Tampa Bay Robbed of it's 4th Pro Sports Franchise! (Miami: home, college)
Tampa BayTampa - St. Petersburg - Clearwater
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Spot on, and let's not forget Orlando ranks near the bottom of the pile of major metro areas in terms of Disposable Income Per Capita.
Spot on? Really Kyle? So you agree with the poster who thinks professional sporting venues should be built in the suburbs? Wow, for somebody who manages to point out every flaw Orlando has in terms of density, urban planning, job growth, etc, you would think you'd be the first person to say build it in the city. We may not agree on everything, but I thought you we're a better urbanist than that. Hmm, I've noticed a trend with your posts. Bash Orlando and suggest solutions that will hurt not help the situation, wow.
No. Not even with one of the worst records in team history do the Magic have a serious problem with attendance. I think if I we're you, I'd do some more research before trying to discredit how Orlando supports it's team.
Now if you wanna talk about a city that doesn't show up to support it's teams, then I suggest Tampa look in the mirror. Just Google Bucs and the stories will show up about tv blackouts and possible relo talks, something the Magic have no worries about. But here, stats are always better:
What's that, the Rays are really good you say and I should have quoted their numbers because certainly they'll be atop the struggling baseball world. Oh wait, nevermind.
Hey, there's always the Lightning, which are the only team in Tampa that pulls what it should.
Now onto your next ridiculous point. So hows that working out for you in Tampa having your Rays across the Bay and your Bucs out off Dale Mabry? But then again, if Orlando's downtown was as lackluster as Tampa's then I'd probably feel the same way about putting the stadium in the suburbs. But thankfully, it's not. We've been improving our downtown and keeping the NBA arena there and building the soccer stadium there were bottom lines for the mayor and many civic leaders. Even when a super rich hotelier tried to lure the Magic to I-drive down by the attractions, the locals and city combined, and fought to keep our team in our city core. ...shows how much (rather little) you know about Orlando.
Well actually building a much much smaller capacity soccer specific stadium was part of the deal that landed Orlando the MLS. Question, how do you feel you we're robbed. You guys already were given a shake by the MLS and it didn't pan out. Orlando did everything right from getting the right sponsors onboard, to getting the word out, to securing everything needed to earn this franchise. So while I do feel sorry that your team didn't make it, your post tries to negate all the hard work this community did to earn it's 2nd true major league sport.
Only time will tell, but I'd have to say that I wouldn't root for anything in Tampa to fail. I'm actually taken back by all the negativity directed to Orlando for doing something great. It speaks jealously to me, which is just silly. I'd love an NHL team but I'm not hoping for the Lightning to fail.
2013-2014 NBA Attendance - National Basketball Association - ESPN
On the current season the magic rank 22 out 30, the year before bottom 50% from the same page you posted. Aside from Winter Park there is nothing in Orlando that I personally like, you can't tell me the area around the citrus bowl is not a complete wasteland. For the record I am a soccer fan I only care about the sustainability of the league not whether Tampa gets a team over Orlando I think both are bad choices.
I think most of the fans will come from the suburbs not downtown, since Orlando does not have a way to get back downtown for a game without fighting traffic either in a bus or your own car I would think their attendance will suffer and think they would fare better with a stadium in the 'burbs, I am wrong? possibly that is just my initial thought.
Last edited by DUNNDFRNT; 12-05-2013 at 10:55 AM..
2013-2014 NBA Attendance - National Basketball Association - ESPN
On the current season the magic rank 22 out 30, the year before bottom 50% from the same page you posted. Aside from Winter Park there is nothing in Orlando that I personally like, you can't tell me the area around the citrus bowl is not a complete wasteland. For the record I am a soccer fan I only care about the sustainability of the league not whether Tampa gets a team over Orlando I think both are bad choices.
I think most of the fans will come from the suburbs not downtown, since Orlando does not have a way to get back downtown for a game without fighting traffic either in a bus or your own car I would think their attendance will suffer and think they would fare better with a stadium in the 'burbs, I am wrong? possibly that is just my initial thought.
