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I have lived in Austin for going on 40 years now. In my experience, most of the Austinites that I have known very well are more Libertarian than 'lefts'. Sure, they are annoyingly vocal lefts out there, but I truly don't think most people fit that profile very closely. Will you hear them around? Yup. Will most everyone be trying to ignore them? Yup. To be honest, I think most people end up identifying as 'not Left' or 'not Right' and then creating a stereotype to represent the opposite side. There are lots of people moving here, but a surprising number are somewhat conservative leaning. The people leaving California are not necessarily the most far Left.
The defund the police movement, while very 'in the news', was never much of a real 'defund' movement as much as it was a reorganize movement. And it didn't stop really because of the governor so much as local pressure. Sure, they tried to blame their lack of 'action' on the governor, but they were reading the tea leaves and backed down regardless. Along those lines, there is a proposal for the May election to buff up civilian oversight of the police. It is, imho, a much better approach and will have to see if it fares well and, if passed, how it works going forward. Among other aspects, it would likely prevent the 'burying' of body cam video.
Along the Libertarian angle - if you are staunchly opposed to gay marriage or gay rights, you will likely find yourself uncomfortable in the area. The 'Lefts', the 'Libertarians', and a not insignificant portion of the moderate 'Rights' are anywhere from staunchly supportive to ambivalent.
I've always largely been apolitical because the previous poster is right - ultimately, my husband and I go to work to feed our family and enjoy life some, we pay bills, rinse and repeat.
I can co exist peaceably with libertarians because I'm all for live and let live.
Unfortunately extremists on both sides make life unpleasant. For example, even though I am a middle aged mother of two whose childbearing years are behind her, I feel offended that three people are being taken to court for helping their friend (who has in a toxic relationship that ended up in divorce) terminate a pregnancy. That really bothers me.
I'm overall indifferent over the 'court appearance' of the matter (as I am pro life but not entirely sure how I feel about government making laws over the matter as I don't think they are doing so to stop abortion nor do I think they really care about the matter other than to appeal to certain voting groups. At first I was against it, but the more I looked into it the more it didnt seem very unreasonable. Technically in law all of our personal rights end when the operation or safety of another person is compromised in any negligent or hostile matter, the same applied during Covid-19 mask and vaccine requirements. Technically, if law were to remain consistent in protecting human life, it would more likely dissolve to abortion being illegal rather than an option primarily when you do so knowingly taking a human life without a cause to protect yourself from physical harm or death (self defense). The issue here isnt really abortion, because the law condemns all forms of murder regardless of cause UNLESS it is self defense driven... ...but when does life begin and when do we call it 'murder' which science actually does not yet have a confirmed understanding and is still being debated.)
... The law itself aside, I'm more concerned about the principle of the matter. As for your explained scenario though:
My personal mother and father's relationship is very toxic even to this date. He cheated multiple times and she kept going back to him and even hoping for him to return. There was a brief period where she was even physically abused albeit that was short lived. Mostly he was drunk, irresponsible and very unreliable. Should I have been deprived of my right to life only because they had a bad relationship if my mother did not want to continue it while she was conceiving me? (He left her for another woman while she was pregnant with me, she was also prescribed heavy doses of prednisone to treat sarcoidosis while the doctors did not know she was pregnant. She had every reason to terminate the pregnancy and her and the doctors did consider doing just that. and trust me, she also left him multiple times but would end up returning.) Shouldn't I also have an opportunity to learn from their mistakes? Build a life, family or career based on values I model after their mistake (regardless whether I follow their foot steps or build an entirely different life) I could see the matter with alot more clarity if there wasn't another human being with a potential path involved, should someone have the right to potentially deny an opportunity for a human to exist and shape his own choices and culture?
I get the whole ordeal when a lady goes through abuse or a very bad relationship, but the child didn't have any say in the matter as to what the father did and is not inherently doomed to be molded after him either. It is spawned from him, but still exists as a seperate entity with its own destiny based on its choices.
Lastly, its becoming almost impossible to remain apolitical on many matters today as government on both sides is weeding more and more into how we live and what we experience. Even you yourself proved it, (just pointing out the irony here) when you mentioned that you felt offended about the court case regarding a termination of a pregnancy, which of course roots up to politics and political values, Infact one could probably even state that is really what this tug of war between the left and right is really about. Who controls the people, what we learn, what we have rights to and what we experience.
Last edited by Need4Camaro; 03-11-2023 at 05:00 PM..
