New York court of appeals orders new congressional districts (Gerry: school, party)
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
It happened in Ohio with virtually the exact same language in their state constitution so the well they did it so less do it to wouldn't completely surprise me. With that said, I would still expect a gerrymander, though a less aggressive one than what was tried in 2022
Agreed they don't need to do a blatant ridiculous map either (like combining parts of westchester and the north shore of LI. They can be much smarter about it and still get a big advantage
It really is a shame how the cycle continues... we need to stop being OK with it when it's our team, always the excuse that the other side does it... there is no way NC should be a super majority state, but it's cheered on and "good"... NY shouldn't be a super majority state either... any casual observer can see how ridiculous the districts are drawn when they get to be like 1 street wide for miles... there's no way it passes even a casual sniff test.
I only see this getting worse... what used to take weeks now takes minutes with the AI engines.
It really is a shame how the cycle continues... we need to stop being OK with it when it's our team, always the excuse that the other side does it... there is no way NC should be a super majority state, but it's cheered on and "good"... NY shouldn't be a super majority state either... any casual observer can see how ridiculous the districts are drawn when they get to be like 1 street wide for miles... there's no way it passes even a casual sniff test.
I only see this getting worse... what used to take weeks now takes minutes with the AI engines.
I don’t think gerrymandering is going anywhere, it’s so ingrained in our system and the federal courts basically said it’s fine (as long as it’s not racial) in that landmark case years ago.. Even in states where it’s not legal (like ny and Ohio)they still make it happen.
I don’t think gerrymandering is going anywhere, it’s so ingrained in our system and the federal courts basically said it’s fine (as long as it’s not racial) in that landmark case years ago.. Even in states where it’s not legal (like ny and Ohio)they still make it happen.
FWIW, in this case the courts didn't technically rule that gerrymandering was fine. The court ruled that the lines drawn by the Special Master were temporary and new lines should be drawn by the Independent Redistricting Commission. Now of course the whole reason we got here in the first place is Democrats didn't really cooperate and skirted around the IRC last time around, which led to them drawing districts themselves (which is literally the exact thing Republicans in Ohio did).
Now of course they will likely do that again.
It's more of a matter of how aggressive they will get.
FWIW, in this case the courts didn't technically rule that gerrymandering was fine. The court ruled that the lines drawn by the Special Master were temporary and new lines should be drawn by the Independent Redistricting Commission. Now of course the whole reason we got here in the first place is Democrats didn't really cooperate and skirted around the IRC last time around, which led to them drawing districts themselves (which is literally the exact thing Republicans in Ohio did).
Now of course they will likely do that again.
It's more of a matter of how aggressive they will get.
I actually was referring to that Federal case several years ago (I believe it was over an NC map) where they essentially ruled that the Federal courts should no longer get involved in gerrymandering cases unless it’s blatantly racial. But you are of course correct about the recent decision by the NYS court of appeals
I actually was referring to that Federal case several years ago (I believe it was over an NC map) where they essentially ruled that the Federal courts should no longer get involved in gerrymandering cases unless it’s blatantly racial. But you are of course correct about the recent decision by the NYS court of appeals
Ahh yes you are correct with the federal court gerrymandering ruling in the North Carolina case. In 2017 North Carolina had its maps thrown out as a racial gerrymander. The maps were then challenged again in federal court in 2019 as a partisan gerrymander and the court ruled that the federal court had no jurisdiction on political gerrymander. A similar lawsuit in state court then did overturn the maps later in 2019. Then after redistricting the state court threw out the initial maps for 2022.
Adding to the point, the four states (and five cases) in which the maps were ruled Unconstitutional heading into 2022 for political gerrymandering were all in state courts and not federal (New York, Maryland, North Carolina and Ohio twice).
Ahh yes you are correct with the federal court gerrymandering ruling in the North Carolina case. In 2017 North Carolina had its maps thrown out as a racial gerrymander. The maps were then challenged again in federal court in 2019 as a partisan gerrymander and the court ruled that the federal court had no jurisdiction on political gerrymander. A similar lawsuit in state court then did overturn the maps later in 2019. Then after redistricting the state court threw out the initial maps for 2022.
Adding to the point, the four states (and five cases) in which the maps were ruled Unconstitutional heading into 2022 for political gerrymandering were all in state courts and not federal (New York, Maryland, North Carolina and Ohio twice).
Yep well that makes sense since the federal courts ruled that they have no say over political gerrymandering it’s up to state courts and each states individual laws on the issue.
I don’t think gerrymandering is going anywhere, it’s so ingrained in our system and the federal courts basically said it’s fine (as long as it’s not racial) in that landmark case years ago.. Even in states where it’s not legal (like ny and Ohio)they still make it happen.
Sadly I agree... I was just tilting windmills that we could find our way... both sides are equally culpable and we let them get away with it.
It simply boils down to misrepresentation... the state governments do NOT represent the people the way that any reasonable person would argue... when they use the gerrymandering to a get super majority hobbling the governor from veto powers, that's the bridge too far IMO... without any checks and balances, it goes against everything that democracy was supposed to stand for.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smash255
Ahh yes you are correct with the federal court gerrymandering ruling in the North Carolina case. In 2017 North Carolina had its maps thrown out as a racial gerrymander. The maps were then challenged again in federal court in 2019 as a partisan gerrymander and the court ruled that the federal court had no jurisdiction on political gerrymander. A similar lawsuit in state court then did overturn the maps later in 2019. Then after redistricting the state court threw out the initial maps for 2022.
Adding to the point, the four states (and five cases) in which the maps were ruled Unconstitutional heading into 2022 for political gerrymandering were all in state courts and not federal (New York, Maryland, North Carolina and Ohio twice).
NC is a good example of how these legislatures can go too far abusing the super majority... when they pass laws that essentially rob the governor of powers, simply because it is the other party, we all should take notice... none of that would happen without gerrymandering to improperly balance the legislature.
Sadly I agree... I was just tilting windmills that we could find our way... both sides are equally culpable and we let them get away with it.
It simply boils down to misrepresentation... the state governments do NOT represent the people the way that any reasonable person would argue... when they use the gerrymandering to a get super majority hobbling the governor from veto powers, that's the bridge too far IMO... without any checks and balances, it goes against everything that democracy was supposed to stand for.
NC is a good example of how these legislatures can go too far abusing the super majority... when they pass laws that essentially rob the governor of powers, simply because it is the other party, we all should take notice... none of that would happen without gerrymandering to improperly balance the legislature.
Funny you mention lots written about this subject lately. I believe there are a record number of state super majorities now in red and blue states
Yup, couple factors behind this
1. Across the board there is more partisanship. You have more solid blue and red states than previously and less split ticket voting. In 2020 there were 16 Congressional Districts that went to one party for President and the other for the House, this was a record low. Even without Gerrymandering we would likely see an uptick in this.
2. Gerrymandering, this is nothing new, but in part due to increase in partisanship as well as just technology it is even easier to gerrymander. ln some cases like New York or Alabama it makes a state that would be solidly one way or the other even that much stronger. In other cases like North Carolina it makes a state that is very close to a 50/50 state very solid for one side.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
