My First "Restaurant Rant" Thread -- A Tribute To Parents Who Teach Their Children Manners (day care, bullying)

[beachmel]

Originally Posted by crisan

I will be honest. My daughter should not be in restaurants or in eating areas like the mall. She will not sit down for more than 3 minutes most of the time and will start running and pushing chairs around.

So if I am expecting to have lunch outside of the home, I do not give her any snacks before mealtime to be sure she is very hungry. Hopefully this means sitting quietly for 7 minutes. I also bring or buy finger foods for me so I can eat on the go as soon as she is done sitting.

There is no such thing as "Shhh. Sit quietly please." I accepted that, make myself ready to leave and don't make other people suffer.

I did get a compliment once but the mother also said that she didn't take her children out for a long time. This was at a breakfast place in an upper-middle class area. We sat for a total of 10 minutes. Before that we were outside walking around. I usually sit her down a couple of minutes after the food is served so it cools down.

I have seen younger toddlers behave much better than she does, like sitting quietly with a toy for up to 45 minutes.

People claim to teach their children how to behave in restaurants. How do you do this? Do you allow your child to scream in their high chair at home until the "get it" that they stay their until mom says so?

First of all, I'd like to thank Hopes for her compliments. Mine are grown now, but we have our grandson with us and he is being taught to have impeccable manners as well. At two, he is saying " 'cuze me peez", if he needs something or wants to pass by you in a small area.....always says, "thank you", "you're welcome". We're working on restaurant manners as well.

Okay Crisan.....this is how we handled things when raising our kids.
1) Screaming or throwing food...playing in food, etc. while in the high chair, after the age of 1 yr old. First couple of offenses....verbal reprimand. From there on out..."You're done! If you're not going to sit and behave and eat your dinner....your dinner is OVER!" There is NO feeding him snacks, no giving him anything off of others' plates, NADA! He is expected to go sit QUIETLY until everyone else is done." When my kids were out of their high chairs, same thing. "You will behave at each and every meal, not play with your food, not get up and down from the table. If you get down, with the exception of one trip to the restroom....you're DONE! PERIOD!! Your plate will be removed from the table, and you will sit there quietly, until the rest of the family is done eating!"

Rules never changed, we never conceeded, and if our child didn't want to eat his/her dinner, it was placed in the refrigerator under Saran wrap. If they wanted to eat it later, THAT was what they got....no dessert, no PB sandwich, etc. For restaurant outings, the same rule was applied. They were lectured on the way to the restaurant of the consequences of misbehavior...."We'll go into the bathroom and you'll get a spanking if you misbehave or You will go to bed as soon as we get home, while the rest of us watch a movie or play a game"...etc. Most importantly and I do STRESS this point....If you say you're going to do something you DO it! Do not ever, EVER tell your child you're going to do something that you don't do!

That last point is something that sticks in my craw every time I hear it. Do not LIE to your child. You will lose all credibility. If you KNOW you can't or WON'T do something to them, as a consequence of their actions, do NOT say you're going to! That is the biggest mistake parents make. Discuss on the way to the restaurant what you are going to do if she misbehaves. A firm squeeze on the arm and a low threatening tone may do the trick...getting just a bit louder if necessary, accompanied by the "going to the restroom" threat. If it continues, head to the restroom...swat, if necessary! Don't bring the child out until they're done crying. I have removed a child from the restaurant, letting hubby know he needed to get mine and my child's food in a to-go bag, and took him out to the car, letting the others eat their food in silence. I insisted they stay and eat in peace. One time.....ONE is all it took!

When we took our kids to the restaurant after that, they BELIEVED I'd take them to the car if there was so much as ONE inapproprate peep or move out of them! There are ways of dealing with misbehavior. If you can NOT get your child to eat, with manners and respect, at a restaurant, then you need to be one of those families who order takeout....PERIOD! I know that sounds bitchy, but it's a plain and simple fact. If you have a child who can not sit still and quiet, once you've tried and stuck to a disciplinary plan, you need to have them evaluated to see if there is a medical problem. Others should not have to suffer with you. People who do bring unruly children to a restaurant are setting a terrible example for behaved children....and many people who are out for dinner are trying to relax and have a pleasant meal. Heck, some of them are out to get AWAY from children. They shouldn't have to put up with yours.

