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Always be cautious of someone who claims to speak for the masses.
As a Raleigh native and property owner. He certainly doesn't speak for me. Bring em all on! Apple,Amazon,Army!!!
I'd also imagine these companies will bring quite a few 30,40,$50,000 jobs also. So not only overpaid hipsters will benefit. Btw who determines who's overpaid anyway?
As a Raleigh native and property owner. He certainly doesn't speak for me. Bring em all on! Apple,Amazon,Army!!!
I'd also imagine these companies will bring quite a few 30,40,$50,000 jobs also. So not only overpaid hipsters will benefit. Btw who determines who's overpaid anyway?
Yes. What most people seem to not understand is that it's not just about 50,000+ jobs for educated, high income hipsters. Amazon and/or Apple coming to the area will help to create many jobs in other areas like construction, food&beverage, retail...the list goes on and on.
Many more new businesses will come to the area driven out of sheer demand. There will be more opportunities at all income levels.
Location: Chapel Hill, NC, formerly NoVA and Phila
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uncchgrad
Yes. What most people seem to not understand is that it's not just about 50,000+ jobs for educated, high income hipsters. Amazon and/or Apple coming to the area will help to create many jobs in other areas like construction, food&beverage, retail...the list goes on and on.
Many more new businesses will come to the area driven out of sheer demand. There will be more opportunities at all income levels.
I think the fear is that Amazon and/or Apple coming will drive up the cost of housing and increase traffic. So while other lower-end jobs may also be created, it will be hard for potential employees of those lower-end jobs to afford to live here. More traffic and congestion means those lower-end employees will be dealing with long commutes if all they can afford is to live farther out.
As someone who lived in Northern Virginia, I can attest that it is very difficult to find affordable housing. Most people without college degrees/good jobs are forced to live very far out and traffic is terrible. Thus, Northern Virginia is very much a region of "haves." Those who are working lower-wage jobs are very limited on where they can live and often double/triple/quadruple up to afford housing.
For some people, the appeal of the Triangle is that it is/was a mid-size region that is/was affordable to people at all income levels and it is also an easy place to live with regard to getting around the region. Adding something like Amazon to the region will surely change the dynamics and cost of the region, and it is understandable that not everyone wants the area to change into a largely unaffordable, congested region like Northern Virginia.
ETA: I say the above as someone who really has no opinion on wanting or not wanting Amazon or Apple coming here. I am just "passing through" the Triangle and have no long-term plans to stay, so I am trying to look at the ramifications objectively without my desires clouding my judgement.
Yes. What most people seem to not understand is that it's not just about 50,000+ jobs for educated, high income hipsters. Amazon and/or Apple coming to the area will help to create many jobs in other areas like construction, food&beverage, retail...the list goes on and on.
Many more new businesses will come to the area driven out of sheer demand. There will be more opportunities at all income levels.
No one's doubting that new businesses would likely pop up. But at what cost? In Seattle, not only did Amazon severely displace minority communities, but housing costs everywhere shot up with skyrocketing rents and the homeless problem grew even worse. Loss of local businesses, increased traffic woes, and a host of other problems were and still are in the picture for Seattle.
In May, Amazon escalated a fight over a proposed tax that would help alleviate the city's affordable housing and homelessness crises. The company does not want to pay the tax, so it's halting major expansion plans in Seattle. Now you know why they want to go elsewhere, don't you? They're looking for the next fool of a city to welcome them with open arms, massive tax breaks, and cheap costs just so they can get out of paying their fair share to said city.
If you've ever read about the working conditions at Amazon (both in tech and non-tech/warehouse roles) from previous and current employees, you'd realize how incredibly toxic the workplace culture is and how prevalent the culture is of ruthlessly cutting costs to the detriment of their workers.
So no, I wouldn't agree that there would be "more opportunities at all income levels." The middle class is only going to shrink even further, and Seattle and San Francisco are just two testaments to that.
The question one has to remember is, how are we going to provide the infrastructure needed for this if Amazon comes here? They clearly don't want to help the local community in Seattle and it shows. There's just no world in where an increase in corporate tax breaks can coexist with increased funding for the public services needed to justify Amazon coming here in the first place.
No one's doubting that new businesses would likely pop up. But at what cost? In Seattle, not only did Amazon severely displace minority communities, but housing costs everywhere shot up with skyrocketing rents and the homeless problem grew even worse. Loss of local businesses, increased traffic woes, and a host of other problems were and still are in the picture for Seattle.
In May, Amazon escalated a fight over a proposed tax that would help alleviate the city's affordable housing and homelessness crises. The company does not want to pay the tax, so it's halting major expansion plans in Seattle. Now you know why they want to go elsewhere, don't you? They're looking for the next fool of a city to welcome them with open arms, massive tax breaks, and cheap costs just so they can get out of paying their fair share to said city.
If you've ever read about the working conditions at Amazon (both in tech and non-tech/warehouse roles) from previous and current employees, you'd realize how incredibly toxic the workplace culture is and how prevalent the culture is of ruthlessly cutting costs to the detriment of their workers.
So no, I wouldn't agree that there would be "more opportunities at all income levels." The middle class is only going to shrink even further, and Seattle and San Francisco are just two testaments to that.
