Texas Top 15 Universities (Houston, Austin, Plano: safety, education, rankings)

[homeinatx]

Originally Posted by curtisc83

Just want to point out when using the USN&WR rankings every school that is ranked by a number nationally or regionally is a Tier 1. They changed the entire system 3 years ago. Unranked schools are Tier 2.

The USN&WR rankings are increasingly seen as a gimmick to sell a magazine. Their rankings are easily gamed and their criteria are strongly biased in favor of small private schools. Membership in the Association American Universities is the baseline for tier one status. There are 61 tier one universities in the United States and Canada. Texas has 3: U.T. Austin (since 1929), Rice (since 1985), and TAMU (since 2001).

Association of American Universities

[TheOverdog]

Total research expenditures,
Federal research expenditures,
Endowment assets,
Annual giving,
National Academy members,
Faculty awards,
Doctorates awarded,
Post-doctoral appointees, and
Median students' SAT and ACT test scores


Any university quality ranking that includes the hightlighted two is a joke in my opinion. And it seems like doctorates awarded, total research expenditures, and post-doc appointees would be a function of the size of the university and not much else.

[curtisc83]

Originally Posted by homeinatx

The USN&WR rankings are increasingly seen as a gimmick to sell a magazine. Their rankings are easily gamed and their criteria are strongly biased in favor of small private schools. Membership in the Association American Universities is the baseline for tier one status. There are 61 tier one universities in the United States and Canada. Texas has 3: U.T. Austin (since 1929), Rice (since 1985), and TAMU (since 2001).

Association of American Universities

Very interesting. So isn't this entire thread pointless? Why should any school not on that list be in any top 15?

[TheOverdog]

Why should any school not on that list be in any top 15?

Maybe because that list contains lots of perfectly fine but generally unimpressive universities, and is also relatively arbitrary? Or are we really saying that the University of Minnesota, Twin Cities (1908) is one of the top universities in the US?

And this chart right here from the AAU itself highlights the welfare factor of federal grants and using that as a gauge of university quality: $5.7 billion with all those endowments listed? Contributed less than 1/3 vs the federal handouts? Boy howdy! Way to put your money where your mouth is!! They probably just couldn't think of anything else to spend their own money on. Not that many good ideas out there are there?

And finally, there are 22 states which don't have a AAU university, which includes Oklahoma, Nebraska and Hawaii (I think).

[SIZE=3]►Federal academic research conducted by AAU universities totaled $18.9 billion in FY 2009, or 58% of all federal research funds provided to colleges and universities. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]►AAU universities spent $5.7 billion of their own institutional funds on academic research in FY 2009. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3] [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3][SIZE=3]Number of states with AAU institutions: 28 [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3] [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3][/SIZE][/SIZE]

It's also 2013 - click on some of the universities on that list, and see they have barely working or completely unusable websites.

BTW, 5.7b in research / 62 AAU universities = about 100m in research per university on average. UT's, Ohio State, Uof Florida, Penn State and Wisconsin's athletic budgets are each more than that.

[homeinatx]

Originally Posted by TheOverdog

Maybe because that list contains lots of perfectly fine but generally unimpressive universities, and is also relatively arbitrary? Or are we really saying that the University of Minnesota, Twin Cities (1908) is one of the top universities in the US?

And this chart right here from the AAU itself highlights the welfare factor of federal grants and using that as a gauge of university quality: $5.7 billion with all those endowments listed? Contributed less than 1/3 vs the federal handouts? Boy howdy! Way to put your money where your mouth is!! They probably just couldn't think of anything else to spend their own money on. Not that many good ideas out there are there?

And finally, there are 22 states which don't have a AAU university, which includes Oklahoma, Nebraska and Hawaii (I think).

[SIZE=3]►Federal academic research conducted by AAU universities totaled $18.9 billion in FY 2009, or 58% of all federal research funds provided to colleges and universities. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]►AAU universities spent $5.7 billion of their own institutional funds on academic research in FY 2009. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3] [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3][SIZE=3]Number of states with AAU institutions: 28 [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3] [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3][/SIZE][/SIZE]

It's also 2013 - click on some of the universities on that list, and see they have barely working or completely unusable websites.

BTW, 5.7b in research / 62 AAU universities = about 100m in research per university on average. UT's, Ohio State, Uof Florida, Penn State and Wisconsin's athletic budgets are each more than that.

Real universities are all not for profit institutions - they are invested in research and education - important parts of the public good. Most athletic budgets come from quasi-private money-making activities adjacent to the real work of universities. All of the ones you mention take no money from the their respective universities, and mostly give a little back. They are mostly immune from academic oversight, with often disastrous consequences. The name Sandusky ring a bell. Athletics has absolutely nothing to do with the quality of a university. Of the very top universities only Stanford and Duke offer athletic scholarships, most of these very top universities play in division III. So I am not sure what you are getting at. Division I athletics are ways for athletic programs to make money by super-exploiting student athletes, and they serve a PR function at big state schools. Very little to do with research or education??