Hopes, I am far less "considerate" than you, apparently. If someone's child was behaving like you described, I WOULD have said something. I would have told the mother, "Would you mind getting your child under control!? I do NOT appreciate him shoving his chair into mine. Keep your child at your own TABLE! That is unbelievably RUDE of you!!" Believe me, I would have spoken to her like a misbehaving child. I have done so in restaurants and several things have happened...other patrons have loudly thanked me, staff have thanked me, the people with the unruly children have gotten their food boxed up and left out of humiliation (one called me a ***** under her breath), and in a couple of cases, it reinforced the parents' attempts to get their children under control. "LOOK, you are ruining others' dinner, now GET back in your chair and do NOT move or you will go sit in the car!" Also, remember this.....once other patrons start complaining about others' children, the staff has an obligation to ask them to remove them from the restaurant. I've seen that happen, too! LOL

[beachmel]

Originally Posted by no kudzu

Oh No.
Generally a kid will act in public the same way it does at home. And parents discipline or not in public the same way at home.

I would never let my kid scream in a high chair till they "get it". And I am very careful about food issues since I'm aware this can cause alot more problems later down the road.

There isn't just one thing we do except the general concept that the parents are in charge and not the kids. That permeates into every aspect of parenting.

We aren't bossy and mean. We just carry ourselves and speak to our children letting them know they get privleges as they earn them.

I think alot of younger parents are afraid of their children. They seem to be afraid to exert any control over their kids, afraid they will kill their spirit. Most folks will tell you kids want boundaries. They are testing the waters very early and the sooner you set those boundaries, the better for everybody.

My job as a parent is not to make sure my kids like me every minute of the day but to prepare them for each new challenge as it comes before them with self confidence and self discipline.

I absolutely agree!! Nothing does more for a child's confidence, more than people walking up to the table and telling them, "I am so impressed with how well behaved you are! Thank you so much for being such GOOD kids. I have never SEEN such beautiful manners from children. You should be PROUD of yourselves!!" My kids heard that ALL the time! I have approached tables of other customers and told THEIR children and THEM, just how awesome I think they are and how PROUD they should be of their children. When a family is complimented like that, it makes everyone feel great. You can just see the kids puffing up at the compliments and gratefulness on the parents' faces.

[crisan]

Originally Posted by beachmel

First of all, I'd like to thank Hopes for her compliments. Mine are grown now, but we have our grandson with us and he is being taught to have impeccable manners as well. At two, he is saying " 'cuze me peez", if he needs something or wants to pass by you in a small area.....always says, "thank you", "you're welcome". We're working on restaurant manners as well.

Okay Crisan.....this is how we handled things when raising our kids.
1) Screaming or throwing food...playing in food, etc. while in the high chair, after the age of 1 yr old. First couple of offenses....verbal reprimand. From there on out..."You're done! If you're not going to sit and behave and eat your dinner....your dinner is OVER!" There is NO feeding him snacks, no giving him anything off of others' plates, NADA! He is expected to go sit QUIETLY until everyone else is done." When my kids were out of their high chairs, same thing. "You will behave at each and every meal, not play with your food, not get up and down from the table. If you get down, with the exception of one trip to the restroom....you're DONE! PERIOD!! Your plate will be removed from the table, and you will sit there quietly, until the rest of the family is done eating!"

Rules never changed, we never conceeded, and if our child didn't want to eat his/her dinner, it was placed in the refrigerator under Saran wrap. If they wanted to eat it later, THAT was what they got....no dessert, no PB sandwich, etc. For restaurant outings, the same rule was applied. They were lectured on the way to the restaurant of the consequences of misbehavior...."We'll go into the bathroom and you'll get a spanking if you misbehave or You will go to bed as soon as we get home, while the rest of us watch a movie or play a game"...etc. Most importantly and I do STRESS this point....If you say you're going to do something you DO it! Do not ever, EVER tell your child you're going to do something that you don't do!

