STL city falls below 300k in new census estimate... (St. Louis: new home, neighborhood)

[MUTGR]

metro as a whole lost population....

https://www.stltoday.com/news/local/...a6bd664ad.html

A few suburbs and exurbs gained.

[mjtinmemphis]

I think St. Louis needs a regional growth plan that involves boosting start ups. I've lived in Charlotte and went back to visit and I am glad I live in St. Louis for many reasons. We just need a strong growth plan with leadership that looks to consolidated growth planning.

[RisingAurvandil]

Not surprising. Outside of StL, it's a reputation issue. Inside of StL, it's an image issue. There hasn't been any serious efforts to mitigate either.

The best solution is for this region to identify it's target audience, and cater to the needs of those it wishes to attract.

But it's easy to live well here, and it may be a blessing that we don't have the sky-high prices or stresses that are common elsewhere. I don't worship at the altar of unhinged growth. I hear about 25+ year-olds living at home or with roomates on the coast, with no hope of ever owning their own spread there. Working 50+ hour weeks to scrape by. Those problems just feel so distant and senseless.

[GraniteStater]

Originally Posted by RisingAurvandil

Not surprising. Outside of StL, it's a reputation issue. Inside of StL, it's an image issue. There hasn't been any serious efforts to mitigate either.

The best solution is for this region to identify it's target audience, and cater to the needs of those it wishes to attract.

But it's easy to live well here, and it may be a blessing that we don't have the sky-high prices or stresses that are common elsewhere. I don't worship at the altar of unhinged growth. I hear about 25+ year-olds living at home or with roomates on the coast, with no hope of ever owning their own spread there. Working 50+ hour weeks to scrape by. Those problems just feel so distant and senseless.

They're becoming more common in many more metro areas with the latest large runup in housing prices since 2020. There is a chart posted on the general forum that lists details on the housing price to income ratio. Obviously St. Louis has seen much less home appreciation over time.

[1greatcity]

Construction of new housing in St. Louis’ central corridor has been happening at an astounding rate; thus, areas like The Grove and Botanical Heights have been adding population. The south side has more or less held it’s own. It’s the city’s north side that continues to bleed population. All that growth in the central corridor hasn’t been enough to offset the losses on the north side. It should be obvious that the big focus should be on finding ways to make north side living attractive again. Until then, the city cannot grow.

[mjtinmemphis]

Originally Posted by RisingAurvandil

But it's easy to live well here, and it may be a blessing that we don't have the sky-high prices or stresses that are common elsewhere. I don't worship at the altar of unhinged growth. I hear about 25+ year-olds living at home or with roomates on the coast, with no hope of ever owning their own spread there. Working 50+ hour weeks to scrape by. Those problems just feel so distant and senseless.

I can remember in the 90s, most young people would run from St Louis. Now it seems the biggest cheerleaders for the city are from other places. Local White and Blacks are either dying or leaving in droves while Asians and multi racial transplant are growing. St. Louis has to attract more immigrants to fill in the gaps. The old demographic of the past 40 years doesn't doesn't want what St Louis has. If those people where to move to more successful cities like Minneapolis or Boston, they wouldn't like them either.

[Mezter]

I’m surprised to hear this. I visited for the first time yesterday and it seemed like there was a lot of growth/Construction. I know I didn’t get to explore much and I only got to see places close to the metro lines. But from what I saw it doesn’t seem like St. Louis is dying at all. I hope the city can make a comeback.

[flynavyj]

Sad, but not REALLY surprising. I can remember as a young adult, there was a brief surge in city population, but over time i think that has dwindled some. There's still some affordable housing options in the urban core, which is helpful. And i agree a larger, regional approach to city planning and growth should be a topic...but the egos of the old guard, specifically with any type of consolidation, or greater regional influence would be met with sharp criticism. Its a phenomenon in the region that I dislike, but completely understand (give up some local control to larger control - leaves a bad taste in a lot of peoples mouths) especially if the new leadership is younger, more racially and gender diverse, or seen as too liberal.

Found it rather sad years back when the thought of combining the region was met with anger regarding the civil war separation of the area...lol. St. Louis is still TRYING to move forward...were just apparently about 150 years behind ourselves.

