Where to live near UMSL? (St. Louis, St. Charles: crime, houses, private schools)

[FrankMiller]

Originally Posted by RMili292

Ok, I will check that. Not sure how "typical traffic" is defined or measured but at least it's a data point. Maybe things are different in St Louis, but I could advise someone moving to Metro Detroit in a general way about which routes are likely to have heaviest congestion at rush hour and possibly suggest a lower-density alternative. Maybe not from any given starting to ending point in the region, but at least some high-level guidance.

If all the mentioned freeways are pretty much in the same range, then I guess that factor is essentially negated in choosing where to live.

Thanks for the reply and information!

Google has lots of data on traffic thanks to all the drivers carrying phones with the Google Maps app, which reports anonymous traffic data. So they can display what typical traffic congestion looks like for any given day and time via the Traffic overlay.

We can give you our impressions as well, but few of us have taken enough different routes under consistent conditions to provide reliable information as compared to what Google has. Plus, Google Maps will show you a picture.

[RMili292]

Originally Posted by FrankMiller

Google has lots of data on traffic thanks to all the drivers carrying phones with the Google Maps app, which reports anonymous traffic data. So they can display what typical traffic congestion looks like for any given day and time via the Traffic overlay.

We can give you our impressions as well, but few of us have taken enough different routes under consistent conditions to provide reliable information as compared to what Google has. Plus, Google Maps will show you a picture.

Excellent, I will take advantage of that as we winnow the list down. I wasn't expecting any one person to provide a comprehensive guide to every freeway, but if someone has experience on one route or section of these freeways, general impressions are valuable to me. No, it won't be the be all-end all, but another solid data point to fit into the overall picture.

Thanks again for the suggestion!

[wustu87]

I used to work near UMSL, but it was about 15 years ago so the traffic patterns may have shifted. I always found the fastest route in the morning was going up northbound I-170 to Natural Bridge. We lived in the Olive/Lindbergh Creve Coeur area at the time. I also tried going north up Lindbergh and that was never as fast as taking Olive to 170 and then up north. I went home at ~5pm the same way, I-170 to Olive. It was only 15-20 minutes each way during rush hour with the slower part being on westbound Olive, not I-170.

That was a nice area to live too, in either the Ladue, Parkway North or Pattonville school districts (63146/63141/63132 zip codes). We could easily walk to Olive and hit all the restaurants and establishments there, but in all honesty it was so close with ample parking that we usually just drove over and parked (being typical lazy Americans!) Your $300K budget can get you a reasonably nice home in Parkway North or Pattonville, but it will be a bit tougher to find some place as nice in Ladue schools at that same price point (but still doable in Olivette or Creve Coeur.)

[UncommonValor]

Originally Posted by RMili292

Hi everyone!

I’m currently in metro Detroit and starting a new job on the UMSL campus in a couple weeks. I’m looking for some input on areas to live. I’ve got two young kids, so quality schools and low violent crime rate are very important. Walkability and a sense of community are also high on the list. Ideally, I’d like to have an easy commute, but if the best option(s) are a little further out, I’m flexible on that. Budget max is 300k for a 3+ bedroom, 1.5+ bathroom ranch.

We will be renting for a year to get a feel for the different areas, but feedback from those with boots on the ground is always valuable. Any advice or opinions are greatly appreciated.

Hello,

Speaking as a fellow transplant from MI (Livonia), I strongly recommend you disregard “walkabilty” and stay south of 70 and west of 170 and make the commute. Kirkwood (sans Meacham Park, a mini-ghetto around a nice area) and Webster Groves are walkable and generally safe, but unfortunately your budget/targeted housing size may be a challenge in those safe areas.

The northern parts of St Louis City/County are generally not safely “walkable.” If you choose St. Charles County, that is an excellent route, you’ll get the most for your housing dollar but at least get west of 5th Street.

I’m surprised you’re leaving Detroit during this histrionic economic upturn, especially as St. Louis has a vastly higher crime rate than Detroit these days.

[RMili292]

Originally Posted by wustu87

I used to work near UMSL, but it was about 15 years ago so the traffic patterns may have shifted. I always found the fastest route in the morning was going up northbound I-170 to Natural Bridge. We lived in the Olive/Lindbergh Creve Coeur area at the time. I also tried going north up Lindbergh and that was never as fast as taking Olive to 170 and then up north. I went home at ~5pm the same way, I-170 to Olive. It was only 15-20 minutes each way during rush hour with the slower part being on westbound Olive, not I-170.

That was a nice area to live too, in either the Ladue, Parkway North or Pattonville school districts (63146/63141/63132 zip codes). We could easily walk to Olive and hit all the restaurants and establishments there, but in all honesty it was so close with ample parking that we usually just drove over and parked (being typical lazy Americans!) Your $300K budget can get you a reasonably nice home in Parkway North or Pattonville, but it will be a bit tougher to find some place as nice in Ladue schools at that same price point (but still doable in Olivette or Creve Coeur.)