That last point is something that sticks in my craw every time I hear it. Do not LIE to your child. You will lose all credibility. If you KNOW you can't or WON'T do something to them, as a consequence of their actions, do NOT say you're going to! That is the biggest mistake parents make. Discuss on the way to the restaurant what you are going to do if she misbehaves. A firm squeeze on the arm and a low threatening tone may do the trick...getting just a bit louder if necessary, accompanied by the "going to the restroom" threat. If it continues, head to the restroom...swat, if necessary! Don't bring the child out until they're done crying. I have removed a child from the restaurant, letting hubby know he needed to get mine and my child's food in a to-go bag, and took him out to the car, letting the others eat their food in silence. I insisted they stay and eat in peace. One time.....ONE is all it took!

When we took our kids to the restaurant after that, they BELIEVED I'd take them to the car if there was so much as ONE inapproprate peep or move out of them! There are ways of dealing with misbehavior. If you can NOT get your child to eat, with manners and respect, at a restaurant, then you need to be one of those families who order takeout....PERIOD! I know that sounds bitchy, but it's a plain and simple fact. If you have a child who can not sit still and quiet, once you've tried and stuck to a disciplinary plan, you need to have them evaluated to see if there is a medical problem. Others should not have to suffer with you. People who do bring unruly children to a restaurant are setting a terrible example for behaved children....and many people who are out for dinner are trying to relax and have a pleasant meal. Heck, some of them are out to get AWAY from children. They shouldn't have to put up with yours.

Hopes, I am far less "considerate" than you, apparently. If someone's child was behaving like you described, I WOULD have said something. I would have told the mother, "Would you mind getting your child under control!? I do NOT appreciate him shoving his chair into mine. Keep your child at your own TABLE! That is unbelievably RUDE of you!!" Believe me, I would have spoken to her like a misbehaving child. I have done so in restaurants and several things have happened...other patrons have loudly thanked me, staff have thanked me, the people with the unruly children have gotten their food boxed up and left out of humiliation (one called me a ***** under her breath), and in a couple of cases, it reinforced the parents' attempts to get their children under control. "LOOK, you are ruining others' dinner, now GET back in your chair and do NOT move or you will go sit in the car!" Also, remember this.....once other patrons start complaining about others' children, the staff has an obligation to ask them to remove them from the restaurant. I've seen that happen, too! LOL

Then that is what we pretty much do at home. I don't do it to teach manners but simply because I won't put up with that kind of behavior when I am trying to eat.

I think that I am so used to parents allowing that behavior in public. I really thought I was missing something or that I my expectations were too high. I just don't have the energy to put up with it and I am not letting her run around because "Mom, needs time to herself."

I remember one mom telling me, "well, my life doesn't stop just because I don't think my daughter is ready for a restaurant." My life doesn't stop either. I take my daughter out and we are done.

[lucygirl951]

Originally Posted by beachmel

If you can NOT get your child to eat, with manners and respect, at a restaurant, then you need to be one of those families who order takeout....PERIOD! I know that sounds bitchy, but it's a plain and simple fact. If you have a child who can not sit still and quiet, once you've tried and stuck to a disciplinary plan, you need to have them evaluated to see if there is a medical problem. Others should not have to suffer with you. People who do bring unruly children to a restaurant are setting a terrible example for behaved children....and many people who are out for dinner are trying to relax and have a pleasant meal. Heck, some of them are out to get AWAY from children. They shouldn't have to put up with yours.

Yep. If a child cannot sit still and eat a meal, then the parents shouldn't take the child to a restaurant where his/her behavior might disturb others. Period. For some people, that might be the one dinner out in a month that they budgeted for. Our rights end where other people's begin.

It starts in the house with parents being parents, not negotiators, parents.

Another thing that I think helps children keep under control is a daily routine. Children need rest and proper nutrition.

