Backwards in Tennessee, Creationism Creeps Into Classrooms (accuse, education, governor)

[HistorianDude]

Originally Posted by TheCalifornianWriter

Okay, I like it so far, but keep in mind that, in the Bible, scientific "facts" (your kind) aren't limited to miracles.

Anything else is no different from any ordinary work of fiction. To recount such examples as if they are signs of divine participation would be the equivalent of trying to stone someone to death with popcorn.

Originally Posted by TheCalifornianWriter

How about when Jesus was crucified and the Romans used a lancia to pierce his side. Water came out; watery, deluded blood. That is a fact. No other civilization knew that (probably because crucifixion was a Roman thing).

I'm pretty sure the word you were looking for was "diluted," and even that would be wrong. But this fails prong three of the four part test... it would have been something that anybody who simply looked at it would be capable of seeing. It is an observation of the obvious requiring no particular scientific knowledge whatsoever. Any "civilization" familiar with dead bodies (that would be pretty much all of them at the time) would have known this.

Originally Posted by TheCalifornianWriter

Also, I don't see how a fiction book of any kind couldn't have some science in it. Science is all around us and everything from gravity to water's behavior is dictated by science.

Bingo. You are starting to get the point. There is nothing special about the Bible in this regard.

Originally Posted by TheCalifornianWriter

No, it is the difference between super-human writers and average writers. I love the fact that you misplace the blame, though.

You seem profoundly unfamiliar with the general fidelity of ancient texts. There is nothing super-human in this regard. It is completely ordinary, and can be seen with just as great fidelity in even older texts such as the Greek tragedies and the books of Homer.

Your effort to take God off the hook for the errors in the Bible is quaint. As an apologetic tactic however, it is flaccid to the point of uselessness. If it really is your argument that the Bible is simply the ordinary product of ordinary writers and should therefore be held to no higher standard, we are in furious agreement.

Originally Posted by TheCalifornianWriter

And they did set out to copy it word for word, but they had only a few manuscripts and oral tradition...and managed to turn out something nearly the same over a millennium...that's the amazing part you seem to miss. But, hey, dismiss it, right?

There is nothing amazing about it. It is completely ordinary.

Now... perfect copying!! That would be a pretty spectacular evidence of something extraordinary. But there is no example of that.

[Beatles4evr]

Originally Posted by Visvaldis

Tennessee's Governor didn't sign the "Monkey Bill", but creationism will have a place in the classroom.
Each step forward for creationism is a step backward for science.

Tennessee law allows creationism theory in classrooms - chicagotribune.com

Creationism is mythology - no place in science classroom, where factual subject matter lives.

[BigCityDreamer]

Originally Posted by InTheNameOfGod

Science and religion do mix? Only 15 percent of scientists at major research universities see religion and science always in conflict

It depends on how "religion" is defined. If religion is simply "a spiritual attitude, awe and reverence towards nature and the universe and the connectedness of all things" then there isn't much conflict between science and religion. In fact, they may even support each other.

However, if religion is "Jesus Christ, the only Son of God, was crucified and resurrected as a sacrifice for the sins of humanity for all time so that we may all have eternal life if we believe in him" then there is MASSIVE conflict between science and religion.

[SityData]

Scientific Fact or Principle - Bible reference - Date of discovery by man

Both man and woman possess the seed of life Genesis 3:15 17th Century
There is a place void of stars in the North Job 26:7 19th Century
Earth is held in place by invisible forces Job 26:7 1650
Taxonomic classification of matter Genesis 1 1735
The Earth is round Isaiah 40:22 15th Century
Certain animals carry diseases harmful to man Leviticus 11 16th Century
Early diagnosis of leprosy Leviticus 13 17th Century
Quarantine for disease control Leviticus 13 17th Century
Blood of animals carries diseases Leviticus 17 17th Century
Blood is necessary for life Leviticus 17:11 19th Century
Oceans have natural paths in them Psalms 8:8 1854
Earth was in nebular form initially Genesis 1:2 1911
Most seaworthy ship design ratio is 30:5:3 Genesis 6 1860
Light is a particle and has mass (a photon) Job 38:19 1932
Radio astronomy (stars give off signals) Job 38:7 1945
Oceans contain fresh water springs Job 38:16 1920
Snow has material value Job 38:22 1905, 1966
Infinite number of stars exist Genesis 15:5 1940
Dust is important to survival Isaiah 40:12 1935
Hubert Spencer's scientific principles Genesis 1 1820
Air has weight Job 28:25 16th Century
Light can be split up into component colors Job 38:24 1650
Matter is made up of invisible particles Romans 1:20 20th Century
Plants use sunlight to manufacture food Job 8:16 1920
Arcturus and other stars move through space Job 38:32 19th Century
Water cycle Ecclesiastes 1:7 17th Century
Life originated in the sea Genesis 1 19th Century
Lightning and thunder are related Job 38:25 19th Century
Man was the last animal created Genesis 1 15th Century