I showed stats for an entire year, not a partial season that only reflects the past 10 home games for the season. Either way, the Magic still fill 85% of that building in a town that supposedly doesn't care about it's team. And the Magic as a team make money at this rate still so they are safe in Orlando for many years to come. And I never claimed the area around the Citrus Bowl is great, but who cares that is a temp home for the soccer team till the new stadium opens up next to the Amway Center which makes both stadiums a simple, 1/8 mile walk down Church Street to the CBD and all the bars, nightlife, and residential towers of downtown Orlando.
And for the record, Orlando will have a commuter rail opening in 2014 which is more than I can say for Tampa. The train will eventually run from the distant suburb/exurb of Deland in the north to Poinciana in the south, cutting right through the heart of prominent suburbs like Sanford, Lake Mary, Altamonte, Maitland, Winter Park, and even 3 stops in downtown Orlando. Add that to the BRT expansion that is taking place to link all 3 stadiums (conveniently in a row on Church with the Citrus Bowl being the most distant from the core at 1.7 miles away), and I think Orlando is at least making strides in the right direction.
Spot on? Really Kyle? So you agree with the poster who thinks professional sporting venues should be built in the suburbs? Wow, for somebody who manages to point out every flaw Orlando has in terms of density, urban planning, job growth, etc, you would think you'd be the first person to say build it in the city. We may not agree on everything, but I thought you we're a better urbanist than that. Hmm, I've noticed a trend with your posts. Bash Orlando and suggest solutions that will hurt not help the situation, wow.
Well, since Orlando is essentially one giant suburb I would say yes I do agree. Soccer in the US is largely supported by White suburbanites who grew up playing the sport and placing it in the ghetto-fabulous neighborhood where the Citrus Bowl is located won't exactly work in it's favor. Brighthouse Stadium at UCF would be a much better option at least until the team hopefully achieves some semblance of a core attendance, and then perhaps opt for a new facility someplace more centralized once they're a proven product. As usual, Orlando's leadership and city proponents don't fully think anything out which is fully in evidence pretty much anywhere you look.
If your Rowdies played at Al Lang stadium wouldnt that be St Petes team rather than Tampas team?
You must be from Tampa.
NO! St. Petersburg and all of Pinellas County which is denser than Tampa is part of the "Tampa BAY" area. It's like saying the Dallas Cowboys shouldn't be the Dallas Cowboys since they're in Arlington, TX.
NO! St. Petersburg and all of Pinellas County which is denser than Tampa is part of the "Tampa BAY" area. It's like saying the Dallas Cowboys shouldn't be the Dallas Cowboys since they're in Arlington, TX.
Not sure why you think i`m from Tampa as i`m quite proud of the city of my youth,St Pete.
When i grew up in St Pete,St Pete was St Pete and Tampa was Tampa and the bay was just a large body of water with no beaches, the term Tampa Bay area wasnt used at that time to refer to everything from Sarasota to Brookesville and east to Lakeland, In fact most of St Petes younger crowd of the day thought Tampa kinda sucked.,
Over the years i`ve watched the city of St Pete lose its identity and become referred to more and more as Tampa,for some one who grew up in St Pete the trend to wipe St Pete off the map is rather irritating particularly when sports teams playing in St Pete are referred to as Tampas teams, and St Petes beaches are referred to as Tampas beaches,.
And for the record, Orlando will have a commuter rail opening in 2014 which is more than I can say for Tampa. The train will eventually run from the distant suburb/exurb of Deland in the north to Poinciana in the south, cutting right through the heart of prominent suburbs like Sanford, Lake Mary, Altamonte, Maitland, Winter Park, and even 3 stops in downtown Orlando. Add that to the BRT expansion that is taking place to link all 3 stadiums (conveniently in a row on Church with the Citrus Bowl being the most distant from the core at 1.7 miles away), and I think Orlando is at least making strides in the right direction.
I would be very interested in seeing how that commuter line fares, Orlando has the same challenges that Tampa has on being so spread out and with no major job centers, sure downtown and the parks are employment centers but for the most part people work everywhere, I hope it works out and Tampa can learn and improve on it.