But the biggest problem as I see it is too much television/electronic entertainment. If kids watch more than an hour a day at a young age (1-5), they don't learn how to entertain themselves.Children who spend most of their day playing with their toys, drawing pictures, or looking at books will know how to sit quietly at a table in a restaurant with a box of crayons and notepad.

[beachmel]

Originally Posted by crisan

Then that is what we pretty much do at home. I don't do it to teach manners but simply because I won't put up with that kind of behavior when I am trying to eat.

I think that I am so used to parents allowing that behavior in public. I really thought I was missing something or that I my expectations were too high. I just don't have the energy to put up with it and I am not letting her run around because "Mom, needs time to herself."

I remember one mom telling me, "well, my life doesn't stop just because I don't think my daughter is ready for a restaurant." My life doesn't stop either. I take my daughter out and we are done.

No Crisan, your expectations are not too high. Continue to have the courage to try. You're on the right road. With some kids, it takes a little more than others. If she's crying after "getting it" in the restaurant, you might have to hang out in the bathroom for a few more minutes until she gets it under control.

My kids didn't get attention at home if they were going on and on after getting disciplined. I'd tell them that if they were going to continue bawling and feeling sorry for themselves, they were welcome to do so.....IN THEIR ROOMS, and I BETTER NOT HEAR IT, also, I BETTER not hear anything being thrown around or they were gonna "get it again!" LOL To be honest with you, I rarely had to come down hard on my kids. I did it good early on, was completely consistent, never said I was going to do something that I WOULDN'T do, ALWAYS did what I said I was going to do, and made sure that the punishment fit the crime. Also, I COUNTED....I did not count to 10! The absolute highest I ever counted was to 5...usually 3! I never counted twice! If I said, "I'm gonna give you to the count of 3. You BETTER be doin' it! On 3, I was up and on them! ALWAYS! It didn't take long before the word ONE...was all it took, they knew mom was counting! ......OH CRAP!

Addition here.....pet peeve that has always made me crazy? Parents who do the counting thing several times. I'm going to give you to the count of 10. Parent counts, parent rants and raves at child, child stands there looking at parent like, "whatEVER"...Parent says, "Did you hear me? I TOLD you to get your shoes on...1,2,3...etc. Do it NOW, I'm counting......1,2,3... by this time, I'm wanting to grab the parent by the ears and say, "HELLO!! or WHAT!? Are you STUPID!? Get UP!! and DO something about it. OMG! They're telling you NO...They're telling you, "You aren't gonna do anything, you're just gonna SIT there and bi*ch!" LOL "You're an idiot! and you wonder why your kid won't MIND!!??" Do not tell your child over and over and over again to DO something! Tell them....then ACT if they're not minding! Jeez! What are the consequences? Your gonna tell 'em AGAIN! Oooohhhh that's scary!

[Hopes]

Originally Posted by crisan

People claim to teach their children how to behave in restaurants. How do you do this? Do you allow your child to scream in their high chair at home until the "get it" that they stay their until mom says so?

We had our children eat sit down family dinners with us since the day they were born as much as possible. By the time they were close to two, they were sitting at the table without a high chair. We always said nicely, "We sit at the table until everyone is done eating." In the early years, we didn't drag our meals out for an hour. We probably were done eating in 20 to 30 minutes.

We didn't allow our children to "excuse themselves" from the table until they were much older---late elementary school ate. They didn't even know being excused from the table was an option until they were much older----old enough to understand there are different rules for public and at home (because you can't excuse yourself from a table at a restaurant for any reason no matter how old you are).

We also started table manners between 1 and 2 years old. We would say, "We eat with our mouths closed." And stuff like that. It wasnt' dictatorship. It wasn't stressful and mean. We simply taught them at a very young age and as a result they really grasped it.

You asked if we would leave our child screaming in a high chair at home? Well, YES! I would absolutely leave a child screaming in a high chair. The minute you take a child out of a high chair due to screaming, you've taugh the child to scream whenever the child wants out of the high chair.