As to revitalization of North City, it's vital. The upcoming NGA campus should help in one blighted area, and push further expansion and revitalization in the northwest corridor, but it will still take time. The soccer stadium will be doing it's part as well, and i'm sure McKee still owns (and slums) a bunch of properties on that side of the city while he awaits TIF funding approvals to put in new homes, subdivisions, stores, etc....but the amount of revitalization necessary will be IMMENSE....a major city purchase of land (if funding was available) with bidding to sell off at record low prices in large swaths to developers, coupled with community planning, etc would be amazing...specifically for the vacant and derelict properties...hopefully we wouldn't push anyone currently living in the area out specifically, but actually help improve the neighborhood by adding...neighbors, infrastructure, and a new tax base!

[MUTGR]

Originally Posted by flynavyj

Sad, but not REALLY surprising. I can remember as a young adult, there was a brief surge in city population, but over time i think that has dwindled some. There's still some affordable housing options in the urban core, which is helpful. And i agree a larger, regional approach to city planning and growth should be a topic...but the egos of the old guard, specifically with any type of consolidation, or greater regional influence would be met with sharp criticism. Its a phenomenon in the region that I dislike, but completely understand (give up some local control to larger control - leaves a bad taste in a lot of peoples mouths) especially if the new leadership is younger, more racially and gender diverse, or seen as too liberal.

Found it rather sad years back when the thought of combining the region was met with anger regarding the civil war separation of the area...lol. St. Louis is still TRYING to move forward...were just apparently about 150 years behind ourselves.

As to revitalization of North City, it's vital. The upcoming NGA campus should help in one blighted area, and push further expansion and revitalization in the northwest corridor, but it will still take time. The soccer stadium will be doing it's part as well, and i'm sure McKee still owns (and slums) a bunch of properties on that side of the city while he awaits TIF funding approvals to put in new homes, subdivisions, stores, etc....but the amount of revitalization necessary will be IMMENSE....a major city purchase of land (if funding was available) with bidding to sell off at record low prices in large swaths to developers, coupled with community planning, etc would be amazing...specifically for the vacant and derelict properties...hopefully we wouldn't push anyone currently living in the area out specifically, but actually help improve the neighborhood by adding...neighbors, infrastructure, and a new tax base!

It wasn't separated during the civil war, it was years after:

The mechanism by which separation took place began in 1875 at the state constitutional convention.[18] At the convention, a committee examined the issues of the St. Louis government, and it summarized the two options facing the region as consolidation and separation.[18] The full convention voted to include a provision in the constitution allowing for separation; the vote was 53 in favor, 4 opposed, 11 absent.[18] Only one member of the St. Louis delegation opposed separation:

I am in favor of total consolidation of St. Louis County, but I am not in favor of dividing it, splitting and hacking it in this manner...I vote no.

— Nicolas A. Mortell, Cohn, 29.
In 1877, the City of St. Louis separated from the county, creating an independent city. The city in August 1876 narrowly approved the separation while county residents overwhelmingly opposed the separation. City residents had argued they wanted to be "rid of county taxes and state influence over county government." At the time the city had 350,000 residents while the rural county had 30,000. The rural county also had only 150 miles of gravel roads. Although the results were challenged in the courts, the two jurisdictions were formally separated in March 1877.[19]

And the separation was driven by the city, not the county, ironically. My how times have changed.

[STL74]

Originally Posted by Mezter

I’m surprised to hear this. I visited for the first time yesterday and it seemed like there was a lot of growth/Construction. I know I didn’t get to explore much and I only got to see places close to the metro lines. But from what I saw it doesn’t seem like St. Louis is dying at all. I hope the city can make a comeback.

I think North St. Louis is dying out fast and bleeding population like crazy…and as a tourist, or even a local…you’d never go there and see it. The Central Corridor is booming (in relative St. Louis terms at least). I do think at some point, we’ll see the population trend start to reverse.



And from a local standpoint…the city and the county have got to figure out a way to work together. There is a lot going for St. Louis that gets lost in the bad reputation that is both in certain ways deserved and undeserved at the same time.