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Just by that last sentence, it shows you know nothing but just what the liberal media have brainwashed you.
Almost half the country do not pay any income taxes. The other half with the wealthy paying the largest share, pay all the taxes that keeps this country going. The Right is not taking anyone’s taxes and giving it to the rich. The rich (and the middle class) is literally giving taxes to support everyone else.
If you take out the rich, this country will literally collapse, like Venezuela. Do you even know what is happening in Venezuela?
The same way the country would collapse without the rich, it would collapse without the other 99% as well. Why? The rich are not the only thing holding the economy together, it's an argument fail to suggest otherwise. Without the consumers purchasing goods and the middle/poor class labor market you have no economy.
I love how you group the rich and middle class into one when the top 1% (not middle-class) control the overwhelming majority of the country's wealth. Of course the rich and middle class together pay the largest share, that's 2/3rds of the wealth classes! 'Everyone else' would just be poor/poverty-stricken class. What kind of point is that?
I hope you're not suggesting that Venezuela is collapsing because the rich vacated (do YOU know what's actually happening in Venezuela is the real question). There are so many reasons that place went to hell it could be it's own thread (I'm sure it is in the politics/controversies section).
If my view is racist so be it. I am just calling it the way I see it.
You are just making up excuses and being an apologist for black Americans. Plenty of non-whites, particularly Asians, who BTW come here with very little and barely able to speak the language but have made themselves better through hardwork and education so much with nary a complaint about racism or the racist system. They in fact get discriminated (like Ivy League and elite West Coast colleges purposely putting a limit on their enrollment because there are too many overqualified Asian candidates and acceptingthe less qualified blacks for “diversity” purposes) more but rarely do anything about it but just go on with their lives quietly.
Meanwhile, you have the black American community that have become experts at whining about everything (just the other day, I saw that they were in front of a school protesting to have a teacher fired because she wanted to teach students about slavery) and literally society immediately caves into their demands and gives them all types of programs and assistance (to fight racism). They know how to use the race card very well.
You can try to come up with all the supposedly racist programs from 70 years ago but for many decades now, the inner cities have been the recipients of the most generous government handouts and assistance in the country and yet because of those residents and their failed leadership, they are still lousy.
If other model minority groups (like the Asians I talked about) had even gotten 1/1000th of the help the black Anericans have gotten, they’d certainly would have done a whole lot more with it, than turning cities (or their parts of it) like Detroit, Camden, St. Louis, Newark, JC, Passaic, Paterson, Trenton, Hartford, Cleveland, Philly, NYC, Chicago, Memphis, New Orleans, Baltimore, Oakland CA, South Central LA, etc. into the most dangerous, crime ridden, decaying hellholes in the country.
You not only seem to think that black Americans exist only in the inner cities, but you also seem to think that none have been/are/can be successful.
I guess with the above post I am somehow grouped into this black American community, yet I have always worked for mine; never expected anything other than what I've worked for; yes, I have complained about my situation; yes, I improved it; other than 1 year of receiving unemployment a little over 10 years ago (upon return of deployment and going to college), I've never taken a handout.
But, according to your logic, I shouldn't exist. That's why generalizations usually only work to serve poor arguments.
This whole post make me think of that Sopranos episode where Tony takes AJ to the old "hood" where he grew up which is now a cesspool.
AJ asks why were things so much better back then, and Tony tells him "because people gave a S***t.
That being said places like Newark, Patterson, etc... were beginning to decline post (if not a bit before )WWII as industrialization began to pack up and leave the north east for south or elsewhere. By the 1960's you had changing immigration patterns then race riots, the rest as they say is history.
It is telling that across the river you had large parts of NYC in the 1970's going well into the 1990's that weren't that much better than say Newark or Jersey City. But now look at Far West Side, Williamsburg, Bushwick, Greenpoint, and so forth. Even the Bronx is cleaning up nicely.
