburg in VA, or Frederick or Annapolis in MD) the nicer people get. I lived in Rockville for over a year in a large condo community. Number of neighbors met: 0. After living in Crownsville, MD for a few weeks I had met every surrounding neighbor, been invited to a BBQ, found a great local bar which I am now a regular at, and took my neighbor's kids out on his boat.
I agree with you guys about the people seeming unfriendly. Wish it weren't so. Long ago, I read about studies done with lab rats. The more rats they crowded into the study area or maze box, the more aggressive and territorial the rats became. I think it works the same with people. The crowding in the DC area, be it on sidewalks, highways or subways, make some people react in strongly un-social ways. Glad it ain't that way here in Colorado, what a great place.
My own personal opinion is that people in the DC area are horrible. It's the highest concentration of arrogant, rude, uptight, humorless, and inconsiderate people I've ever seen, and I've lived in a quite a few different places. People in DC are very well-educated. They are book-smart, but they seem to be socially stunted and lack manners and common decency. Harsh generalizations, but culled from my having grown up in the area.
My own personal opinion is that people in the DC area are horrible. It's the highest concentration of arrogant, rude, uptight, humorless, and inconsiderate people I've ever seen, and I've lived in a quite a few different places. People in DC are very well-educated. They are book-smart, but they seem to be socially stunted and lack manners and common decency. Harsh generalizations, but culled from my having grown up in the area.
^Bingo. One of the reasons I wanted to live here was the book-smart population; the socially stunted were a bit of a disappointing surprise.
I'd *like* to leave, but we're apparently stuck for a while (and actually might be buying a home). We've been here for two and a half years, and though I have acquaintances, can't really say that I have "friends." You know, people you can call at 3am if you need something. Or just gal pals to hang out with. Here, it seems no one will commit to an activity or outing, and if they do, they cancel or don't show. Okay, so maybe it's me? I don't think so, as we moved from Florida where we had tons of friends who were interested in doing things together. I've always made friends very easily. We entertained a lot, were invited out/to others' homes, etc. I've read that DC people make their friends through work, but I also think that's true in most places. My first job here was with a very small non-profit where everyone except for one coworker was much older than I. We never did anything socially, and I think part of the reason was that they lived from Annapolis to West Virginia. I was the only one who lived in the District. My current job is a bit better in that there are more people, and more near my age who live closer in, but they (and others I've met) seem to be "tapped out" on friends. Sometimes it feels like people already have their "circle" and there isn't room for anyone new. I don't understand that, as I've always enjoyed meeting new people and gaining new friends. So beyond work, how do you meet people here? Things just seem so closed and cold to me.
Funny this topic came up--today I decided to say "good morning" to every person I came in contact with on the way into the office. Every single one of them responded with a smile and a 'mornin'--until I got on the bus. A woman sat down next to me, I said "good morning," and she looked at me as if I have three heads. I guess one outta ten ain't bad, but it doesn't make for a pleasant way to start the day. Poo.
Yep, that was my experience. I worked for the Army for 30 years in the area of Northern VA, i.e., Falls Church/Skyline area, Crystal City, Fairfax, Annandale and the Pentagon. Of all the many hundreds of people I worked with over the years, I was only at the homes of 2 co-workers in all that time. At the end of the work day, people dispersed to all sorts of areas across the region. With traffic so bad, everyone hit the road asap to fight their way home. The closest you got to people after work was at happy hour.
We tended to make more friends at our local beer stube, where people let their hair down a bit, relaxed, put their work personna's on the shelf and were more social and real.
FWIW: I did a term paper many years ago....and found that even in social research back in the 1950's, most people avoided entangling alliances (i.e., personal "affairs") where they worked or lived and instead found their dates and partners in safer settings - places where they weren't known and could stay unknown. The point also was that if an affair goes bad at the office you worked in, or the apartment house you lived in, there was little way to get away from the other person. It also cut way down on office gossip, which could ruin your reputation and career chances. Thus in the studies I read, people remained just employees at work and sought fulfillment elsewhere. I think a lot of that is still valid. I've seen a lot of people at work get involved with each other, but those tended to be more promiscious persons, everyone else was more discreet, their personal lives were lived in relative obscurity from the office crowd. It's probably for the better. Like politicians, good careers seem to be lived solely in a professional realm, with the personal/private aspects best left out of the work or professional environment. Unknown equals unsullied.
summertime24, I've lived in both San Diego and the DC metro area, so wanted to chime in to this thread.
I love San Diego so much that the first time I moved away, it became my sole goal in life to move back, which I did 4 years later. I now live in northern VA and commute to DC (not a fun commute, but the job and pay make it worth it).
