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First off, I think you should check your facts. Most of, all of, some of, people were, etc are pretty general statements.
There were some folks riding bikes near Cody. People talked about it??????? What, 2 or 3 people? Your general statements are trying to indicate that the MAJORITY of the people were talking about it.
Please don't generalize on something like this. Have you interviewed even ONE SINGLE SOLE to find out why they come to Wyoming and they answered because of Race??????
Start owning your statements. I think, not we think, or most people think. Unless you can come up with some facts and numbers with teeth.
There weren't "folks riding bikes". There were teenage blacks riding aimlessly for hours on the street and into various parking lots. There was one in the Wal-mart parking lot when I pulled in. I stared at him and he left. If you know anyone in Cody call the person and inquire.
Now you want some hard facts and numbers.
1) In the recent presidential election, Obama received a lower percentage of the vote than in any other state.
2) Wyoming is the only state, repeat only, that has absolutely no laws, civil or criminal, against hate speech, hate crimes, etc.
Before I moved to Wyoming, Evanston first and later Cody, I spent a good bit of time here visiting with people. We covered a lot of territory. I was satisfied that a good majority shared my values. One of the subjects we discussed was race. The bulk of the people had a racialist attitude that I found agreeable. Oh yes, some of the newspapers, Chambers of Commerce, etc. would like to turn this into another California. But I don't believe it's likely to happen. People here are just a bit too confident of themselves and their values.
I have no idea as to who you are, where you live. or anything else about you. An individual may be anyone he chooses in a forum like this. I assume that you are a product of government schooling as you can't differentiate between /sole/ and /soul/.
Again, broad generalizations. The bulk of the people said..... The bulk of the people you talked to? 5? 20? 50?
Obama lost out here because he's an idiot and couldn't recognize a National Forest and prime hunting area if it slapped him in the face. Nothing to do with race. Was race the reason you voted one way or the other?
I voted for the person that I thought could do the most for my country and more importantly, my home.
No laws against hate speech. True. Never needed it before. Think we do now?
And by the way. Did you get the intent of what I said and not just throw a spell check and Thesarus at it?
I think that bigotry is everywhere. I think racism is everywhere. But can I say "MOST" of the state believes such and such? NO.
Again, broad generalizations. The bulk of the people said..... The bulk of the people you talked to? 5? 20? 50?
Obama lost out here because he's an idiot and couldn't recognize a National Forest and prime hunting area if it slapped him in the face. Nothing to do with race. Was race the reason you voted one way or the other?
I voted for the person that I thought could do the most for my country and more importantly, my home.
No laws against hate speech. True. Never needed it before. Think we do now?
Obama did not get the votes of people who are more libertarian/freedom loving. From what I can tell Wyoming leans more in that direction than most states.
I'm black and I've seen more racism in the most liberal areas of the country than in wyoming. You want to see racism/hatred? GO to Boulder, Berkeley or other heavily left wing communities. I've been attacked in Boulder.
That is about the biggest bull crap ever put on our forum-you know nothing about us-take your racial attitude back to where you got it from-Thanks for nothin
Don't fret Happy in Wyoming. As someone who lives in Wyoming and has for 15+ years and has seen evidence of bigotry in all three of the counties I've lived in (1 liberal, 2 conservative), I think your statements weren't "crap" and I personally believe (traslate - my opinion, not any one elses!) your post was less inflammatory than the ones to follow.
Don't take everyone's comments personally. Months back before our election in Nov., I posted a middle-of-the-road comment and got very angry, insulting comments about me too. I've pretty much become a lurker on these boards because I personally believe (again, traslate my opinion so please don't flame back) some dissenting opinions aren't welcome.
Having said that, if I keep my middle-of-the-road comments quiet in most public settings, I have found Wyoming a nice place to live, raise kids, etc. Although I'm not going to lie - my elementary school-aged kids got negative comments when they took a family photo to school during a "family" project and showed 2 cousins who are 1/2 Hispanic.
Don't fret Happy in Wyoming. As someone who lives in Wyoming and has for 15+ years and has seen evidence of bigotry in all three of the counties I've lived in (1 liberal, 2 conservative), I think your statements weren't "crap" and I personally believe (traslate - my opinion, not any one elses!) your post was less inflammatory than the ones to follow.
Don't take everyone's comments personally. Months back before our election in Nov., I posted a middle-of-the-road comment and got very angry, insulting comments about me too. I've pretty much become a lurker on these boards because I personally believe (again, traslate my opinion so please don't flame back) some dissenting opinions aren't welcome.
Having said that, if I keep my middle-of-the-road comments quiet in most public settings, I have found Wyoming a nice place to live, raise kids, etc. Although I'm not going to lie - my elementary school-aged kids got negative comments when they took a family photo to school during a "family" project and showed 2 cousins who are 1/2 Hispanic.
I'm not sure whether my comments were middle-of-the-road, but they certainly inflamed some people who did not want their opinions contested. But I don't understand why people have fallen for the notion that all races deserve welcome into all areas and should receive slobbering admiration just for being what they a are. Of course, that doesn't include Whites. We're expected to hang our heads in guilt.
Since becoming involved in this controversey, I've noticed that there are many posts wondering about acceptance of different races in various areas. I wonder how many are real and how many are just there to stir up trouble.
Last edited by Happy in Wyoming; 03-03-2009 at 09:37 AM..
I'm not sure whether my comments were middle-of-the-road, but they certainly inflamed some people who did not want their opinions contested. But I don't understand why people have fallen for the notion that all races deserve welcome into all areas and should receive slobbering admiration just for being what they a are. Of course, that doesn't include Whites. We're expected to hang our heads in guilt.
Since becoming involved in this controversey, I've noticed that there are many posts wondering about acceptance of different races in various ares. I wonder how many are real and how many are just there to stir up trouble.
