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In my education-related field one issue that my colleagues and I sometimes struggle with: if we accept a low-paying job just to have a job, any job, in the field does that mean we are enabling the profession to continue to exploit workers? That's another issue, too, but it sounds like for teachers like Ivory (and those in other schools that pay non-union wages and no benefits) might have to struggle with, too. It's not an easy question.
This is, actually, the issue I'm talking about. Here there are two pay structures. The pay structure in a union district which starts low but you earn more year over year, making a livable wage from the start and a nice wage in the end, and charters which start several thousand below districts and never go up. Many people take a job in a charter just to have a job and then leave as soon as they can get into a district. The only teachers I see staying at charters are teachers who, for whatever, reason, don't worry about what they make. Maybe they have a spouse who makes so much they don't even need to work or, like one of my coworkers, inherited enough money to live off of.
The really sad part of my case is that I actually went into teaching with this school in mind. I could have been happy here. My bad assumption was that while wages would be lower, they'd increase over time. I did not realize there are no raises here. I ASSumed that there was a stepped wage structure like there is in a district and the very low wages would go away in a few years. I didn't realize I was accepting this wage forever and that my benefits would be cut to the tune of 15% of my pay my first year in (so much for the value of that contract. They didn't even live up to the benefits they put into it. ....yet I'm told "I" am to be held to it. )
Unfortunately, my job search over the summer netted nothing. I thought I was going to have an interview this week but it didn't come to fruition. I doubt I'll find anything this fall either but if I do, I'm gone. In this economy, I can't afford to not take an opportunity that comes along. If the school figures out I'm looking, I won't have to worry. They'll escort me out. My bet is they let me go in the spring because they know I'm not happy with the wages and chemistry teachers are easy to come by, but that's fine. At least then I can get unemployment while I look so it's not all or nothing.
If they don't fire me, most likely, I'm on a three year plan. I'll decertify in chemistry and add a general science cert (it will take me three years to do this). That should make me employable to a district. In the meantime, I'll keep trying to market my math cert and hope something better comes along where I can, finally, settle in and grow roots. I'm almost afraid to get too close to the kids where I am because I know I can't stay and I don't know when I'll leave. Unfortunately, short of winning the lotto, there's not much I can do about that.
While I know they don't hear the message, every teacher that leaves sends the message that the wages are unacceptable. Those who stay, send the message they are acceptable. I can't figure out why the wages and benefits are so low. I assumed they'd be under union districts but I thought it would be proportional. Something like make 75% of what a starting teacher makes to start out and 10 years later you make 75% of what a 10th year teacher makes. What happens is you still make 75% of what a staring teacher makes. Actually less because you lose ground to inflation. And I'm supposed to feel guilty about taking an opportunity to make a decent wage if it happens to come along at the wrong time of the year?
I think teachers should be allowed to leave and find provisions sanctioning them for leaving to be wrong. If you look at the calendar when school districts hire and when teachers need to resign by you find little overlap. It makes it very difficult for teachers to change districts and can leave them trapped in school districts they hate. People need to ask if their state or district has a resignation by date that is prior to the start of the school year and how much prior? Is a July 15 date reasonable for tenured teachers? How about spring date for non tenured teachers? Being non tenured and wanting to leave in some states can make you feel like and indentured servant. The acid test is in what is the actual date you need to resign by.
If the dates are unreasonable, then I agree.
But often, teachers sign as soon as the option is available, and then leave close to the start of the new year, leaving the school scrambling - or during the year. I don't think penalty clauses for that are unreasonable - they are akin to the contracts I signed as an independent worker in the high tech field - if I left without cause before the job was done, I was subject to a penalty. If the company let me go without cause before the job was done, they were subject to a penalty.
I was going to write about how COL is dependent on location and how how much you need to live off of depends on things like how good your benefits are (for example I have no pension and very expensive and lousy insurance) but I think I'll just ask why you think it's ok to pay teachers less because there's another adult in the house to make up the difference? This is the kind of logic they used in the 50's to keep teacher's wages low.
It doesn't matter what my husaband makes. I deserve fair wages. Why would I deserve less if he makes more? In our case, it happens that neither of us has a pension through our current employer so one consideration is saving enough to fully fund retirement. Another is very expensive insurance premiums and high prescription bills. You can't just pull out a number and say this is ok. You have to look at the whole picture.
Actually YOU are the one who made it an issue, not Aconite.
YOU are the one who made it a matter of your children's ostensible suffering due to your low income.
So, give your head another whack for me, Ivory.
The reason it sounds like me as if you are leaving purely out of greed is because that is the picture you increasingly paint for me.
You choose to make your current students suffer because you want MORE - as opposed to wanting ENOUGH.