It all comes down to political will and a plan. Vast sums have been handed to those running Newark et al, and some how; some how nothing ever changes. Corey Booker came in with all his la-di-da talk, and in the end nothing changed much.
Only way to clean up these places would be go in there with some sort of urban renewal scheme that allowed for eminent domain. Clear the places out and start from scratch.
Keep in mind, JC has definitely cleaned up much the way Brooklyn has and the Bronx is starting to. JC's waterfront is some of the hottest real estate in the metro right now. Newark is certainly cleaning up downtown and some parts of the outer wards (many affluent blacks, non-whites, as well as whites are moving into the new residences downtown).
The same way the country would collapse without the rich, it would collapse without the other 99% as well. Why? The rich are not the only thing holding the economy together, it's an argument fail to suggest otherwise. Without the consumers purchasing goods and the middle/poor class labor market you have no economy.
I love how you group the rich and middle class into one when the top 1% (not middle-class) control the overwhelming majority of the country's wealth. Of course the rich and middle class together pay the largest share, that's 2/3rds of the wealth classes! 'Everyone else' would just be poor/poverty-stricken class. What kind of point is that?
I hope you're not suggesting that Venezuela is collapsing because the rich vacated (do YOU know what's actually happening in Venezuela is the real question). There are so many reasons that place went to hell it could be it's own thread (I'm sure it is in the politics/controversies section).
LOL. There are no shortages of consumers. Meanwhile, the producers can stop producing. When that happens, you have Venezuela. Can you live without clothes, shoes, cars, bread, apples and computers? I didn’t think so. In other words, people cannot just stop buying.
And there have never been a time in human civilization was there ever no “middle/poor class labor market.”
Last edited by antinimby; 03-05-2018 at 08:05 AM..
You not only seem to think that black Americans exist only in the inner cities, but you also seem to think that none have been/are/can be successful.
I guess with the above post I am somehow grouped into this black American community, yet I have always worked for mine; never expected anything other than what I've worked for; yes, I have complained about my situation; yes, I improved it; other than 1 year of receiving unemployment a little over 10 years ago (upon return of deployment and going to college), I've never taken a handout.
But, according to your logic, I shouldn't exist. That's why generalizations usually only work to serve poor arguments.
Umm, this thread is about the inner cities and the blacks that make up those places. If they were successful, none of the ghettos would be ghettos. And yes, we all know there are successful blacks, quite a few actually are billionaires but that actually proves my point: there is no disadvantages for blacks anymore. The other Leftist poster was trying to make the slavery and discrimination excuse.
And if you are working and paying through your own, then no I am not grouping you in with “the black community.” That’s where the false narrative from the other poster came from. My beef is not with all black Americans, just the ones that contribute nothing but strife while taking from the public. This thread is about the differences between the well off communities and the ghettos. I am addressing the ghetto part of it. If you are not part of that community, regardless if you are black, I am not talking about you.
LOL. There are no shortages of consumers. Meanwhile, the producers can stop producing. When that happens, you have Venezuela. Can you live without clothes, shoes, cars, bread, apples and computers? I didn’t think so. In other words, people cannot just stop buying.
And there have never been a time in human civilization was there ever no “middle/poor class labor market.”
I could take your quote and replace everything pertaining to middle/poor and to rich and the same thing would apply. If the rich wants to stay rich, they have to produce (or risk falling to one of the other two classes).
And truth be told, human civilization CAN live without those things. You have to buy those things in the to maintain a level of comfort in the modern life, but we don't actually need them. When those things are removed don't underestimate the the human mind's ability to revert back to a prior generation's level of comfort.
Quote:
Originally Posted by antinimby
Umm, this thread is about the inner cities and the blacks that make up those places. If they were successful, none of the ghettos would be ghettos. And yes, we all know there are successful blacks, quite a few actually are billionaires but that actually proves my point: there is no disadvantages for blacks anymore. The other Leftist poster was trying to make the slavery and discrimination excuse.