[HistorianDude]

Originally Posted by SityData

Scientific Fact or Principle - Bible reference - Date of discovery by man

Both man and woman possess the seed of life Genesis 3:15 17th Century
There is a place void of stars in the North Job 26:7 19th Century
Earth is held in place by invisible forces Job 26:7 1650
Taxonomic classification of matter Genesis 1 1735
The Earth is round Isaiah 40:22 15th Century
Certain animals carry diseases harmful to man Leviticus 11 16th Century
Early diagnosis of leprosy Leviticus 13 17th Century
Quarantine for disease control Leviticus 13 17th Century
Blood of animals carries diseases Leviticus 17 17th Century
Blood is necessary for life Leviticus 17:11 19th Century
Oceans have natural paths in them Psalms 8:8 1854
Earth was in nebular form initially Genesis 1:2 1911
Most seaworthy ship design ratio is 30:5:3 Genesis 6 1860
Light is a particle and has mass (a photon) Job 38:19 1932
Radio astronomy (stars give off signals) Job 38:7 1945
Oceans contain fresh water springs Job 38:16 1920
Snow has material value Job 38:22 1905, 1966
Infinite number of stars exist Genesis 15:5 1940
Dust is important to survival Isaiah 40:12 1935
Hubert Spencer's scientific principles Genesis 1 1820
Air has weight Job 28:25 16th Century
Light can be split up into component colors Job 38:24 1650
Matter is made up of invisible particles Romans 1:20 20th Century
Plants use sunlight to manufacture food Job 8:16 1920
Arcturus and other stars move through space Job 38:32 19th Century
Water cycle Ecclesiastes 1:7 17th Century
Life originated in the sea Genesis 1 19th Century
Lightning and thunder are related Job 38:25 19th Century
Man was the last animal created Genesis 1 15th Century

Not a single one of these silly claims can pass the 4 part test.

For example, anybody who bleieves that "Where is the way where light dwells? and as for darkness, where is its place," means that "Light is a particle and has mass" is a blithering numbskull.

[Nephler]

[BigCityDreamer]

Originally Posted by SityData

Scientific Fact or Principle - Bible reference - Date of discovery by man

Both man and woman possess the seed of life Genesis 3:15 17th Century
There is a place void of stars in the North Job 26:7 19th Century
Earth is held in place by invisible forces Job 26:7 1650
Taxonomic classification of matter Genesis 1 1735
The Earth is round Isaiah 40:22 15th Century
Certain animals carry diseases harmful to man Leviticus 11 16th Century
Early diagnosis of leprosy Leviticus 13 17th Century
Quarantine for disease control Leviticus 13 17th Century
Blood of animals carries diseases Leviticus 17 17th Century
Blood is necessary for life Leviticus 17:11 19th Century
Oceans have natural paths in them Psalms 8:8 1854
Earth was in nebular form initially Genesis 1:2 1911
Most seaworthy ship design ratio is 30:5:3 Genesis 6 1860
Light is a particle and has mass (a photon) Job 38:19 1932
Radio astronomy (stars give off signals) Job 38:7 1945
Oceans contain fresh water springs Job 38:16 1920
Snow has material value Job 38:22 1905, 1966
Infinite number of stars exist Genesis 15:5 1940
Dust is important to survival Isaiah 40:12 1935
Hubert Spencer's scientific principles Genesis 1 1820
Air has weight Job 28:25 16th Century
Light can be split up into component colors Job 38:24 1650
Matter is made up of invisible particles Romans 1:20 20th Century
Plants use sunlight to manufacture food Job 8:16 1920
Arcturus and other stars move through space Job 38:32 19th Century
Water cycle Ecclesiastes 1:7 17th Century
Life originated in the sea Genesis 1 19th Century
Lightning and thunder are related Job 38:25 19th Century
Man was the last animal created Genesis 1 15th Century

You believe that allegory and mythology should be interpreted as science?

:facepalm:

[SityData]

THAT IS PRICELESS - !! ROFLMAO

Nothing more ever need be said - that "painting" says it all!

A painting is simply proof - man made! or did it "evolve"?

A blank canvas - some paint & brushes wait 200 years and it magically Just happened with no help from anyone!

[HistorianDude]

Originally Posted by SityData

THAT IS PRICELESS - !! ROFLMAO

Nothing more ever need be said - that "painting" says it all!

A painting is simply proof - man made! or did it "evolve"?

A blank canvas - some paint & brushes wait 200 years and it magically Just happened with no help from anyone!

Never underestimate SD's transcendent capacity to completely miss the point.

[Nephler]

Heck, I was going to say he didn't take enough time to think about it, though that could be a very long time.