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Old 01-03-2011, 06:30 PM
 
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I've always wondered why taxes and cost of living increase exponentially when the density of a place increases. That is unfortunate that it happens. Like in Tokyo which is denser than New York, the cost of living is even higher there despite the fact many people say New York is grossly over expensive for everything. Like if you wanted to buy a burger in Tokyo it would be like $7, and even native Japanese food is very expensive there. I don't think that the typical native Japanese Tokyo resident has a salary higher than the salary vs cost of living ratio than a typical New Yorker has, and thus their unit of currency has less buying power for them than what you'd get for an equivalent unit of currency in New York City.

I think that since taxes and cost of living increases exponetially and salary in cities do not increase in direct proportion to this, many people are turned off from living in high density cities or maybe even New Urbanist developments. If we want to save the environment and preserve wildlife habitat from being destroyed by out of control suburban development, this is one thing any major city should address is the cost of living. Thats one big turnoff for many white American families with children when considering where they want to live. If they have children, they need to know among things like there are good schools, it is safe without criminals shooting them, that there dollar can give them a lot since money and jobs are harder to come by these days. It would be very bad for the whole world if people made the assumption that because high density living is expensive, thus they can't even live, then high density = high cost = too hard to live = bad.
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Old 01-03-2011, 07:21 PM
 
Location: NYC
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taxes yes, but COL no, where I live. Those who choose to live in the suburbs pay way more for housing.
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Old 01-03-2011, 08:19 PM
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Location: Western Massachusetts
45,983 posts, read 53,506,965 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HandsUpThumbsDown View Post
taxes yes, but COL no, where I live. Those who choose to live in the suburbs pay way more for housing.
for the same amount of space?
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Old 01-03-2011, 08:22 PM
 
Location: NYC
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no you aren't likely to find many 8 bedroom 10.33 bathroom McMansions on 1 acre lots in the city (thankfully). but who needs all that space?

Speaking in more modest terms, a good-sized 3 bedroom renovated, updated, stylish rowhouse in a desirable neighborhood probably starts at 175k. 250k gets you something really special. A townhome of similar size in the desirable suburbs 20 miles out will almost always be at least $325k.
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Old 01-03-2011, 11:09 PM
 
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Supply and demand. Land in a city is in limited supply, but demand is high, largely due to proximity (remember, the first rule in real estate is location, location, location.) Thus, housing is more expensive, and uses within that expensive zone have to take into account the cost of their own rent/mortgage when pricing their goods and services.

The flip side is that a city dweller often doesn't need that much living space, because the house isn't expected to serve as a full-service habitrail for all human functions. There are other cost savings involved with city life: yard work is reduced or nonexistent, the cost of commuting is greatly reduced with closer workplace proximity and availability of public transit. And because of the advantages of proximity to marketplaces, salaries in cities tend to be higher, which compensates in some part for the higher costs of living.
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Old 01-03-2011, 11:18 PM
 
Location: Southern California
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Originally Posted by JKFire108 View Post

...

high density = high cost = too hard to live = bad.
I don't think you've shown that it does.
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Old 01-15-2011, 02:48 PM
 
Location: Seattle, WA
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When I've visited NYC, I've always felt that food is actually cheaper than many less-dense cities. Note that I'm talking groceries, cafe/deli-type places, pub fare, and ethnic food, not fine dining. I imagine this is because there's always competition a block or a few blocks away. IMO, It's the cost of housing (low supply, high demand) that really gets you in dense cities, not the cost of burgers. Even local taxes are not as much of a factor as housing, though they do compound the issue.
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Old 01-15-2011, 03:46 PM
 
Location: Yorkshire, England
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Taxes increase with density? I'm not sure about Hong Kong and Singapore in that respect compared to Oslo/Stockholm. As far as cost of living, London correlates well with dense=expensive. Low space = Higher cost of rent for businesses mean higher prices, and higher wages necessary for people to be able to afford to live there, which in turn lead to higher prices for labour-intensive stuff like restaurant meals.
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Old 01-15-2011, 07:35 PM
 
Location: The Ranch in Olam Haba
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As the density grows, public services needs grow. Infrastructure needs to grow. Schools grow. More people are needed to take care of these. so simply somehow it needs to be paid for. Thus taxes increase. COL will increase due to increase in business growth (start up costs need to passed on to someone). And once things go up, its rare that its ever goes back down.
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Old 01-15-2011, 10:58 PM
 
Location: East of Seattle since 1992, 615' Elevation, Zone 8b - originally from SF Bay Area
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You can't win either way. High density means more crime, driving up the
cost of police and courts. The lack of available land drives up property prices.
City services from utilities to street maintenance and fire protection have to grow and that costs money.

In the suburbs, the problems above do not exist, but because there is no retail or manufacturing tax base, property taxes go up. Because of the lack of crime and better schools, the area becomes more desirable so the home prices go up.

Our city has only a couple of strip malls with a large grocery store anchor tenant. We have really good schools, with home prices averaging about $450,000 and property taxes running about $5,000/year.
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