[smithy77]

Originally Posted by harshbarj

They were blocking a city street (a street that everyone uses, even the so called 99%). Nothing to discuss. Their motives are irrelevant once they start breaking laws. That IS substance.

As I have said before, I agree with much of what they want HOWEVER I disagree with their tactics. All they are doing is turning public opinion against them.

Of course they were breaking laws----that's the point. It got your attention, didn't it? It also got the attention of the press and the nation. A protest action with a bunch of people gathered on the sidewalk with signs in front of a lobbyists office wouldn't even make the local papers. The whole point of the action was to draw attention to their issues---and it did. It got the discussion rolling, even here on the little ol' Omaha Forum. I'd say it was quite a success.

[harshbarj]

Originally Posted by smithy77

Of course they were breaking laws----that's the point. It got your attention, didn't it? It also got the attention of the press and the nation. A protest action with a bunch of people gathered on the sidewalk with signs in front of a lobbyists office wouldn't even make the local papers. The whole point of the action was to draw attention to their issues---and it did. It got the discussion rolling, even here on the little ol' Omaha Forum. I'd say it was quite a success.

It got my attention and has turned me even more AGAINST the movement. I am not alone in this either. The more crimes they commit the more public opinion has turned. At one point almost every story about the protests was full of pro OWS comments, today it is rare to see a positive comment.

A truly successful protest draws peoples attention not by breaking laws and being thugs, but by following the law and drawing peoples attention to the problem. Once a protest resorts to violence and breaking laws, it has lost.

[smithy77]

Originally Posted by harshbarj

It got my attention and has turned me even more AGAINST the movement. I am not alone in this either. The more crimes they commit the more public opinion has turned. At one point almost every story about the protests was full of pro OWS comments, today it is rare to see a positive comment.

A truly successful protest draws peoples attention not by breaking laws and being thugs, but by following the law and drawing peoples attention to the problem. Once a protest resorts to violence and breaking laws, it has lost.

"Thugs?" Hardly. "Violence?" Nope. It got your attention, too. It hasn't "lost". On the contrary, everyone in the country is talking about the OWS movement. It has changed the political narrative in this country. "Lobbyist" is now a four-letter word. People are now aware of the enormous political power wielded by a very small number of people with vast resources ($). It didn't lose YOUR support because it never had it to begin with. Non-violent civil disobedience has a long history in this country. It involves breaking some laws at times. Read Martin Luther King's famous "Letter from a Birmingham jail". We just dedicated a huge monument to him on the National Mall in DC. I don't think you're in a position to lecture us on what constitutes a "truly successful protest." Go to the source-----study your history.

[MountainMen]

Originally Posted by harshbarj

Once a protest resorts to violence and breaking laws, it has lost.

What violence? What laws were broken? The only violence I've seen was from police using excessive force @ UC Davis and the only laws broken were by police illegally assaulting and arresting innocent people.

http://thechaparral.com/wp-content/u...per-spray1.jpg

[harshbarj]

This group is hardly innocent of crimes. If you plug your ears or stuff your head in the sand they would seem peaceful.

this is not even a complete list and it over a month old.

Arson

• Occupy Fort Collins – Member arrested, $10 million in damage
• Occupy Portland - Member arrested for throwing Molotov Cocktail
• Occupy Seattle – Suspicious fire at Bank of America 2.7 miles from camp
• Occupy Portland – Three men arrested with homemade grenades

Assault/Threats

• Occupy SF – 12 assaults in 24 hours
• Occupy LA – 4 assaults including two with knives
• Occupy Philly – Man punches woman in the face
• Occupy LA – Two assaults including setting someone on fire
• Occupy Berkeley – Police respond to three assault calls per night
• Occupy Wall Street – Three men threaten the life of a sexual assault victim
• Occupy Lawrence – Punch thrown
• Occupy Orlando – Knife fight sends man to hospital
• Occupy Portland – Multiple assaults within a 24 hr. period
• Occupy Toledo – Man assaults police officer after arrest
• Occupy San Diego – Woman assaults cameraman
• Occupy Victoria – Man dumps urine on city worker
• Occupy Vancouver – Two police officers bitten during near riot
• Occupy Oakland – Death threats
• Occupy Austin – Man in Joker make-up arrested for brandishing knife
• Occupy Oakland – Man sets his dog on reporter
• Occupy Oakland – Man pulls a knife in camp
• Occupy Wall Street – Photographer assaulted

Drugs/Dealing

• Occupy Boston – Two drug busts in a week
• Occupy Boston – Another drug arrest
• Occupy Boston – Heroin dealers busted were living with 6 year old boy directly behind welcome tent
• Occupy Portland – First hand account “Drugs. Selling…Heroin. Meth.”
• Occupy Portland – Video of open drug use in the camp
• Occupy Portland – “I get high“

Fraud

• National Lawyer’s Guild member Ari Douglas pretends to be run over by a police scooter

Illness/Death

• Occupy Santa Cruz – Ringworm outbreak
• Occupy Atlanta – TB outbreak
• Occupy Wall Street – Zuccotti lung outbreak
• Occupy New Orleans – Man discovered in tent had been dead 2 days
• Occupy Portland – Body lice outbreak

