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What is the point of marriage these days? No seriously, what point does it serve, other than certain tax and other gov't benefits?
It's not as if once a couple gets married, they have provided with a wealth on knowledge on how to properly raise children. An unmarried couple can raise a child just as well as a married couple. a piece of paper that states you are legally married will not automatically alter how you decide to raise children. there are married couples who suck at child rearing and there are unmarried couples that produce wonderful, well adjusted children
You can't even use the "stability of the child" argument considering the high divorce rates. These days, married couples are just as likely to break up as long term, unmarried couples. It takes a bit longer w/ a married couple, but in the end, the results are the same: the child is no longer living w/ both parents.
There's zero guarantee that a married couple can afford to raise a child more so than an unmarried couple can. There are married couple barely making ends meet and there are unmarried couples w/ cash to spare to give their kids whatever they want
Honestly, what do you get out of marriage that you can't get out of a long term relationship w/o the "marriage" label? The only things I can think of are:
-tax benefits
-insurance benefits (though I think LT couple w/ kids can get as good as rates as married couples, not sure)
-access to a sick/injured loved ones (though unmarried couples can get the same in many situations)
-ease of divvying up property and assets when you get divorced
I can't think of anything a married couple could gain that an unmarried couple can't have that's not tied to some gov't related benefits. Take the gov't out of it and there is really no difference between a married and unmarried couple other than a piece of paper
To answer the question, no, I see absolutely nothing wrong w/ people having kids outside of marriage. marriage doesn't guarantee stability, a loving home, or even good parenting.
I truly think that, in this day in age, where we don't need to track the lineage of nobility for the purpose of passing down lands, where we no longer vilify illegitimate children, and no longer vilify those who get divorced, marriage isn't needed. It's just a cultural ritual we're loathed to get rid of. I don't see the point of it at all outside of the gov't benefits.
I think people are confusing the issues here. there's a difference between people in a LTR raising kids and a single parent raising a child. People keep talking about statistics about the number of convicts who grew up in single homes or the number of single parent homes on food stamps as if the only choice is being a married couple or being a single parent. my folks were together for 15+ years and were never married. I'm not a convict, nor did our family use food stamps or any sort of gov't aid. there are couples who've been together for years, even decades, that aren't married.
People in LTRs have their reasons for not getting married and it often has nothing to do w/ a lack of commitment. People don't need to prove their love for one another by getting married. A couple isn't going to love each other more just because they threw an expensive wedding ceremony, went through the wedding drive-thru at Vegas, or signed some papers at a gov't official's office. It's highly likely that I won't get married. This doesn't mean I want to be a single mom. I just can't be bothered w/ the hypocrisy and joke that marriage has become
No one who seems appalled by OOW children has been able to answer my question: what is the point of marriage, outside of certain gov't benefits?
I am not. On mother's day a child was baptized at my church. The parents were boyfriend and girlfriend. Why do they feel no shame? I am so confused...
Is this something to celebrate? I think every kid deserves an ADULT as a parent. So am I wrong?
Yep, I've got two, and we aren't married.
I don't need government approval or paperwork to tell me who I want to be with, or their involvement if we decide to split up later.
A marriage certificate doesn't give people a degree in child-rearing or parenthood. The idea that a couple must be married to procreate is ridiculous and antiquated. I have seen married couples who should never have been parents and single parents who are exceptional. IMPO I don't care if someone is married or not, as long as they take care of their children.
I am not. On mother's day a child was baptized at my church. The parents were boyfriend and girlfriend. Why do they feel no shame? I am so confused...
Is this something to celebrate? I think every kid deserves an ADULT as a parent. So am I wrong?
I can't understand a church person not being Christian and judging someone else. Stop throwing stones!
It is not fair to the child. If the parents can't commit to one another, why have children?
I think that some people think of procreation as an accomplishment.
It is not.
Accomplish some thing first. Have something to offer your children. Grow up first.
My kids are teens and they have no interest in having babies.
They look forward to college, travel, so many things.
I am happy that they feel this way. I did too.
You assume that marriage is the only way to commit to someone, why is that?
You talk about growing up first, as if the only way of growing up is to marry someone, why is that?
My father stayed with my step mom for 8 years before they got married (mainly because he got cancer and the were legal reasons to do so), they were no less committed to each other before the marriage.
Choosing to be with someone, even when it's hard has nothing to do with a band of precious metal on your finger, it's a personal choice, and frankly, if you can only be committed to someone and act as a grown up if you do have that band on your finger, I'd say thats a much bigger issue than people having children out of wedlock.