All children are capable of sitting at a dinner table until the adults are done eating. All children.

How old is your daughter? If she's significantly older, we can come up with other ideas, like time out.

[lhpartridge]

Originally Posted by beachmel

First of all, I'd like to thank Hopes for her compliments. Mine are grown now, but we have our grandson with us and he is being taught to have impeccable manners as well. At two, he is saying " 'cuze me peez", if he needs something or wants to pass by you in a small area.....always says, "thank you", "you're welcome". We're working on restaurant manners as well.

Okay Crisan.....this is how we handled things when raising our kids.
1) Screaming or throwing food...playing in food, etc. while in the high chair, after the age of 1 yr old. First couple of offenses....verbal reprimand. From there on out..."You're done! If you're not going to sit and behave and eat your dinner....your dinner is OVER!" There is NO feeding him snacks, no giving him anything off of others' plates, NADA! He is expected to go sit QUIETLY until everyone else is done." When my kids were out of their high chairs, same thing. "You will behave at each and every meal, not play with your food, not get up and down from the table. If you get down, with the exception of one trip to the restroom....you're DONE! PERIOD!! Your plate will be removed from the table, and you will sit there quietly, until the rest of the family is done eating!"

Rules never changed, we never conceeded, and if our child didn't want to eat his/her dinner, it was placed in the refrigerator under Saran wrap. If they wanted to eat it later, THAT was what they got....no dessert, no PB sandwich, etc. For restaurant outings, the same rule was applied. They were lectured on the way to the restaurant of the consequences of misbehavior...."We'll go into the bathroom and you'll get a spanking if you misbehave or You will go to bed as soon as we get home, while the rest of us watch a movie or play a game"...etc. Most importantly and I do STRESS this point....If you say you're going to do something you DO it! Do not ever, EVER tell your child you're going to do something that you don't do!

That last point is something that sticks in my craw every time I hear it. Do not LIE to your child. You will lose all credibility. If you KNOW you can't or WON'T do something to them, as a consequence of their actions, do NOT say you're going to! That is the biggest mistake parents make. Discuss on the way to the restaurant what you are going to do if she misbehaves. A firm squeeze on the arm and a low threatening tone may do the trick...getting just a bit louder if necessary, accompanied by the "going to the restroom" threat. If it continues, head to the restroom...swat, if necessary! Don't bring the child out until they're done crying. I have removed a child from the restaurant, letting hubby know he needed to get mine and my child's food in a to-go bag, and took him out to the car, letting the others eat their food in silence. I insisted they stay and eat in peace. One time.....ONE is all it took!

When we took our kids to the restaurant after that, they BELIEVED I'd take them to the car if there was so much as ONE inapproprate peep or move out of them! There are ways of dealing with misbehavior. If you can NOT get your child to eat, with manners and respect, at a restaurant, then you need to be one of those families who order takeout....PERIOD! I know that sounds bitchy, but it's a plain and simple fact. If you have a child who can not sit still and quiet, once you've tried and stuck to a disciplinary plan, you need to have them evaluated to see if there is a medical problem. Others should not have to suffer with you. People who do bring unruly children to a restaurant are setting a terrible example for behaved children....and many people who are out for dinner are trying to relax and have a pleasant meal. Heck, some of them are out to get AWAY from children. They shouldn't have to put up with yours.

Hopes, I am far less "considerate" than you, apparently. If someone's child was behaving like you described, I WOULD have said something. I would have told the mother, "Would you mind getting your child under control!? I do NOT appreciate him shoving his chair into mine. Keep your child at your own TABLE! That is unbelievably RUDE of you!!" Believe me, I would have spoken to her like a misbehaving child. I have done so in restaurants and several things have happened...other patrons have loudly thanked me, staff have thanked me, the people with the unruly children have gotten their food boxed up and left out of humiliation (one called me a ***** under her breath), and in a couple of cases, it reinforced the parents' attempts to get their children under control. "LOOK, you are ruining others' dinner, now GET back in your chair and do NOT move or you will go sit in the car!" Also, remember this.....once other patrons start complaining about others' children, the staff has an obligation to ask them to remove them from the restaurant. I've seen that happen, too! LOL

We started a bit before that, probably around 8 months. The dinner hour was for family time and conversation. If anyone misbehaved at the table, it was time to go to the bedroom. After everyone else had finished, the offending child could finish supper in the bedroom or have a peanut butter and jelly sandwich or a bowl of cereal followed by an early bedtime. This happened very rarely.