I'm overall indifferent over the 'court appearance' of the matter (as I am pro life but not entirely sure how I feel about government making laws over the matter as I don't think they are doing so to stop abortion nor do I think they really care about the matter other than to appeal to certain voting groups. At first I was against it, but the more I looked into it the more it didnt seem very unreasonable. Technically in law all of our personal rights end when the operation or safety of another person is compromised in any negligent or hostile matter, the same applied during Covid-19 mask and vaccine requirements. The issue here isnt really abortion, but when does life begin, which science actually does not yet have a confirmed understanding and is still being debated.)
... The law itself aside, I'm more concerned about the principle of the matter. As for your explained scenario though:
My personal mother and father's relationship is very toxic even to this date. He cheated multiple times and she kept going back to him and even hoping for him to return. There was a brief period where she was even physically abused albeit that was short lived. Mostly he was drunk, irresponsible and very unreliable. Should I have been deprived of my right to life only because they had a bad relationship if my mother did not want to continue it while she was conceiving me? (He left her for another woman while she was pregnant with me, she was also prescribed heavy doses of prednisone to treat sarcoidosis while the doctors did not know she was pregnant. She had every reason to terminate the pregnancy and her and the doctors did consider doing just that. and trust me, she also left him multiple times but would end up returning.) Shouldn't I also have an opportunity to learn from their mistakes? Build a life, family or career based on values I model after their mistake (regardless whether I follow their foot steps or build an entirely different life) I could see the matter with alot more clarity if there wasn't another human being with a potential path involved, should someone have the right to potentially deny an opportunity for a human to exist and shape his own choices and culture?
I get the whole ordeal when a lady goes through abuse or a very bad relationship, but the child didn't have any say in the matter as to what the father did and is not inherently doomed to be molded after him either. It is spawned from him, but still exists as a seperate entity with its own destiny based on its choices.
Lastly, its becoming almost impossible to remain apolitical on many matters today as government on both sides is weeding more and more into how we live and what we experience. Infact one could probably even state that is really what this tug of war between the left and right is really about. Who controls the people, what we learn, what we have rights to and what we experience.
Well you and I aren't going to see to eye to eye because I disagree. There's a definite fault line between us. And that's fine. The issue is when a government entity steps in and imposes a personal belief system onto others and no matter the protest, when life begins is a personal belief system. It's not the government's job to step in and unilaterally tell a woman that she must have a child to term. I am not an incubator. I'd even be fine if abortion was taken off the table after the first trimester with certain exceptions like fetal abnormalities, maternal health, etc. But children should never be thought of as the byproduct/consequence of bad bedroom decisions at best or violation at worst. I believe that children should be wanted and loved, and if you for one minute think that waves of maternal love are gonna rush over you by having a child that you did not want, then you are looking at TV and reading cherry picked feel good stories. I've borne two children, and they were given the lives that they deserve -- i.e. a loving relationship between parents, the means, and parents who have the emotional maturity to deal with the highs and lows of parenting. They are cherished and loved, but if it was the 21 year old me in a toxic relationship? Getting pregnant would have been the absolute worst thing and I'm sorry, I wouldn't love the child, even moreso if the state made me carry it to term. Having a child is a serious responsibility that shouldn't be taken lightly, and I'd rather an ill equipped mother who feels she cannot be a parent have a variety of options before her, including abortion.
If you are pro life, then don't have an abortion. I am not going to turn this into a pro choice vs. pro life you vs. me thing. I mentioned it as an example of what I feel is extreme "all or nothing" approach.
If I'm raped, I am 100% going to have an abortion. If I get pregnant now, I probably will as well. I don't want to have a child after 45. The difference is that I have the means (job will pay for travel) to do so, whereas poorer people do not and that is a pity.
That being said, this is not an abortion debate thread. Just my viewpoint on how I just can't be an apolitical fence sitter anymore these days.
That, plus the Hispanic population is increasingly voting Republican. I haven't looked at hard data but my gut tells me that that's canceling out whatever gains Dems are making in the cities.
It’s not cancelling out the gains. Texas has voted more blue every election since the Obama. I’m sure it contributes to a slow down though.
N4c you didn’t need to edit your post. You could have simply responded to mine. I fail to see any irony. What I stated was exactly what I stated that I at a time was largely apolitical. I used past tense. Been implies past. I gave that example to show how extremism (and that goes both ways) can change that. But even so—and I make no apology for my personal ideology — I don’t start nuttin if you don’t start nuttin. I’m going to go about my business as I have for years.
That wasn't intentional. I didn't see your post when I edited mine and I often edit posts as more thoughts come to mind. Sorry for that.
What I am stating by that is, politics in general are having more impacts on what we feel, what we do, what we experience and how we live as they are becoming the root of what people on both sides of the fence are calling out as extremism. The reason I used you as an example was not intended to be offensive but rather examplify that you feel a heavy emotion against something that is happening because of a political influence. Except that it isn't just happening to you though, people everywhere are having strong feelings toward or against things that are being spawned out of politics both local and federal and it is becoming more difficult to evade them. Naturally, politically rooted subjects come up more and more often because political matters are impacting people's lives and values more and more. Likely, more and more people will act on their feelings toward these matters where politics (being the root source) will become more openly spoken about.