Quote:
Originally Posted by markg91359
Once again, I feel shocked at the number of the people who feel that marriage is an unnecessary and dispensable process. Studies have continuously shown over the last forty years that most of the convicts in prison come from single parent homes. They have shown that the average educational attainments of children of single parents are less than those of children coming from a two-parent household. The correlation between the single parent household and participation in food stamps, TANF, WIC, Medicaid, and other taxpayer-funded programs is extremely heavy. Another way of saying this is that the children raised in single parent households in America are the ones most likely to live in poverty.
I know some people will angrily jump up and say that single parenting works fine for them and they have never taken a dime of financial assistance from anyone. Great. Exceptions exist for every rule that is out there. It still doesn't make it right.
Sometimes, single parenthood truly cannot be prevented and I sympathize with those who fall into that category. Divorce and the death of a spouse do occur. However, these situations are becoming the exception rather than the rule. What is becoming all-too-common is the situation where a woman simply makes a choice to deliberately parent without a spouse. People can defend this until the cows come home it doesn't make it any more right. When divorce occurs, a legal framework exists for setting parameters for issues like custody, visitation, and the duty of a parent to provide health insurance. That framework is much more sketchy when no legal marriage exists. Children of single parents are statistically less likely to collect court ordered child support than children in a divorced situation.
Its not about "morality" and "judging people". Its about making accurate comparisons between two groups in a population and concluding that one manner of raising children has advantages that the other does not.
I fear that the world that we adults have created for children is not as good as the one in which we were raise. The social consequences of what we have done may be many years in the making.
As the OP, you seem to be under the impression that there's no middle ground between being married and being a single parent. There are plenty of people in long term relationships who aren't married who raise children just fine without a ring on their finger.
No one can really argue that there's a statistical difference in the success of children from single parent households and children from a household with two parents.
But having two parents in the household does not mean they have to be married, and statistically, it doesn't even have to be your biological parents.
In the original post, the OP was in an uproar because of two loving parents baptizing their new born child together, there's nothing to indicate, at least from the OP's posts, that this child will grow up in a single parent household, and if both parents are there, it has no significance whether they are married or not.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Driller1
IMO, if you want kids you should be married.
Marriage is a contract and a promise.
No one keeps a promise they never made.
I'm fully capable of giving a promise to my significant other without having a Justice of the Peace or Judge present.
I would argue that it's a far bigger problem if people only manage to stay together if they have a wedding band on their finger. To me it makes absolutely no difference, because when I enter into a relationship with someone and it get serious, I plan on it lasting for the long haul, whether or not I say some words in front of a judge has no impact on my determination, nor make me hesitate leaving if the situation required it.
I have to say, I feel sorry for people who do not have the integrity to commit to someone on their own.
While I'd rather every child had two married parents, I don't understand your gripe with baptism. Baptism is a sacrament. The ritual is for the baby, not for the parents, and certainly not for you.
That's not technically true. At baptism, the parents and the congregation are speaking for the infant, who cannot speak for himself or herself, and promising to raise the child in the faith, so the ritual is indeed for everyone present. The child will repeat the baptism vows on his or her own behalf at confirmation.
Has nothing to do with whether the parents are married, however. I've been to the baptism of a child who had gay male parents, who were not married because it was illegal for them to marry. They did have a church union blessing ceremony subsequent to the baptism of their son, however.
I don't see how a piece of paper is going to make someone a better or not better Parent. There are couples who are married, that are the worse parents in every way. I know some who live together and have children, have a great marriage, and are great Parents.
Besides for those that do have a problem with it, no way your going to stop it. As long as the Parents are loving, responsible, compassionate, mature Parents i don't see why not. I think we as Americans Fret over the wrong things in life.
Can't beat ourselves up for things we cannot change, i have come to learn that. And as far as the oustide of marriage, this concept has been going on strong for some time, a very long long time, only thing in the early eras, it was very HUSH HUSH, where today it is not.
Having children whether you are married or not, is a Gift, and should be cherished, married or not.
Location: Partisanship Is An Intellectual/Emotional Handicap
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sheena12
I am not. On mother's day a child was baptized at my church. The parents were boyfriend and girlfriend. Why do they feel no shame? I am so confused...
Is this something to celebrate? I think every kid deserves an ADULT as a parent. So am I wrong?
What business is it of yours?
You actually believe I federally approved contract of marraige makes for a more stable environment for raising children and that it makes you an " Adult"? LMAO!
Live in reality much?
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