Our son was not well-behaved in general, but he knew that the consequences for public misbehavior were much more severe. Even when we had other conduct issues going on, he generally behaved himself at restaurants. We rarely took him out before the age of 5 because we did not want to distract other diners with our disciplinary actions. The trips to Playland at McDonald's were the least successful because he would want to go into the child zone and refuse to come when we called. Then it would be months before he would get another chance. He was a limit-tester by nature and needed clear rules and consequences. Even then, he would almost always test them to see what would happen.

Once or twice we sent him to bed without him finishing his supper. This did not harm him. On the other hand, it gave him a visceral awareness of the consequences of crossing the boundaries. Having to go to sleep with a growling stomach tends to provoke an appreciation for the next meal. Of course, all these experiences were accompanied with explanations of expectations and consequences. They were not done on a whim.

I agree with never telling a child he will receive a consequence and then failing to follow through. That is one problem my in-laws had. Never having had strong-willed children themselves, they didn't understand that our son would play them and promise to behave when he wanted something, only to backslide once he got what he wanted. They never learned and it made it much more difficult for us to hold to our decisions.

It is rarely too late to teach a child to behave in public. It just takes a parent who has more patience and a stronger will than the child, two things many parents lack. It also takes a lot longer for a child who has learned that he can get away with misbehavior because children can hold out nearly forever to get what they want. Once a parent says NO, they can not reverse the decision. That's all it takes for a child to think next time--if I keep on, I'll get what I want. Kids are experts in wearing down adults. You have to outlast them.

[Milleka]

Originally Posted by Hopes

I was at a popular sit down pizza joint at the mall today. It was packed---every table taken.

The table near us had two mothers with three young children. One mother had a four year old. The other had a six year old and a three year old. Dressed super cute in Christmas sweater dresses. Stunningly beautiful children, not just due to their outfits.

These kids were all over the place. I really didn't care until one mother yelled at her child. It was so loud. Right in my ear. The tables are packed in this restaurant. She was only 18" away from me. Her yell was ineffective. The kid didn't stop. As a matter of fact, the children got worse. Fortunately, the mother didn't continue yelling. But she didn't do anything.

Then the kids start grabbing empty chairs, their empty chairs from their table and empty chairs from neighboring tables, and pushing them around the floor and around their table, between that 18" space between the mother's seat and our table. One chair gets stuck. The kid is pushing it. Our table is rocking. The mother never even turns around to stop the child. She had to have known---her chair was being pushed too! And the chairs dragging on the tile floor were loud, sounded like nails on a chaulk board. The whole restaurant could hear these chairs but the parents were oblivous.

I know people have posted in previous "restaurant" threads that we should expect these things in family style or informal restaurants. BUT WHY do people think this is acceptable? This restaurant was PACKED with families and parents who had well-behaved children. Every other child in this restaurant managed to sit in their seats quietly!

I didn't say a word. When they left, my son (who had been grabbing spare chairs from the children and pushing them behind where he was sitting) commented on how aweful their behavior was and their mothers' not saying anything. I told him that was why we required him to sit at the dinner table until everyone was done eating when he was younger. Young children don't learn how to behave in public at restaurants if they are not taught at home.

I wanted to go to each of the tables with well behaved children and thank those parents for having taught their children! All too often, we only notice that parents with misbehaving children. I think all of the parents who have children who behave should be commended!

So, my "restaruant rant" thread is a tribute to all parents out there who taught their children how to behave in public!

You are in the majority and you deserve recognition!

