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Old 06-30-2012, 08:42 AM
 
Location: Queen Creek, AZ
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I currently live in Arizona, however, I was born in Mayaguez, Puerto Rico.

In the El Nuevo Dia polls, while the polls for the first question show keeping the current status having a slight lead, it appears that the Free Association option is leading over the Statehood option for the alternative options.

My concern is that if the people of Puerto Rico vote No on the first question and vote for Free Association on the second question, will I lose my U.S. citizenship? Free Association is bascially a form of independence.
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Old 06-30-2012, 09:13 AM
 
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I think that American citizenship can't be taken away despite that our citizenship is statutory, given to us by an act of Congress. If some status, other than statehood is chosen by Puerto Ricans, which I doubt, those with citizenship will be grand fathered in. New borns in the new status will be another story.
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Old 07-01-2012, 08:48 AM
 
Location: On a Long Island in NY
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The problem is that the Free Association option isent really on the ballot - what is on the ballot is something called "ELA Soberano" which is a weird hybrid of the current status & free association. Unless one particular option gets like 75% of the vote it's likely the results will be ignored. Also a 50% YES on Question 1 will negate the results of Question 2. As for citizenship, yes Puerto Ricans residing in Puerto Rico would lose it. What the Soberanistas forget to tell you is that Free Association requires full independence first and then negotiations over the Compact of Free Association.

The other issue that the Popular Democratic Party DOES NOT support free association, although there are some party members (Luis Vega Ramos, Carmen Yulin, etc) that do. The PPD is divided between those who do want free association and those who want to continue the current territory status with the current party leadership favoring the status quo. The party leadership is currently trying to cut down on the support for ELA Soberano by calling it independence by a different name (which it is). They are also kicking out the Soberanistas from the PPD.
76.76.202.215/prnt_ed/news02.php?nw_id=7051&ct_id=90
^ check out this article from Caribbean Business news.

If ELA Soberano was called Libre Associacion it would have little to no support. That's why both the NPP and PPD want to remove the words "ELA" as that is what is confusing people taking these polls - they are thinking it's some sort of version of the current status. My guess is they are confusing it with the "enhanced commonwealth" idea.


In short, I wouldent worry about the results. It's a non-binding referendum and even if it does win it will take decades to work out and the process present many opportunities to reject the concept.
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Old 07-01-2012, 09:31 AM
 
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American citizenship is the sticky point in the status issue. Most Puerto Ricans want to keep it but are non-informed about ways of doing so. The most secure way of keeping it is statehood, that is why this status choice has grown by leaps and bounds.

However no matter what Puerto Ricans pick in a referendum, its Congress who will ultimately decide. The common wisdom among Puerto Ricans is that if we get a big enough mandate, say 80%, Congress will abide and grant us our wishes, after all isn't that the way democracy works. But REAL POLITIKS does not work that way. REAL POLITIKS is a matter of national interests and whether states will be willing to loose representation in order to accomodate an all Spanish speaking state with a lot of political power in the House.

Most Puero Ricans truely believe its a matter of voting in mass for this or that status choice, like picking Miss universe. But that frame of thought seems to be stuck in 1950's, when Puerto Rico was the Navy's star of national defense and the cold war required strategic bases to defend America.

Since 2009 we've entered into the Tea Party age where whites are terrified of becoming a minority, where people who speak another language are suspect and entitlements for the poor are considered part of the deficit problem. Sixty percent of Puerto Ricans live off one kind of U.S entitlement or another. ( Supreme court just struck down Obama care's medicaid expansion entitlement).

Worse for those who believe in statehood are the two functioning Free association models in the Pacific , one with and the other without American citizenship. Therefore one of the free association models might be a way out for Congress if not for us.

.
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Old 07-01-2012, 10:45 AM
 
Location: On a Long Island in NY
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clip314 View Post
American citizenship is the sticky point in the status issue. Most Puerto Ricans want to keep it but are non-informed about ways of doing so. The most secure way of keeping it is statehood, that is why this status choice has grown by leaps and bounds.

However no matter what Puerto Ricans pick in a referendum, its Congress who will ultimately decide. The common wisdom among Puerto Ricans is that if we get a big enough mandate, say 80%, Congress will abide and grant us our wishes, after all isn't that the way democracy works. But REAL POLITIKS does not work that way. REAL POLITIKS is a matter of national interests and whether states will be willing to loose representation in order to accomodate an all Spanish speaking state with a lot of political power in the House.

Most Puero Ricans truely believe its a matter of voting in mass for this or that status choice, like picking Miss universe. But that frame of thought seems to be stuck in 1950's, when Puerto Rico was the Navy's star of national defense and the cold war required strategic bases to defend America.

Since 2009 we've entered into the Tea Party age where whites are terrified of becoming a minority, where people who speak another language are suspect and entitlements for the poor are considered part of the deficit problem. Sixty percent of Puerto Ricans live off one kind of U.S entitlement or another. ( Supreme court just struck down Obama care's medicaid expansion entitlement).

Worse for those who believe in statehood are the two functioning Free association models in the Pacific , one with and the other without American citizenship. Therefore one of the free association models might be a way out for Congress if not for us.

.
None of the 3 "Freely Associated Countries" (Palau, the Marshall Islands, and Micronesia) have US citizenship. They never had it in the first place as they were never US territories but rather US administered United Nations Trust Territories. What they do have is the right to freely travel and settle in the United States ... however sooner or later Congress is going to end the Compacts of Free Association (they have already said that they will not be renewed).

My personal preference is statehood ... however with the TEA Party Republicans that will be difficult but I do believe it's doable provided there was an absolute majority in a referendum (ie: over 2/3).

I am also partial to a non-sovereign "enhanced commonwealth" aka the proposed "Permanent Union Commonwealth" that they approved in the PPD General Assembly meeting last month: irrevocable US citizenship, the right to vote for the President of the United States, a US Senate Resident Commissioner with full voting rights, full voting rights for the US House Resident Commissioner, continued exemption from Federal income taxes in exchange for an annual "equitable contribution to the US Treasury" and exemption from the Territorial Clause of the US Constitution.
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Old 07-07-2012, 01:04 PM
 
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I think an enhanced commonwealth status is a pipe dream. If the US allows this status to Puerto Rico how long until DC starts demanding the same status? Congress is not going to open that door so every territory starts demanding to be an enhanced commonwealth.
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Old 07-07-2012, 03:43 PM
 
Location: On a Long Island in NY
7,800 posts, read 10,114,343 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juppiter View Post
I think an enhanced commonwealth status is a pipe dream. If the US allows this status to Puerto Rico how long until DC starts demanding the same status? Congress is not going to open that door so every territory starts demanding to be an enhanced commonwealth.
Congress has already said that they will never approve the improved/enhanced/perfected Commonwealth. Congress also said that Puerto Ricans would not be allowed to retain US citizenship under a Compact of Free Association which is why the PPD leadership ditched the "ELA Soberano" concept in 2010 although some party members continue to advocate for the concept.
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