The question one has to remember is, how are we going to provide the infrastructure needed for this if Amazon comes here? They clearly don't want to help the local community in Seattle and it shows. There's just no world in where an increase in corporate tax breaks can coexist with increased funding for the public services needed to justify Amazon coming here in the first place.
I hear your propaganda, but I live in the real world. I have spent much time in Seattle, the place where people such as yourself have claimed that Amazon is running the place into the ground. If you ever visit the place and actually talk to the residents and real, living employees of Amazon, you'll get a very different picture. Yes, I agree that a number of people have been displaced as a result of Amazon's capitalistic nature and rapid growth, but the net effect is that Amazon has been good for Seattle in many ways. This comment is not coming from something i've read, but rather from what i've witnessed firsthand.
Furthermore, i've lived and worked in Silicon Valley for over a decade and the same is true there. It rarely is as bad as what you read. Most writers are paid to do a job just like the rest of us, and that is to make money, which is why so many of the articles that you read are designed to capture readers attention with gossipy type content. What captures more attention...Amazon is a predatory company that takes advantage of the little guy to help the wealthy or Amazon is the biggest supporter of LGBT rights in the country?
Furthermore, i've lived and worked in Silicon Valley for over a decade and the same is true there. It rarely is as bad as what you read. Most writers are paid to do a job just like the rest of us, and that is to make money, which is why so many of the articles that you read are designed to capture readers attention with gossipy type content. What captures more attention...Amazon is a predatory company that takes advantage of the little guy to help the wealthy or Amazon is the biggest supporter of LGBT rights in the country?
Silicon Valley has about the worst culture imaginable for raising a family, and a non-existent community ethos. It's every one for themselves there. Sure there are "suburbia" activities and all that but it's a pressure-cooker, keeping-up-with-the-Joneses environment. Further, I've never seen zip codes that are super wealthy have such decrepit public spaces, from trash on the roadsides and exits to graffiti in neighborhood parks. People just aren't stewards of their surroundings or of each other there. The money is great but the lack of community or a common purpose aside from capitalistic endeavors is soul-crushing.
That's why I took my Silicon Valley salary and work from the Triangle once I got senior enough to go remote. I want to also do my small part to introduce tech and tech people to Raleigh not as a way of ruining this area but as a way of down-voting the way people out there do things outside of work. There is a better way.
Raleigh is going to grow just as fast without Amazon or Apple. Or might not even grow that much faster (but higher paying) considering there’s only a finite amount of talent from the region.
Raleigh’s been one of the fastest growing cities.
So those tiredly against amazon or Apple... the growth is coming from either the Amazon’s of the world or the smaller players
Amazon didn't want to pay the head tax because the Seattle City Council has a habit of being wasteful and inefficient. I can't say that I blame them.
A tremendous amount of money, time, and land has already been allocated or spent to provide infrastructure necessary for anticipated population increases. I440 widening, I40 widening, 540 completion, interchange improvements at the Airport exits, Ridge Road/Glenwood, the BRT, commuter rail, and Union Station are all the result of continued and anticipated growth. In Durham/CH you have the light rail project. The Little River Reservoir project will move forward once there is demand for more water.
On the arts and parks front you have Dix, Moore Square, Smokey Hollow, and numerous City Parks scattered throughout. We have a relatively recent expansion to the Memorial Auditorium, and a fairly new convention center and amphitheater.
The City is looking at a 20 story municipal building just to house their own operations.
I'm not afraid of change. We're going to see the population increase whether it's Apple and Amazon or a 100 other smaller companies. It's going to be faster with a large hiring commitment, but the population is going to increase until we're no longer so attractive.
You're going to have to deal with it, so the best option is probably going to be figuring out how to make the most of it. Think about how to help your children be prepared to take advantage of the opportunities that will come from having new Fortune 100 companies in their back yard.
I hear your propaganda, but I live in the real world. I have spent much time in Seattle, the place where people such as yourself have claimed that Amazon is running the place into the ground. If you ever visit the place and actually talk to the residents and real, living employees of Amazon, you'll get a very different picture. Yes, I agree that a number of people have been displaced as a result of Amazon's capitalistic nature and rapid growth, but the net effect is that Amazon has been good for Seattle in many ways. This comment is not coming from something i've read, but rather from what i've witnessed firsthand.
Furthermore, i've lived and worked in Silicon Valley for over a decade and the same is true there. It rarely is as bad as what you read. Most writers are paid to do a job just like the rest of us, and that is to make money, which is why so many of the articles that you read are designed to capture readers attention with gossipy type content. What captures more attention...Amazon is a predatory company that takes advantage of the little guy to help the wealthy or Amazon is the biggest supporter of LGBT rights in the country?
So people who disagree with you are somehow not living in the "real world" but rather some fantasy in la-la land?
The problem with your perspective is that is is coming from someone who appears to be very familiar with the successes of tech industry, yet very few of the problems. It's implied that you probably have worked in tech or still do and are thus immune to many of the issues these companies have inflicted onto their host communities that deal with people in vastly different socioeconomic and financial situations than yourself. How exactly does Amazon benefit the citizens of Seattle other than its employees? There are numerous ways in which it has detracted from the quality of life, but I've yet to see much evidence for how it has improved things besides for the immediate workers of Amazon.
And if Amazon is indeed the biggest supporter of LGBT rights as you say, then I should probably stop worrying about Amazon coming to Raleigh.
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