One of the greatest compliments my husband and I ever received was from an elderly couple who had just finished their meal and were on their way out the door. The woman stopped at our table and said, "I just want to tell you what a pleasure it was to watch your children during my meal. They are very well behaved. You are good parents for teaching your children how to behave in public". I will never forget it... especially as I have encounters such as yours on an ever increasing basis. It's very sad how parents just let their kids have free-reign.

[crisan]

beachmel, I hear you about some parents giving warnings (especially in a sweet voice) but never acting. In public I tell her "sit down or stroller" and I never fail to put her in the stroller when she unwittingly chooses that option. It is extremely tiring to follow through and sometimes, my only option is the one that hurts the most, having to leave before taking care of the things I needed, but then that means anything else we planned to do that was fun, goes out the window.

Hopes, I hate to admit it but I think we are at that point where we have to let her cry in her high chair. I will add however, that she seems to get it now but at 1 year of age, no way. So, yes, we as parents are recognizing when our expectations for our daughter have to change as she matures. It is what we are most comfortable with (maybe we are the slow ones). However, I do like beachmel's idea of sending her to her room if she cannot behave properly because my daughter responds well to "options". At least I can have a nice, quiet dinner instead of going through that "training" period.

But I will try your suggestions about how you explain your expectations at the table. Also, I think my expectation of having a longer dinner was a bit too high.

[beachmel]

Originally Posted by crisan

beachmel, I hear you about some parents giving warnings (especially in a sweet voice) but never acting. In public I tell her "sit down or stroller" and I never fail to put her in the stroller when she unwittingly chooses that option. It is extremely tiring to follow through and sometimes, my only option is the one that hurts the most, having to leave before taking care of the things I needed, but then that means anything else we planned to do that was fun, goes out the window.

Hopes, I hate to admit it but I think we are at that point where we have to let her cry in her high chair. I will add however, that she seems to get it now but at 1 year of age, no way. So, yes, we as parents are recognizing when our expectations for our daughter have to change as she matures. It is what we are most comfortable with (maybe we are the slow ones). However, I do like beachmel's idea of sending her to her room if she cannot behave properly because my daughter responds well to "options". At least I can have a nice, quiet dinner instead of going through that "training" period.

But I will try your suggestions about how you explain your expectations at the table. Also, I think my expectation of having a longer dinner was a bit too high.

Crisan,
One of the biggest reasons we "sent them away" when they were misbehaving in "the unit", is that they didn't "deserve" the privilege of being with us. That was let be known. It's torture, to not be included in the dinner time conversation and giggles. Try to approach the table? Nope! "Excuse me? Get back in the other room and sit down. You should have thought about that BEFORE you started that misbehaving business! Now, go away, we're eating dinner." OMG.....they HATE that! LOL

It's the same when children get older. If you can't behave in a civilized and social manner, you will remove yourself from the presence of others until you can appreciate the need to be socially appropriate...(aka, nice)! None of our children had televisions or computers in their rooms. At one time, when our oldest was young, we had a video game, but that was removed if they were in trouble. Sorry, you're not going off to entertain yourself with electronics, this is punishment (solitary confinement). This worked fabulously with my children as they are all extremely social. Fate worse than death.....NO! Don't send me to my room alone! If it was their choice to be in there alone, they were fine....being sent there alone was another thing.

Children need to know that if they're being inappropriate and disruptful, they must not be allowed to rattle everyone elses cage and ruin THEIR dinner time. Honestly, I've known parents who, on dinner-out night, have actually sent the whole family out to dinner with the "good kids", but one parent stayed home with lil misbehavin child, who had to make themselves a PB & J sandwich for their dinner. The others went to dinner, a movie, etc. Again... it generally only takes one time for a child like that to realize, "OMG! I HATE that. They got to go have fun and go to dinner and all I got was a stupid peanut butter sandwich." As a fellow poster just said, YOU have to be more patient and stubborn than your children. I always told my children and now tell my grandchild....."You WILL not win with me, so you might as well get used that fact right now. It stops now! You WILL not WIN!"