First time in Utah - Comments (Salt Lake City, Ogden: real estate, brokers, home)

[mdovell]

I spent a few days in the Ogden area and it was interesting. From the new england area this is what I tended to notice.

1) Utah is clean..like really clean. I didn't see any graffiti and hardly saw much for trash. Now it wasn't because there was a huge amount of trash barrels, there frankly isn't much trash

2) All the areas seemed to be in a grid pattern. I know this might sound normal in some parts but in New England that is pretty rare.

3) Historically maintained - it felt quite a bit like everything was well maintained and looks like it was from the 1800's or so.

4) It didn't seem and don't take this the wrong way but it did not seem that diverse. What I mean by that is nothing seemed to be ethnic. I saw bars and resturants but none described themselves at least outwardly as Italian, German, Chinese etc (although that dragon is pretty cool at the theater).

5) It's dry..like really dry. Not that I love humidity but I was surprised to hear that Great Salt Lake is drying up. Why isn't this getting more news?

6) Any ideas what the next olympics could bring? I know that is in another 10 years but quite a bit has changed since 2002.

[COcheesehead]

The American West is usually an eye opener to folks from back East. The West is best in so many ways.

[markg91359]

Originally Posted by mdovell

I spent a few days in the Ogden area and it was interesting. From the new england area this is what I tended to notice.

1) Utah is clean..like really clean. I didn't see any graffiti and hardly saw much for trash. Now it wasn't because there was a huge amount of trash barrels, there frankly isn't much trash

2) All the areas seemed to be in a grid pattern. I know this might sound normal in some parts but in New England that is pretty rare.

3) Historically maintained - it felt quite a bit like everything was well maintained and looks like it was from the 1800's or so.

4) It didn't seem and don't take this the wrong way but it did not seem that diverse. What I mean by that is nothing seemed to be ethnic. I saw bars and resturants but none described themselves at least outwardly as Italian, German, Chinese etc (although that dragon is pretty cool at the theater).

5) It's dry..like really dry. Not that I love humidity but I was surprised to hear that Great Salt Lake is drying up. Why isn't this getting more news?

6) Any ideas what the next olympics could bring? I know that is in another 10 years but quite a bit has changed since 2002.

1. Salt Lake (and Ogden to a lesser extent) is very clean compared to most cities. Clean shouldn't be confused with no social problems though. We have a large number of homeless people. If you go over on the west side of the valley, you will see more graffiti and I promise you it won't look as clean.

2. Brigham Young laid out Salt Lake City on a rigid grid plan when he brought the Mormon pioneers out here in the late 1840's. That pattern has stuck and it actually was an excellent way to establish the Salt Lake area.

3. We've done a reasonable job historically maintaining the city. You don't see what's been torn down though.

4. Its not very diverse. Utah is very white. The only other significant ethnic group is the Hispanic group. Other groups, put together, would probably not constitute more than 5% of the population. Lack of diversity is what many here complain of.

5. Much of Utah is desert. Its the second driest state in the country (Nevada being #1) The Great Basin which makes up about half of Utah's landmass is a desert. Actually, I'm hearing more and more about the Great Salt Lake drying up. Much of that is coming from people who don't live here though and seem more concerned than residents do. I think the state can be divided into three groups on this issue: The first group doesn't worry about it they believe the problem either isn't real or will solve itself because of some kind of magical thinking; The second group worries about it and would like to do something about it, but lacks the political power to do anything; The third group realizes its likely a problem, but for many reasons chooses not to worry about it because of greater problems like finding affordable housing.

6. If I am still around, I calculate I will be past seventy when the next Olympics comes. The state will have added at least another million people. It will be time rebuild the highway and road system again. The business interests that profit from the Olympics will find a way to get the taxpayers to pay for all of this like they did last time. I suspect pollution problems will be worse as there is a lack of political will in Utah to do the things required to ameliorate them.

*Note. About seven months ago, I sold my home in northern Utah and moved down to St. George. I imagine we'll have problems down here too, but at least my decision put those problems off. I think northern Utah is on a collision course with air pollution/inversion issues, climate change, and the Great Salt Lake drying up. We will see what the future brings. I will observe it from a distance.

[kletter1mann]

Originally Posted by markg91359

1. Salt Lake (and Ogden to a lesser extent) is very clean compared to most cities. Clean shouldn't be confused with no social problems though. We have a large number of homeless people. If you go over on the west side of the valley, you will see more graffiti and I promise you it won't look as clean.

2. Brigham Young laid out Salt Lake City on a rigid grid plan when he brought the Mormon pioneers out here in the late 1840's. That pattern has stuck and it actually was an excellent way to establish the Salt Lake area.