And if you are working and paying through your own, then no I am not grouping you in with “the black community.” That’s where the false narrative from the other poster came from. My beef is not with all black Americans, just the ones that contribute nothing but strife while taking from the public. This thread is about the differences between the well off communities and the ghettos. I am addressing the ghetto part of it. If you are not part of that community, regardless if you are black, I am not talking about you.
The thread was about the OP's wonder why he/she felt NJ looked third and first world. You specifically took that to inner cities and blacks on your own.
But regarding that is where we disagree. Because you don't think there are disadvantages, when I think there are (and I'm not even talking about just blacks now). It is simply harder for someone living in these areas to succeed than it would be for someone who doesn't. I'll never say that's an excuse, but it is still reality. Discrimination? While not as hardcore as 40-60's, is alive and well. I've experienced it and I've certainly had folks using similar language telling me that I didn't. Did it stop me? No. But that didn't stop it from happening.
Last edited by 66nexus; 03-05-2018 at 08:38 AM..
Reason: grammar
I could take your quote and replace everything pertaining to middle/poor and to rich and the same thing would apply. If the rich wants to stay rich, they have to produce (or risk falling to one of the other two classes).
And truth be told, human civilization CAN live without those things. You have to buy those things in the to maintain a level of comfort in the modern life, but we don't actually need them. When those things are removed don't underestimate the the human mind's ability to revert back to a prior generation's level of comfort.
So then you agree that your point that somehow the poor labor class is critical is not true.
And you are nuts if human civilization can live without food, clothing and shelter. There will be no civilization without those things.
Quote:
The thread was about the OP's wonder why he/she felt NJ looked third and first world. You specifically took that to inner cities and blacks on your own.
And I am answering that question by explaining the reason for that, i.e. the residents living there made it that way.
Quote:
But regarding that is where we disagree. Because you don't think there are disadvantages, when I think there are (and I'm not even talking about just blacks now). It is simply harder for someone living in these areas to succeed than it would be for someone who doesn't. I'll never say that's an excuse, but it is still reality. Discrimination? While not as hardcore as 40-60's, is alive and well. I've experienced it and I've certainly had folks using similar language telling me that I didn't. Did it stop me? No. But that didn't stop it from happening.
Let’s see...all across the country we have black governors, black mayors, black senators, black representatives, black councilmans, we even had a black president. In the past, the apologists said there wasn’t black leaders. Okay fine. You got your leaders now. Nothing's changed. Then it was because there are not enough black representatives in the media. Fine. Now there are black TV anchors everywhere, black stars, black producers, blacks in every facet. Nothing’s changed. Recently, it was statues’ fault. Then cities and towns across the country removed the statues. Of course nothing’s changed. Society just keeps on bowing down to the black’s demands but yet the ghetto will still be ghetto and decades and decades from now nothing will change.
It’s time for some folks to stop blaming everything and everyone else except themselves. If you are defending it, then you are only going to continue it.
Stop with the great grand father BS. What is stopping the ghetto blacks, some dealing drugs that make more money than many legitimate businesses from teaching their children to behave, study, and start businesses? (Like that would ever happen. More like let them run around, have children with multiple baby mamas/daddies, sign up for free housing, free healthcare, foodstamps, welfare, free college, etc.).
God nows there are endless programs designed to help inner cities now that the rest of us wouldn’t get (and ironically, paid for by the succker middle class and upper classes with our ever skyhigh taxes no less).
You are nothing but apologists. That’s okay. 50 years from now, and 100 years from now, the same ghetto people will still be doing their ghetto thing and it was because they did not have some cash like your great grand father did.
I'm sure you don't want a real answer to your question, but what is stopping them is that most of them are clueless that there is another way to live. You are going by what you know and your experience and applying it to other people.
The people you are talking about haven't the foggiest idea how to behave, study, and start businesses. They don't even see that as an option. It would never cross their minds.