*shrugs*
I'm done with this topic. You have done a good enough job of making my point.
Did I miss your answer to my question of whether or not YOU are fairly compensated? Or did you avoid it?
You've missed it - twice now. I won't bother answering it third time - it is clear to me you are not actually reading what I write, based on this question.
But often, teachers sign as soon as the option is available, and then leave close to the start of the new year, leaving the school scrambling - or during the year. I don't think penalty clauses for that are unreasonable - they are akin to the contracts I signed as an independent worker in the high tech field - if I left without cause before the job was done, I was subject to a penalty. If the company let me go without cause before the job was done, they were subject to a penalty.
But often, teachers sign as soon as the option is available, and then leave close to the start of the new year, leaving the school scrambling - or during the year. I don't think penalty clauses for that are unreasonable - they are akin to the contracts I signed as an independent worker in the high tech field - if I left without cause before the job was done, I was subject to a penalty. If the company let me go without cause before the job was done, they were subject to a penalty.
Often the principal wants to let them go and there is a great candidate wanting to replace them but policy says no.
I'm saying not only that I do (which the part where we disagree, as previously noted), but that society expects/demands better behavior from teachers than from society in general.
The behavior mentioned is an illustration of that. It is not, as Ivory has very adroitly pointed out, the kind of behavior you would see in engineering or with auto mechanics or physicians.
Just with teachers. The difference exists.
"Society"? I don't care much about "society". I tend to do what's best for me and for my family. The days of "society" making you wear an A on your chest for adultery, or putting you in a stockade in the town square are no more.
As for "expecting more from teachers", well, I if the expectations are codified, I have no problem with that. It's the innuendo and subtle things I find silly. Personally, I wouldn't have a problem with my kids' teacher having a drink in public. I suppose you would?
Actually YOU are the one who made it an issue, not Aconite.
YOU are the one who made it a matter of your children's ostensible suffering due to your low income.
So, give your head another whack for me, Ivory.
The reason it sounds like me as if you are leaving purely out of greed is because that is the picture you increasingly paint for me.
You choose to make your current students suffer because you want MORE - as opposed to wanting ENOUGH.
*shrugs*
I'm done with this topic. You have done a good enough job of making my point.
Go ahead and get the last word in.
So, wanting a fair wage for a fair day's work is greed? Wanting to be able to save for your children's college is greed? Wanting to be able to retire someday is greed? Then count me among the greedy .
Yes, my income makes a difference to my family. Why is that so hard to believe? And no, I don't make enough. I've said before that if I stayed proportionally under what district teachers make I'd stay because it would only be a few years before we'd be ok but the school I work at does not give raises. They just watch teachers leave when they, finally, find something that pays a fair wage.
"Society"? I don't care much about "society". I tend to do what's best for me and for my family. The days of "society" making you wear an A on your chest for adultery, or putting you in a stockade in the town square are no more.
As for "expecting more from teachers", well, I if the expectations are codified, I have no problem with that. It's the innuendo and subtle things I find silly. Personally, I wouldn't have a problem with my kids' teacher having a drink in public. I suppose you would?
I can't care about what society thinks. If I get the chance to take a job that allows me to take better care of my family, it doesn't much matter when it's offered. I don't think society should hold teachers to a higher standard. Every worker should be held to the same standard. My contract happens to be an at will contract. It's breakable at any timeby either party. The school is not promising to keep me until next June and I'm not promising to stay until next June. It's employment as long at it's mutually agreeable. I see no reason I should be looked down upon for choosing to do so if a better opportunity comes along.
I signed the same kind of at will contract when I took this teaching job I signed when I was in engineering. Yet, I'm limited as to when I can move into another position as a teacher? That makes no sense. What I agreed to is at will empployment. They could terminate me tomorrow if they wish with no reason at all, which is their right.
Last edited by Ivorytickler; 09-05-2009 at 08:03 PM..
A teacher violates her contract, leaving mid-term, and you want the school to throw a party for her!
Yes. As I've said, repeatedly, leaving isn't violating our contracts. We are at will employees. You are reading more into our signing contracts than is there. Our contracts are simply wage agreements. They state right in them that employment for the entire year is not required or guaranteed and that the contract can be cancelled by either party at any time for any reason. Where's the violation in leaving?
Throwing her a going away party would have been good for the kids. They were the ones hurt by the schools actions. The school also should have allowed her to visit when she tried to. She had promised the kids. They were so intent on making her look bad they didn't care they hurt the kids.
Last edited by Ivorytickler; 09-05-2009 at 08:01 PM..
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....yet I'm told "I" am to be held to it. 
) 
The days of "society" making you wear an A on your chest for adultery, or putting you in a stockade in the town square are no more. 