Last edited by Need4Camaro; 03-12-2023 at 07:39 AM..
I'm not all that familiar with the politics of California so it's hard to say. I know it was once at least nominally middle of the road - for example, as recently as 2008 a gay marriage referendum failed - but I don't know that I'd say it was ever anywhere near as conservative as Texas even when Swarzenegger or Wilson were governor. That said, CA seems to have gone off the deep end over the last 10-15 years and from what I've seen there's little hope of ever going back.
But beyond the general tenor of the political climate, Texas law is structured such that cities and particularly counties are pretty restricted in a lot of the things they can and can't do. They don't have as much autonomy as say, a Chicago or NYC, which means that our cities don't drive the agenda at the state level the way those cities sometimes do. For example, state law preempts cities here from enforcing gun laws that are more restrictive than state law, which means things like so-called "assault weapons" can't be banned by the City of Austin (and believe me, they would if they could).
Another example - Austin got caught up in the "defund the police" craze in 2020 and started making moves in that direction. Abbott then threatened to take over APD and replace it with state DPS troopers, and Austin more or less backed down. That's kinda what I mean when I say the state here keeps the worst impulses of the left in check and I think that makes a difference.
I don't know how California handles things like that but I get the impression that cities there have more autonomy than they do here (like, doesn't SF allow non-citizens to vote in local elections? that would never happen here). Which is why even though Austin is often called the SF of the south, not without reason, it's probably not an apples to apples comparison because I don't think CA has the same state governing structure as we have here.
Does this make any sense?
Yeah, thanks for the explanation.
In CA it feels like San Fran and Los Angeles pretty much run the direction the whole state goes in. I've lost track of how many crazy policies they've come up with - non-citizens voting wouldn't shock me.
Well you and I aren't going to see to eye to eye because I disagree. There's a definite fault line between us. And that's fine. The issue is when a government entity steps in and imposes a personal belief system onto others and no matter the protest, when life begins is a personal belief system. It's not the government's job to step in and unilaterally tell a woman that she must have a child to term. I am not an incubator. I'd even be fine if abortion was taken off the table after the first trimester with certain exceptions like fetal abnormalities, maternal health, etc. But children should never be thought of as the byproduct/consequence of bad bedroom decisions at best or violation at worst. I believe that children should be wanted and loved, and if you for one minute think that waves of maternal love are gonna rush over you by having a child that you did not want, then you are looking at TV and reading cherry picked feel good stories. I've borne two children, and they were given the lives that they deserve -- i.e. a loving relationship between parents, the means, and parents who have the emotional maturity to deal with the highs and lows of parenting. They are cherished and loved, but if it was the 21 year old me in a toxic relationship? Getting pregnant would have been the absolute worst thing and I'm sorry, I wouldn't love the child, even moreso if the state made me carry it to term. Having a child is a serious responsibility that shouldn't be taken lightly, and I'd rather an ill equipped mother who feels she cannot be a parent have a variety of options before her, including abortion.
If you are pro life, then don't have an abortion. I am not going to turn this into a pro choice vs. pro life you vs. me thing. I mentioned it as an example of what I feel is extreme "all or nothing" approach.
If I'm raped, I am 100% going to have an abortion. If I get pregnant now, I probably will as well. I don't want to have a child after 45. The difference is that I have the means (job will pay for travel) to do so, whereas poorer people do not and that is a pity.
That being said, this is not an abortion debate thread. Just my viewpoint on how I just can't be an apolitical fence sitter anymore these days.
the government is always intruding in our lives with a belief system.
Police possibly using too much force
People in pain wanting to suicide but being stopped
People being executed for misdeeds
Homeless people allowed to camp/not allowed to camp
Literally everything the govt does is an imposed belief system. Abortion is just more of the same.
Im pro choice, but I was really surprised when I realized that the pro choice argument is that it is a fetus not a human baby and not really alive. It clearly a human baby at some point. My argument is that not all human life is precious and we can decide that some lives are allowed to be ended (criminals, terminally ill, unborn babies). Most liberals wouldnt admit to that though.
Allowing other people to prosecute for a crime where they are not impacted seems ridiculous as they dont have any standing. But ultimately our entire system of laws is whatever "we" want it to be.
Since african americans have a disproportionate number of abortions, pro lifers should say that abortion is racist.
in my experience, political discussions rarely come up in conversation at social gatherings. on the rare occasion a political topic does come up, I change the subject
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