I would be very interested in seeing how that commuter line fares, Orlando has the same challenges that Tampa has on being so spread out and with no major job centers, sure downtown and the parks are employment centers but for the most part people work everywhere, I hope it works out and Tampa can learn and improve on it.
Well I do agree on your assessment of it's challenges, but nevertheless it's coming in a few months and will be a step in the right direction for CFL.
Now if you wanna talk about a city that doesn't show up to support it's teams, then I suggest Tampa look in the mirror. Just Google Bucs and the stories will show up about tv blackouts and possible relo talks, something the Magic have no worries about.
Let's not forget that the Bucs sold out every game from 9/20/1998-1/3/2010. 12 seasons of straight sellouts is pretty good. Yes, attendance has been down for a few years, but most teams have ups and downs with attendance when their team hasn't been very good.
The Magic had an attendance slump of their own a few years ago where they were 26th-27th in the league. It happens from time to time with most sports franchises unless you play in a large market like New York, Los Angeles or Chicago.
What's that, the Rays are really good you say and I should have quoted their numbers because certainly they'll be atop the struggling baseball world. Oh wait, nevermind.
There's no question that the Rays have an attendance problem. Keep in mind the challenge of selling 81 home games in baseball vs. 41 in the NBA. It's far more difficult to draw 18,645 fans per night 81 times vs. the 17,595 fans the Magic draw 41 times last year.
Also, there is a finite number of Entertainment/Sports dollars that people have to spend. The Magic are the only major league sports franchise in Orlando, so they get the bulk of that revenue. Now with the new MLS team, it'll be interesting to see if that has any effect on the attendance at Magic games. The Bucs, Rays and Lightning are all competing for the same discretionary income.
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Now onto your next ridiculous point. So hows that working out for you in Tampa having your Rays across the Bay
Well there would not be a team here at all if not for Tropicana field. St. Pete happened to have built a stadium that was ready when MLB was expanding in the early 90s. Tampa would be more ideal but there was no stadium there, so it was either St. Pete or nothing at all. Hopefully the powers that be will get a deal done at some point to move across the bay.
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and your Bucs out off Dale Mabry?
That's not a problem at all. Like I said, 12 years of straight sellouts. The current attendance issues with Bucs games have nothing to do with the location of the stadium.
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But then again, if Orlando's downtown was as lackluster as Tampa's then I'd probably feel the same way about putting the stadium in the suburbs. But thankfully, it's not. We've been improving our downtown and keeping the NBA arena there and building the soccer stadium there were bottom lines for the mayor and many civic leaders. Even when a super rich hotelier tried to lure the Magic to I-drive down by the attractions, the locals and city combined, and fought to keep our team in our city core. ...shows how much (rather little) you know about Orlando.
I do think Orlando puts more into their downtown than Tampa does. I'll give you that. I think Tampa has improved in this regard over the years with the arena, aquarium, cruise port, etc. But back in the 1990s, Orlando was way ahead of Tampa in developing their downtown.
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Question, how do you feel you we're robbed.
I actually don't feel that way. I would have preferred to see it in Tampa but I knew that getting a stadium built specifically for soccer probably wasn't going to happen. MLS failed in Tampa but you should also take into account that MLS was in terrible shape back then and wasn't anywhere near the level of popularity that it is now. Tampa already proved that soccer could be a draw here with the original Rowdies of the late 70s and 80 that drew 35,000-55,000 regularly.
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Orlando did everything right from getting the right sponsors onboard, to getting the word out, to securing everything needed to earn this franchise.
I agree with that 100%.
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Only time will tell, but I'd have to say that I wouldn't root for anything in Tampa to fail. I'm actually taken back by all the negativity directed to Orlando for doing something great. It speaks jealously to me, which is just silly. I'd love an NHL team but I'm not hoping for the Lightning to fail.
I have nothing to say negatively regarding Orlando in regards to them getting the MLS franchise. I do take issue with you painting the picture that Tampa doesn't support their sports teams.
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