3. We've done a reasonable job historically maintaining the city. You don't see what's been torn down though.

4. Its not very diverse. Utah is very white. The only other significant ethnic group is the Hispanic group. Other groups, put together, would probably not constitute more than 5% of the population. Lack of diversity is what many here complain of.


5. Much of Utah is desert. Its the second driest state in the country (Nevada being #1) The Great Basin which makes up about half of Utah's landmass is a desert. Actually, I'm hearing more and more about the Great Salt Lake drying up. Much of that is coming from people who don't live here though and seem more concerned than residents do. I think the state can be divided into three groups on this issue: The first group doesn't worry about it they believe the problem either isn't real or will solve itself because of some kind of magical thinking; The second group worries about it and would like to do something about it, but lacks the political power to do anything; The third group realizes its likely a problem, but for many reasons chooses not to worry about it because of greater problems like finding affordable housing.

6. If I am still around, I calculate I will be past seventy when the next Olympics comes. The state will have added at least another million people. It will be time rebuild the highway and road system again. The business interests that profit from the Olympics will find a way to get the taxpayers to pay for all of this like they did last time. I suspect pollution problems will be worse as there is a lack of political will in Utah to do the things required to ameliorate them.

*Note. About seven months ago, I sold my home in northern Utah and moved down to St. George. I imagine we'll have problems down here too, but at least my decision put those problems off. I think northern Utah is on a collision course with air pollution/inversion issues, climate change, and the Great Salt Lake drying up. We will see what the future brings. I will observe it from a distance.

re. 3: I'd have to respectfully disagree. My observation has been that the conservation/preservation ethos is pretty weak, as is any kind of aesthetic self regulation. Hence most neighborhoods are an architectural hodge podge mashup. There are exceptions of course but quaintness or charm isn't a thing. At the opposite end of the scale is New England.

re. 5: You left out a 4th group: Those that have or will pick up and leave as a result. I did, and I know others that have as well. Get cozy with some real estate brokers and they'll confirm this dirty little secret. My bet is that the trickle will grow into a torrent.

re. 6: More or less the same as 5. Indeed, this stuff is the dark side of UT. UT faces some massive problems on the horizon that it lacks the ability to manage. I'm afraid that the golden goose has been cooked, though I hope I'm wrong.


Related to the above is this: https://www.sltrib.com/news/2024/02/...h-risk-losing/ These are exactly the people that UT needs to solve problems and evolve from an extractive/ag/ranching mindset into something more sustainable. You know, a culture where a gravel pit at the top of Parley's would never be considered at all, much less approved .

[kletter1mann]

Originally Posted by kletter1mann

re. 3: I'd have to respectfully disagree. My observation has been that the conservation/preservation ethos is pretty weak, as is any kind of aesthetic self regulation. Hence most neighborhoods are an architectural hodge podge mashup. There are exceptions of course but quaintness or charm isn't a thing. At the opposite end of the scale is New England.
>>>snip<<<

Case in point. https://www.sltrib.com/news/2024/02/...me-hauled-off/ The old isn't valued and developers rule the roost.

[UniversalTraveler]

Originally Posted by kletter1mann

re. 3: I'd have to respectfully disagree. My observation has been that the conservation/preservation ethos is pretty weak, as is any kind of aesthetic self regulation. Hence most neighborhoods are an architectural hodge podge mashup. There are exceptions of course but quaintness or charm isn't a thing. At the opposite end of the scale is New England.

re. 5: You left out a 4th group: Those that have or will pick up and leave as a result. I did, and I know others that have as well. Get cozy with some real estate brokers and they'll confirm this dirty little secret. My bet is that the trickle will grow into a torrent.

re. 6: More or less the same as 5. Indeed, this stuff is the dark side of UT. UT faces some massive problems on the horizon that it lacks the ability to manage. I'm afraid that the golden goose has been cooked, though I hope I'm wrong.


Related to the above is this: https://www.sltrib.com/news/2024/02/...h-risk-losing/ These are exactly the people that UT needs to solve problems and evolve from an extractive/ag/ranching mindset into something more sustainable. You know, a culture where a gravel pit at the top of Parley's would never be considered at all, much less approved .

Yeah I hear ya. I was fortunate to sell a home in the now absurdly crowded and expensive Herriman 6 years ago. Glad I saw it all coming. Enjoying the rural life up in Idaho far from the big city and that mentality. Clean air, water and friendly folks and NO traffic jams. LOL. Ya'll can have it. Enjoy the increasing homeless debacle of near downtown, absurdly high taxes and some of the worst drivers in the country.

[CCS414]

The air quality is an issue. Such a shame to degradate such a beautiful area. The politics in the area dont seem to care much about the earth.