It certainly has not enflamed me. Please don't get me wrong. I am curious about what you are saying, you've certainly found what we've talked about. But I've lived in several towns, Wheatland, Sundance, Gillette, Sheridan, Hanna, just to name a few. I have NEVER encountered what you have and it baffles me that it's happening.
When I first went into the Military we had to take a class on race relationship. The instructor asked me, "How many blacks were in your high school?" I had no idea. We didn't have blacks, asian, mexican, etc. We had students. We didn't look at anybody as different. I had to really stop and think about what he asked. Finally he said, well did you know any? I said, well, now that I think about it, yeah, we had just about all races in the school, but we didn't count them.
My point is, I grew up believing that we had neighbors and friends. The military tried to teach me that my neighbos and friends were different. NO THEY WEREN'T! They were neighbors and friends and were judged exactly as that.
I'm simply trying to get a feel for how wide spread it is what your talking about. Is it a big epidemic? Is it a lot of people? Is it a particula area? I simply haven't seen it where I've been.
There's racism everywhere in the world.
People who are unfamiliar with Wyoming think that it is far more racist than the rest of the US.
That is the belief of people who have never been anywhere between the West and East coasts.
There's racism everywhere in the world.
People who are unfamiliar with Wyoming think that it is far more racist than the rest of the US.
That is the belief of people who have never been anywhere between the West and East coasts.
I agree, BennyPhoenix. There is racism everywhere in the world, and I don't believe it is any worse in Wyoming than anywhere else. The inital poster asked for "honest answers" and I believe that's what he/she is getting - views on the level of bigotry in Wyoming from multiple sides. You also said "But I don't understand why people have fallen for the notion that all races deserve welcome into all areas and should receive slobbering admiration just for being what they are".
I am personally of the belief that people shouldn't be accepted for their race necessarily, but I (again personally!) believe people SHOULD be welcome into all areas for being what they are - human beings. And from seeing your past posts, I believe you agree. I don't think people should have to prove themselves in order to be accepted. They might disprove themselves by making stupid choices. I know many people will disagree with me on this one, believing people should have to prove themselves before being accepted. Just believe this one is a difference in philosophy.
I'll give my most recent example of what I posted earlier. I am a teacher in a Wyoming public school - won't say where to protect my "sources". I encountered a student just last week in my class that told a joke openly and garnered much laughter - the joke began talking about Obama and ended with "eeny meeny miney moe, catch a (n-word) by the toe". I asked the student not to tell offensive jokes in school and he argued that we don't have any black students in our school. I told him it offended me and said he was entitled to his opinion in his thoughts and outside of school, but that when he voiced the offensive opinions in our school, it wasn't appropriate. He argued that we are a nation of free speech.
Any suggestions on how I handle that one? Does free speech protect something like this?
You know, this thread has been kinda' interesting ... if not revealing about the PC aspirations of some posters here.
I, too, grew up in a very mixed race environment in a Navy town ... where race wasn't even on the radar of us on a daily basis. While the majority was white, it wasn't an issue of superiority, or taken to be an advantage over anybody. We simply went about our schooling, our activities, our "growing up" without hate or rancor or discord. Only the few who made an issue about their race felt any discrimination ... and they usually tried to "stand out" by being a**holes about everything the did, wanting to bring attention to themselves in a negative manner ... and then calling the rest of us racist because we gave them the attention which they demanded. Otherwise, we all got along ... white, hispanic, slavic, european, asians, african, and so forth ....
It wasn't until I had to spend a year in the Orlando area (while in college) that I first encountered overt and obvious discrimination and racism. It was blatant, but practiced on both sides of the tracks. What was interesting was that's the first time I heard folks referred to as (n-word) ... by whites as derrogatory ... but more commonly, by blacks when speaking to each other. I'm not sure what they meant by it .... but I sure wasn't going to call them by that name.
So, when I hear of a report of the nature of Wyolady that some youngster thinks it's OK to exercise their free speech right to the dismay of others ... I think that the kid needs an education in civility and common courtesy. "Free speech" is OK only up to the point where it has consequences and responsibility. I'm no educator, but my children grew up in a mixed neighborhood and learned real quickly that calling others names ... even in jest ... wasn't a healthy idea if they liked the shape of their nose left intact or their feelings left undamaged. We only had to kick sand in their faces a couple of times for them to understand that there was no fun in kicking sand into others'.
Also interesting, on a personal note for me ... is that some folks around here use a derrogatory term in reference to my ethnic background. I think they use it out of ignorance, and not with a specific intent to offend. So, no offense taken .... In fact, I think the joke's on them, because I know they'll go through life and use those words on someone who will take offense and will get even in ways that the speaker doesn't even know.
As I've mentioned in many other WY threads on this topic ... The only attitude you'll find in Wyoming is the one you bring with you. Be it race, religion, or preference, or other issues ... they simply aren't what's important around here. Being a productive member of society, a good neighbor, and willing to lend a hand to others in need, how you ride your horse and care for your livestock and property ... are all much more important.
Students dont have free speech in school. They have it out of school.
What you encountered is what I consider an excellent opportunity to educate some kids. I grew up telling and hearing simiilar jokes. It doesn't mean the kids are bad, racist or doomed. It is in most cases just kids being immature(which is what they are). They are in school to learn. Teach them why what they said is wrong. I wouldn't tell them they shouldn't say racist jokes; I would just explain to them why it is not something responsible people do. If they are religious kids I would explain to them that it is a violation of several of God's commandments.
FWIW, the only racist jokes that bother me are the ones that joke about real human suffering or death or killing of people. For example, jokes about lynching, the holocaust are beyond the pale. Jokes that make fun of stereotypes dont irk me to much.
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To Happy in Wyoming
