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Old 11-14-2012, 09:23 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles County, CA
29,094 posts, read 26,132,922 times
Reputation: 6130

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThinkBeforeYouVote View Post
Marxism is not about repression, it's about giving the people power over the means of production...that's hardly repression. .
Yes - and Marxist-Leninism produced a repressive and oppressive society. That is inevitable when you put all the power into a small oligarchy who claim to represent the "people" and take away individual liberty and discourage personal initiative.

Capitalism is all about giving people power over the means of production. In a capitalist society, there is no ingrained limit to the extent that a person may succeed if they put in the work, time, capital, and passion.

You called capitalism "thievery". How so - when capitalism is the embodiment of a free market, where no one has to engage in any transaction except by their own will.

ObamaCare changes that - now we are taxing people simply for drawing air - and forcing them to buy a product whether they wish to or not.

That is a violation of natural law.

Anybody who buys into the ridiculous notion that the Soviet Union was a "workers paradise" needs to lay off whatever it is they are smoking.
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Old 11-14-2012, 09:25 PM
 
Location: Greater Boston
342 posts, read 573,273 times
Reputation: 79
Stalin.
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Old 11-14-2012, 09:28 PM
 
2,548 posts, read 2,172,078 times
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The soviet union fell after Reagan said, "tear down that wall"
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Old 11-14-2012, 09:32 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles County, CA
29,094 posts, read 26,132,922 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deh74 View Post
Stalin.
Stalin was pretty bad but he isn't why the SU collapsed. He was long gone and even Krushchev tried to implement reforms - which was part of why he was forced out - the hard-liners didn't like him.

IMO, the Soviet Union failed due to an unsustainable economic system, the war in Afghanistan, the long tradition of revolutionary activism in Russia which produced a dissatisfied and vocal faction during the late 1980's, and the emergence of a leader who would listen to those voices of dissent and accommadate them - Mikhail Gorbachev. It was inevitable that the Soviet Union would fall - no communist country can survive for long without implementing some free market reforms. Vietnam, the People Republic of China, and Cuba have made such reforms and thus are still somewhat viable - but they had to compromise in order to survive..

North Korea doesn't look good - they may be the next casualty of Marxist-Leninism.
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Old 11-14-2012, 10:33 PM
 
4,911 posts, read 3,445,760 times
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Gosh, that one's easy if you're a con. What happened was that one day big brawny burly Ronald Reagan said "Mr Gorbechov tear down this wall" in his deep manly voice that stuck fear into the hearts of the commies (there was probably a girl nearby swooning and saying "my hero!" too) so they tore down the wall because they didn't want to mess with big bad Ron.
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Old 11-14-2012, 10:40 PM
 
4,911 posts, read 3,445,760 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frugality View Post
The soviet union fell after Reagan said, "tear down that wall"
I see you subscribe to the big brawny Ronald Reagan theory
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Old 11-15-2012, 08:42 AM
 
2,117 posts, read 1,889,218 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
It fell because of massive debt for one. It also fell because various states wanted to secede and become independent countries -- and it fell because the people had no common bonds.

Hmmmmm.....sounds a lot like the USA now is.
Yes. And a lot of former soviet states are now better off for it. "Sometimes we just grow apart"
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Old 11-15-2012, 09:15 AM
 
Location: Beautiful Niagara Falls ON.
10,016 posts, read 12,642,499 times
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According to many goofballs the USSR collapsed because ole Ronney called them "The evil empire" LOL
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Old 11-15-2012, 09:18 AM
 
Location: England
26,272 posts, read 8,485,614 times
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The book 'Animal Farm' by George Orwell is very interesting. It was written a long time before the USSR collapse, but gives you a good idea what was wrong in Russia.

I remember a very politically involved teacher at school giving a few pupils this book to read, me among them. She asked me earnestly after I read it, "did you understand the book David?" "Sure" I replied chirpily, "the animals drive out the farmer, and take over the farm. Then the pigs get uppity, and boss the other animals about - easy." I can still see her eyes rolling in her head. "Stupid boy" her only comment.
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Old 11-15-2012, 09:18 AM
 
Location: Central Ohio
10,846 posts, read 15,003,696 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LostInHouston View Post
You recognize that all 'isms aren't simply black and white? There is a sliding scale... e.g. a country like Canada can have elements of capitalism and socialism and be prosperous in wealth and health.
and so can European countries like Spain, Portugal, Italy, France and Greece!
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