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I hate to say...I told you so....but I told you so
The blind will always be blind until they remove their blinders. Like Jesus said (paraphrase) if they won't accept it, shake the dust off your feet and move on.
You appear to be right, Christy. Oh well, on the advice of God, I will let it go. What do I mean by "on the advice of God"? Well, I had prepared a long remark disparaging paul and even accusing him of a few dishonest things and just as I was about to post, my computer crashed. That's never happened to me before. How's that for timing? I've learned from experience that when strange, inexplicable things like that happen, it's not a coincidence. God was telling me, "Let it go, Thrill." So I will obey.
Since you're a little confused about the futurist view you espouse, let me clear some things up for you.
Hades has not been cleared out yet...this happens at the resurrection when Christ returns...in your view you not only don't go to heaven you also do not have your salvation yet...you are still waiting for Christ's sacrifice to be accepted.
By the way, I think I am confused as to what you're trying to convey here. Are you saying that this is what you believe, that Christ will come again and at that time there will be a mass resurrection? I didn't think that's what full preterists believed. (It'd probably be helpful to me if you could lay out for me what exactly you do believe, since I'm obviously sketchy on that.) Or are you saying that this is what I MUST believe if I do not subscribe to preterists beliefs? In which case, hopefully I've cleared that up for you.
By the way, I think I am confused as to what you're trying to convey here. Are you saying that this is what you believe, that Christ will come again and at that time there will be a mass resurrection? I didn't think that's what full preterists believed. (It'd probably be helpful to me if you could lay out for me what exactly you do believe, since I'm obviously sketchy on that.) Or are you saying that this is what I MUST believe if I do not subscribe to preterists beliefs? In which case, hopefully I've cleared that up for you.
I am a Full Preterist and all prophecy is in the past. I would never tell anyone what they should and should not believe...I just try to clear up understanding when they try to mix two views that can't be mixed. I've seen some pretty crazy views on this forum....it's always give me a pretty good chuckle to see the nutty stuff some people say comes from the Bible.
You appear to be right, Christy. Oh well, on the advice of God, I will let it go. What do I mean by "on the advice of God"? Well, I had prepared a long remark disparaging paul and even accusing him of a few dishonest things and just as I was about to post, my computer crashed. That's never happened to me before. How's that for timing? I've learned from experience that when strange, inexplicable things like that happen, it's not a coincidence. God was telling me, "Let it go, Thrill." So I will obey.
I am a Full Preterist and all prophecy is in the past. I would never tell anyone what they should and should not believe...I just try to clear up understanding when they try to mix two views that can't be mixed. I've seen some pretty crazy views on this forum....it's always give me a pretty good chuckle to see the nutty stuff some people say comes from the Bible.
So, again, would you mind clarifying exactly what you do believe about the resurrection, then? You say it has already happened, over and done with for all people? Do you believe there is time for future judgment or that it has already happened? I've always been curious about preterist beliefs but have never been able to comprehend them. Perhaps you'd be willing to help.
I am a Full Preterist and all prophecy is in the past. I would never tell anyone what they should and should not believe...I just try to clear up understanding when they try to mix two views that can't be mixed. I've seen some pretty crazy views on this forum....it's always give me a pretty good chuckle to see the nutty stuff some people say comes from the Bible.
By the way, I'm assuming you're not calling my response to your inital post to me nutty. But if you are, perhaps you could also explain what about it you find chuckle-worthy.
So, again, would you mind clarifying exactly what you do believe about the resurrection, then? You say it has already happened, over and done with for all people? Do you believe there is time for future judgment or that it has already happened? I've always been curious about preterist beliefs but have never been able to comprehend them. Perhaps you'd be willing to help.