Murder

• Occupy Oakland – Fatal shooting

Public disturbance

• Occupy Dallas – Protesters block bank entrance, 23 arrested
• Occupy Vancouver – Mob with bullhorn enters bank
• Occupy Wall Street – Protesters block bank entrance, four arrested
• Occupier takes a bathroom break in the street
• Occupy Vancouver – Occupiers disrupt debate, threaten riot when asked to leave
• Occupy Long Beach – Group disrupts city council meeting
• Occupy Boston – Three arrested for occupying Burger King
• Occupy Oakland – Yelling and nonsense at Burger King
• Occupy DC – Group storms AFP event, traps attendees inside

Rape/Sexual Assault

• Occupy Philly – Man arrested for alleged rape
• Occupy Wall Street – Two sexual assaults unreported to police
• Occupy Wall Street – Man arrested for sexual assault, suspect in rape
• Occupy Dallas – Sex offender allegedly rapes 14 year old
• Occupy Ottawa – Sexual assaults go unreported to police
• Occupy Lawrence – Sexual assault reported
• Occupy Toronto – Foot sniffer arrested
• Occupy Seattle – Man exposes himself to young girls
• Occupy Portland – Sexual assault
• Occupy Wall Street – Drunk gropes women in Zuccotti Park
• Occupy Cleveland – Rape reported after an overnight stay
• Occupy Glasgow – Possible gang rape
• Occupy Baltimore – Multiple reports of harassment
• Occupy Chicago – Man arrested for child porn
• Occupy LA – Man charged with exposing himself to a child

Sedition

• Occupy DC – Let’s have a coup by taking over the military
• Ted Rall wants occupiers to choose the path of violence
• Occupy DC – Mike Malloy incites crowd to cheer for President Bush’s execution

Suicide/Overdose

• Occupy Burlington – Man kills himself with handgun
• Occupy Salt Lake City – Man found dead with syringe in his tent
• Occupy Vancouver – Young woman dies of cocaine and heroine overdose
• Occupy OKC – Young man with history of drug abuse found dead

Theft

• Occupy Portland – Theft is ongoing
• Occupy Boston – Store owner suffers 4 break-ins since camp began

Vandalism

• Occupy Eureka – Protesters use local bank as a toilet
• Occupy Portland – Two banks vandalized, promises of more to come
• Occupy Oakland – Bank windows broken, Whole Foods vandalized, broken windows
• Occupy Boston – Banks vandalized with anarchist, OWS graffiti
• Occupy Portland – Spike in vandalism near camp
• Occupy SF: ATMs being smeared with feces
• Occupy Santa Fe: Banks vandalized with OWS-themed graffiti
• Occupy San Diego – Vendors cart vandalized with bodily fluids
• Occupy graffiti found on PA governor’s mansion

How any sane person can defend a group like this.

I could see if they were isolated incidents, but they are not and are common amongst OWS groups.

[MountainMen]

I don't have time to go through all these and disprove every one, but with the few I clicked on, there is a very loose connection between crime and the occupy movement. Looks like a lot of homeless men being misidentified as occupiers. In some of the cases, there isn't even a legitimate crime happening. Wake me up when there's a court conviction directly connected to a protest.

[harshbarj]

Originally Posted by MountainMen

I don't have time to go through all these and disprove every one, but with the few I clicked on, there is a very loose connection between crime and the occupy movement. Looks like a lot of homeless men being misidentified as occupiers. In some of the cases, there isn't even a legitimate crime happening. Wake me up when there's a court conviction directly connected to a protest.

You must be breathing in all that cigarette smog again. Should quit as it does nasty things to the mind , like close it to facts.

[JohnBanson]

Admittedly, I'm a johnny-come-lately to this discussion.

Personally, I think the OWS movement has a core of truth and relevance. Unfortunately, there are too many stupid people who are just protesting for the sake of protesting. And the OWS people really aren't going after the right people. As a result, they're not going to accomplish what should be accomplished.

[smithy77]

Originally Posted by MountainMen

I don't have time to go through all these and disprove every one, but with the few I clicked on, there is a very loose connection between crime and the occupy movement. Looks like a lot of homeless men being misidentified as occupiers. In some of the cases, there isn't even a legitimate crime happening. Wake me up when there's a court conviction directly connected to a protest.

What he said.

[smithy77]

Originally Posted by harshbarj

This group is hardly innocent of crimes. If you plug your ears or stuff your head in the sand they would seem peaceful.

this is not even a complete list and it over a month old.



How any sane person can defend a group like this.

I could see if they were isolated incidents, but they are not and are common amongst OWS groups.

In any aggregate, you're going to find crazy people who attach themselves to political movements. OWS is committed to non-violence. It cannot police every person who shows up. That's just the way it is. It was a truism during the civil rights movement, the anti-war movement, the anti-abortion movement, and the anti-nuclear movement. It is also a historical reality (look up "COINTELPRO") that opposition groups and even government operatives (called agent provocateurs) will infiltrate a movement to cause trouble and embarrass it from within.