I was reading an article once by a social worker who said people want to know why young girls in the ghetto continue to get pregnant as teens. They don't see college or a career as even applicable to them. That's something other people do. To them, having a baby means you are an adult. Many of them also have no concept that you can say no to a guy who wants to have sex with you. He's your "man". That's what you do.
I saw a young man interviewed when they were tearing up Milwaukee in the ghetto last year who said he had come to witness the goings-on with his mother. He said the problem was that "White people have all the money and they're not trying to give us any." My first reaction was to want to punch him in the face for being stupid. My second reaction was to want to punch his mother for raising a stupid son.
But then you have to realize that this is generational, and until it clicks in somebody's head that what they believe to be true might not in fact be true, this is the framework in which they operate.
Remember the saying "You can't escape from a dungeon until you realize you are in one?" I think that's where these people are.
Now, there ARE people who get out of that mess. I've known quite a few professional black people who came up out of the dregs. One long-time coworker and friend is a woman who grew up in Newark. The sheriff would come and evict them, and her mother would wait until after dark when she knew nobody would be coming back to her neighborhood, pull out her cutter tool from under her coat, and cut the lock off the door and go back in.
But that mother also volunteered as a teacher's aide in the school and got her kids into every extra program that was offered. They all went to college and with the exception of one out of six who got into drugs and trouble, left Newark and became productive adults with careers who own homes in the suburbs.
Without that, without the belief that there is another way, with hanging on to that belief that someone else is deliberately keeping you down, they will stay where they are.
And you DO see this mentality among poor white people, too.
Keep in mind, JC has definitely cleaned up much the way Brooklyn has and the Bronx is starting to. JC's waterfront is some of the hottest real estate in the metro right now. Newark is certainly cleaning up downtown and some parts of the outer wards (many affluent blacks, non-whites, as well as whites are moving into the new residences downtown).
True, but N 15th St, East Orange (location where Tony takes AJ) remains pretty much a hell hole.
I'm sure you don't want a real answer to your question, but what is stopping them is that most of them are clueless that there is another way to live. You are going by what you know and your experience and applying it to other people.
The people you are talking about haven't the foggiest idea how to behave, study, and start businesses. They don't even see that as an option. It would never cross their minds.
I was reading an article once by a social worker who said people want to know why young girls in the ghetto continue to get pregnant as teens. They don't see college or a career as even applicable to them. That's something other people do. To them, having a baby means you are an adult. Many of them also have no concept that you can say no to a guy who wants to have sex with you. He's your "man". That's what you do.
I saw a young man interviewed when they were tearing up Milwaukee in the ghetto last year who said he had come to witness the goings-on with his mother. He said the problem was that "White people have all the money and they're not trying to give us any." My first reaction was to want to punch him in the face for being stupid. My second reaction was to want to punch his mother for raising a stupid son.
But then you have to realize that this is generational, and until it clicks in somebody's head that what they believe to be true might not in fact be true, this is the framework in which they operate.
Remember the saying "You can't escape from a dungeon until you realize you are in one?" I think that's where these people are.
Now, there ARE people who get out of that mess. I've known quite a few professional black people who came up out of the dregs. One long-time coworker and friend is a woman who grew up in Newark. The sheriff would come and evict them, and her mother would wait until after dark when she knew nobody would be coming back to her neighborhood, pull out her cutter tool from under her coat, and cut the lock off the door and go back in.
But that mother also volunteered as a teacher's aide in the school and got her kids into every extra program that was offered. They all went to college and with the exception of one out of six who got into drugs and trouble, left Newark and became productive adults with careers who own homes in the suburbs.
Without that, without the belief that there is another way, with hanging on to that belief that someone else is deliberately keeping you down, they will stay where they are.
And you DO see this mentality among poor white people, too.
Yup and the Left will ignore that root cause and instead blame it on their usual racism/slavery easy excuse and come up with more publicly funded programs to support that mentality, and in the process just perpetuating the cultural poverty.
But according to homenj, I am a racist for pointing out the truth. Okay, whatever.
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