Thanks for the excellent information! It will be a stretch for Olivette or Creve Coeur, but there seems to be a number of municipalities that, on paper at least, would serve us well. At this early stage, I am not too concerned about getting into a good place for us.

[RMili292]

Originally Posted by UncommonValor

Hello,

Speaking as a fellow transplant from MI (Livonia), I strongly recommend you disregard “walkabilty” and stay south of 70 and west of 170 and make the commute. Kirkwood (sans Meacham Park, a mini-ghetto around a nice area) and Webster Groves are walkable and generally safe, but unfortunately your budget/targeted housing size may be a challenge in those safe areas.

The northern parts of St Louis City/County are generally not safely “walkable.” If you choose St. Charles County, that is an excellent route, you’ll get the most for your housing dollar but at least get west of 5th Street.

I’m surprised you’re leaving Detroit during this histrionic economic upturn, especially as St. Louis has a vastly higher crime rate than Detroit these days.

Thank you for the advice! My wife has added St Charles County to her preliminary list, although I currently prefer to be closer to downtown and all it has to offer. We will certainly spend some time there and see how the pros and cons fall out, relative to the other options.

As far as leaving Detroit, my wife and I have been in the metro Detroit area all our lives and we are ready for a change. She wants to leave the epicenter of ongoing family drama. We wanted to be in a warmer climate and have more access to housing within our budget without sacrificing quality schools or having a heavy commute. This job opportunity provides a significant salary increase and St Louis seemed to align pretty well with our wants. It will also be nice to get out of the cyclical automotive-based job market. Maybe it's a case of "the grass being greener" but we are excited about the change.

Crime rate is something that will factor in to our eventual purchase decision. From what I've been reading on this forum, it seems like much of the crime (at least violent crime) is centered within the sketchier areas and where we're considering is considered reasonably safe. Although no area is immune to crime, I don't get a sense that we need to worry too much in Maryland Heights, Richmond Heights, St. Charles, etc. Do you think this is inaccurate or overly simplistic?

[FrankMiller]

Originally Posted by RMili292

Crime rate is something that will factor in to our eventual purchase decision. From what I've been reading on this forum, it seems like much of the crime (at least violent crime) is centered within the sketchier areas and where we're considering is considered reasonably safe. Although no area is immune to crime, I don't get a sense that we need to worry too much in Maryland Heights, Richmond Heights, St. Charles, etc. Do you think this is inaccurate or overly simplistic?

If you want to take crime rate statistics very seriously (which you should not), Detroit regularly tops St. Louis in violent crimes, so I think UncommonValor is being a bit of a homer in this regard. And as your comment hints at, these crime rates are specific to the city, not the suburbs. Even within the cities, the actual crime rates would vary dramatically by neighborhood, if you could somehow obtain credible data at that level.

[STL1980]

St. Louis overall is actually quite safe, and if you look at crime per person in the metro area, we're not even a top 30 crime city. St. Louis City (not including St. Louis County) is only 11% of the region, and per capita within the city, it does get pushed up higher, which is why we make those top crime lists.
Also, if you want to consider catholic or private schools, Pasadena Hills is walk-able to UMSL, and is completely safe and affordable. We love it.
https://www.zillow.com/homes/3927-Ro...,-MO-63121_rb/

https://www.instagram.com/pasadenahills/

[RMili292]

Originally Posted by FrankMiller

If you want to take crime rate statistics very seriously (which you should not), Detroit regularly tops St. Louis in violent crimes, so I think UncommonValor is being a bit of a homer in this regard. And as your comment hints at, these crime rates are specific to the city, not the suburbs. Even within the cities, the actual crime rates would vary dramatically by neighborhood, if you could somehow obtain credible data at that level.

Yeah, credible data may be a challenge. I'm going to factor in, to some extent, anecdotal evidence I receive along the way from those living in, or having experience with, some of our options. Neither is perfect but using both can help paint a more accurate picture, I think.

[RMili292]

Originally Posted by STL1980

St. Louis overall is actually quite safe, and if you look at crime per person in the metro area, we're not even a top 30 crime city. St. Louis City (not including St. Louis County) is only 11% of the region, and per capita within the city, it does get pushed up higher, which is why we make those top crime lists.
Also, if you want to consider catholic or private schools, Pasadena Hills is walk-able to UMSL, and is completely safe and affordable. We love it.
https://www.zillow.com/homes/3927-Ro...,-MO-63121_rb/

https://www.instagram.com/pasadenahills/

Thanks, that place looks really nice! At $150k, that leaves a lot of room for tution, too. I will pass this on to the chief decision maker