There is no future judgment. The judgment that was spoken of in the NT was directed towards the unbelieving Jews...they filled up their cup when they crucified Christ. The knew the time and season when the Messiah was to arrive and they blew it. The return of Christ in judgment came in the first century in the form of the Roman Army when they destroyed Jerusalem and the temple. The cleaning out of Hades occurred at that time (the resurrection) and now when we die we go straight to be with the Lord...Paul could make this claim because he understood that this all would happen in his generation. The resurrection that is spoken of in the bible is the resurrection of the dead not the physical body...this is where a lot of confusion ensues with those who want to take everything literally. Believer are resurrected to new life at the time of our rebirth...it is not a physical resurrection, it is a spiritual resurrection from spiritual death to life in Christ. Those who had died prior to Christ were asleep in the grave and their spirits were resurrected, not their physical bodies, at that time and Hades was cleaned out. They were judged at that time and those not found written in the book had to endure the second death (lake of fire) where all the sin and impurity that is left in them will be destroyed and they can then enter into the presence of the Lord. There are those who say this is hell...but as we can clearly see from scripture, you can't throw hell into hell. The Lake of Fire is the second death where we crucify and kill our carnal nature, the sin in us. Believers do this while living for we all will be salted with fire. We, the church are the bride, we are the New Jerusalem, we are the leaves that are for the healing of the nations to show them Christ. That is why the door is always open in the city for whosoever...
If people would quit read the book we have been given by God like it was written expressly to them in the 21st century...they would find the meaning of it all. You have to have an understanding of how the Jews spoke in that day to fully comprehend what you're reading.
The book was written in the 1st century, all the events contained in the book applied to the 1st century people...when you remove the relevant audience out of the picture, it makes sense for no one...which is why there is so much conjecture and speculation about what it says.
That's just a small rundown....there is so much more I could say but I wouldn't have enough room here.
There is no future judgment. The judgment that was spoken of in the NT was directed towards the unbelieving Jews...they filled up their cup when they crucified Christ. The knew the time and season when the Messiah was to arrive and they blew it. The return of Christ in judgment came in the first century in the form of the Roman Army when they destroyed Jerusalem and the temple. The cleaning out of Hades occurred at that time (the resurrection) and now when we die we go straight to be with the Lord...Paul could make this claim because he understood that this all would happen in his generation. The resurrection that is spoken of in the bible is the resurrection of the dead not the physical body...this is where a lot of confusion ensues with those who want to take everything literally. Believer are resurrected to new life at the time of our rebirth...it is not a physical resurrection, it is a spiritual resurrection from spiritual death to life in Christ. Those who had died prior to Christ were asleep in the grave and their spirits were resurrected, not their physical bodies, at that time and Hades was cleaned out. They were judged at that time and those not found written in the book had to endure the second death (lake of fire) where all the sin and impurity that is left in them will be destroyed and they can then enter into the presence of the Lord. There are those who say this is hell...but as we can clearly see from scripture, you can't throw hell into hell. The Lake of Fire is the second death where we crucify and kill our carnal nature, the sin in us. Believers do this while living for we all will be salted with fire. We, the church are the bride, we are the New Jerusalem, we are the leaves that are for the healing of the nations to show them Christ. That is why the door is always open in the city for whosoever...
If people would quit read the book we have been given by God like it was written expressly to them in the 21st century...they would find the meaning of it all. You have to have an understanding of how the Jews spoke in that day to fully comprehend what you're reading.
The book was written in the 1st century, all the events contained in the book applied to the 1st century people...when you remove the relevant audience out of the picture, it makes sense for no one...which is why there is so much conjecture and speculation about what it says.
That's just a small rundown....there is so much more I could say but I wouldn't have enough room here.
Okay, there's some things I can find agreement with you about. Other things I'd need more clarification on but I don't have much time since we're leaving in a few minutes. One question for sure that I'd like to ask is still concerning judgment. Do you believe that those unbelievers who are physically alive now will face judgment and the Lake of Fire after their physical deaths, or do you believe that is something they are enduring in the present time? And, a second question is if you believe the Bible addresses at all what our existance will be like in the after life or not?
Why, this is so easy to understand that I don't understand why anyone wouldn't be able to understand it!
Paul knew that no matter how long it took for Jesus to come back, there would be other believers over the years, and those who would still be alive and remaining on the earth would be caught up at the second coming.
The "we" simply means "those of us who belong to Jesus" who are still on earth when it happens. It's so simple.
Just FYI Paul wrote epistles, or letters not the gospel. There was no way for him to have known these would be published. He wrote them and addressed them to a specific group of people.
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