Why did I leave San Diego, not once but twice? Mostly for financial reasons, since it's so freakin expensive to live there AND difficult to find a decent paying job. Also, traffic in San Diego is NO BETTER than traffic in the DC metro area. Don't believe anyone who tells you it is.
Why did I move to DC? Sure, it was job-related. I didn't choose it, it chose me. However, once I got here I realized that the people and lifestyle here are SO MUCH MORE friendly and down-to-earth than what I had found in San Diego. Don't get me wrong, I still love San Diego and visit every chance I get. However, I won't live there again. In Northern VA/DC it's possible to actually connect and make friends with people - in San Diego I came to find that I had only made acquaintances - and this after 6 years of living there.
I've been in the DC area for 3 years now, and love it. The job market here is the best in the country, and the cultural aspect of it is fantastic. I've been to more plays, museums, concerts, festivals, etc. here than I ever would have or could have attended in SoCal. Maybe the beach is a draw - but honestly, I rarely if ever went to the beach. It was more like something in the background that you drove by on your way home from somewhere else. Although beautiful to be sure, and I definitely miss seeing it. On the plus side, the Eastern Shore is also beautiful, and much less commercial than SoCal.
What I really DO miss is the proximity to Mexico and the Mexican food. There is no authentic Mexican food in DC. Sad.
Good luck with your move - if you do wind up in San Diego, your best bet for avoiding horrible traffic is to live closer to downtown - like Mission Valley, University Heights, Normal Heights, Kensington. Keep in mind no area is cheap. And traffic is horrendous if you have to commute from East or North County.
Yep, that was my experience. I worked for the Army for 30 years in the area of Northern VA, i.e., Falls Church/Skyline area, Crystal City, Fairfax, Annandale and the Pentagon. Of all the many hundreds of people I worked with over the years, I was only at the homes of 2 co-workers in all that time. At the end of the work day, people dispersed to all sorts of areas across the region. With traffic so bad, everyone hit the road asap to fight their way home. The closest you got to people after work was at happy hour.
I tend to do the same. I don't know if it's a byproduct of growing up in the DC area or, more likely than not, a personality quirk of mine, but in general, I do not like socializing with work people outside of work. I like to keep my work life separate from my home life and social life so even though I get along well with people and we may joke around and have a friendly relationship at work, it stays within those confines because once I leave work for the day, I don't want any reminders of it; and that includes the people, as nice as they may be. If someone from work were to invite me out with them or over to their place, truthfully, I'd be hesitant to say yes, but most likely would because I'm cursed with good manners. However, that's never happened and I doubt that it will.
Net net is you make your life what it is, and move on when the itch and irks distract you to the nth degree. Embrace change, it's what's good on ya! Sucks when best laid plans don't work out, and it's not really as a result of your doings (or not doings).
My folks have lived in Alexandria for many years off and on (due to military orders here and there), and I also lived in the region for 13 years post-college (this is the early 80s-early 90s). Too much traffic and I hate visiting my folks now because my road rage is tickled sick as I approach Fredericksburg, yes that far away (so sad it starts so soon). But if you can rely on Metro (buses/subway) for work commuting, you can avoid alot of traffic, but still the evening and weekend traffic is disconcerting. Or be a slugger (only good for work)! I was one of the 70 hour worker types, back then, not anymore, and all my friends, to be, were initially coworkers.
I think the area is a huge melting pot too, with large numbers of bad drivers being "imported" daily! ;o) And I used to drive into lower Manhattan from Danbury, CT -- leaving the Wall&Broad area on a Friday 'round 5pm teaches you to succumb to patience. But DC is consistently worse IMO. And it's only getting worse. If I returned to the D.C. area, I'd plan to live and work, and play, in the city, D.C., and rely predominantly on my bicycle and Metro to get around. And if I couldn't, I wouldn't return.
In hindsight, it seems I used the D.C. area as a springboard to have more freedom in my life. You put up with long hours, long commutes, unfathomable surburban expansion, with roads being expandid only to become bottlenecks, again, far sooner than anyone in the planning department imagined! Yet, I imagine many others in the area see it as their springboard too. Putting up with some forms of "self-sacrifice".
Unless you have roots in the area, or need the uber-awesome paying job, with the uber-long hours to boot, to help you max out your lifestyle/spending limits, there are far better, less stressful living options in this country. I've lived in the Phoenix area, Milwaukee region, Fairfield, CT, Philly region, and spent extensive work time in Raleigh, Austin, NYC, LA over the years. Even San Diego. And I loved San Diego too. Now if I can only get their time zone changed to eastern!
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Let me weigh in