University of Minnesota is indisputably one of the top 60 universities in the country. The Times of London ranks it as the 47th best university in the world. AAU membership is a sine qua non for tier one status. That is not to say that it is not possible to get an excellent education at many of the 4500 institutions of higher education in the United States, and most universities will be stronger in some areas than others. To get back on topic and to generalize a little, I would rank the top universities in TX as follows:

For undergraduate (liberal arts and pre-professional)
1. Rice
2. UT, Austin
3. TAMU, College Station
4. Trinity
5. University of Houston
6. SMU
7. Baylor
8/9/10. Texas Tech, U.T. San Antonio, TCU

For graduate study it gets much more complicated. UT, Austin has one of the best, if not the best, accountancy programs in the U.S. Ditto for the Veterinarian School at TAMU. The business school at SMU has a national reputation etc. You go to a program in a university, and prospective employers in their respective fields know which programs are good for what.

FWIW, I have worked in universities on 4 continents for my entire adult life, and mostly all the ranking systems are bogus in one way or another. They are about marketing, prestige and snobbery as much as they are about the quality of teaching or research. Within the snobbery economy, AAU membership is the best the non-Ivies can hope for. There is not a university president who would not be ecstatically happy to receive an invitation to join. Only one university has ever been asked to leave: Nebraska.

AAU universities in 2011 received 57% of all federal grants. That funds a helluva lot of research, which is how you attract and keep the best faculty. It is indeed 2013, great universities require sustained levels of capital investment over a long period of time. The most prestigious ones are usually the oldest ones or the ones who have been among the richest for the longest. I don't see that changing any time soon.

As you point out 22 states don't have even one, TX has 3, CA leads with 9, MA has 4, NY has 6.

In terms of the prestige economy, I don't see any major universities missing and certainly none from Texas??

[BigDGeek]

Originally Posted by llmrkc07

Hey you guys, I have come up with a list of the Top Universities in Texas. When I mean "Top", I'm speaking in terms of price, campus beauty, academics, athletic programs, location etc. These are my rankings:

1. Rice University- Top notch school. Southern Ivy.

2. University of Texas at Austin- Top school in Texas. Nice Public Ivy. Athletics and Academics Rule here.

I agree with these rankings.

3. SMU- Another Southern Ivy. Beautiful Campus. Great Academic Programs

Southern Ivy? More like a debutante finishing school, at least for the undergraduates. For undergrad I'd rank this way down the list.

4. Texas A & M University- Made the list because of the name and price. Not that bad of a price for a Division I school. Campus kind of reminds me of Houston..Big and Flat. Overall good academic programs.

I'd rank A&M ahead of SMU any day for undergrad.

5. Baylor University- Very good school, beautiful campus, academic and athletics are great here.

6. University of Houston- Great school, nice campus, athletic and academic programs are turning for the better. Tier 1 status soon.

7. Texas Tech University- Good school for academics and it athletic programs. Flat, but beautiful campus.

8. University of Texas at Dallas- On it way to Tier 1 status. Nice campus.

9. Texas Christen University- Academic and Athletic programs are great. Probably the best in the DFW area right after SMU or maybe even a close tie.

I'd rank all of these ahead of SMU. I'd rank UTD 5th, U of H 6th, Tech 7th, TCU 8th and Baylor 9th.

10. Texas State University- Underrated Texas University. Great for academics. Athletic department is average. Beautiful campus in a good location.

11. University of North Texas- Average University. Nice campus and Academic programs. Big University in the DFW region.

12. University of Texas at Arlington- Another DFW school. Good for Academics.

13. Trinity University- San Antonio's best university. Beautiful campus.

14. University of Texas San Antonio- San Antonio's mega university. Academics and Athletic department are okay. School is a big benefit for the San Antonio area.

15. Sam Houston State University- Great school and probably one of the best "bang for you buck" colleges in Texas. Beautiful campus. Growing athletic and academic programs.

I'd rank UTA ahead of Texas State and UNT. I'd rank UTSA ahead of UNT. Sam Houston State wouldn't even make my list. UNT would be at the bottom of this list.

[llmrkc07]

UTD over UH . I dont think so.

SHSU was strictly for fun. Though I think it is a great school for undergrad..

[Austinite101]

Originally Posted by BigDGeek

I agree with these rankings.



Southern Ivy? More like a debutante finishing school, at least for the undergraduates. For undergrad I'd rank this way down the list.



I'd rank A&M ahead of SMU any day for undergrad.



I'd rank all of these ahead of SMU. I'd rank UTD 5th, U of H 6th, Tech 7th, TCU 8th and Baylor 9th.



I'd rank UTA ahead of Texas State and UNT. I'd rank UTSA ahead of UNT. Sam Houston State wouldn't even make my list. UNT would be at the bottom of this list.

That's what I thought. SMU isn't really that decent of a university.

[SteelBubble]

Originally Posted by Austinite101

That's what I thought. SMU isn't really that decent of a university.

Don't know where you've been, but SMU has been shooting up the rankings the last 5 or so years.

[Austinite101]

Originally Posted by SteelBubble

Don't know where you've been, but SMU has been shooting up the rankings the last 5 or so years.

I never said it was bad, but really? The words ivy and SMU don't belong near each other. Its a fairly reputable university in Texas, yes.