Married NoVA moms can't afford to work; childcare costs major culprit (student loan, how much)

[OrangeFish]

Originally Posted by car54

If there are other jobs that you can bring your kids to work....I can't think of one.

I know of nannies that bring their kids to work with them. I also know of teachers that have left their profession to become nannies as they can bring their kids to work with them and get better pay (but admittedly not benefits) then their teacher salary.

[CAVA1990]

Am I the only one here who thinks the premise of this article is sexist and antiquated? Kids in a 2 hetero parent home have another parent called a dad who has the same choice. Why is the conundrum only about moms? As an experienced parent I can tell you there's nothing beyond breastfeeding to this job that makes women uniquely qualified. I can feed, bathe, play with, change diapers and the rest as well as anybody regardless of their anatomy.

This sounds like another lame right wing attempt to guilt women back out of the workplace.

[Fern435]

Originally Posted by CAVA1990

Am I the only one here who thinks the premise of this article is sexist and antiquated? Kids in a 2 hetero parent home have another parent called a dad who has the same choice. Why is the conundrum only about moms? As an experienced parent I can tell you there's nothing beyond breastfeeding to this job that makes women uniquely qualified. I can feed, bathe, play with, change diapers and the rest as well as anybody regardless of their anatomy.

Actually, I agree with this. Women aren't inherently better at nurturing children than men, and there are definitely a few women I've met who are TERRIBLE at it (and they have been stay at home moms ).

OrangeFish, it sounds like you have an ideal situation for you with your career and childcare arrangement.

My grumpiness rises when some people feel staying home with children/managing the family is not seen as work, yet somehow being a nanny or a childcare worker is considered a legitimate job. How does raising a child become a REAL JOB when I hand it over to a nanny or daycare, yet it is not if I do the job myself?

Two interesting articles from the NY Times:

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/25/ma...pagewanted=all

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/12/bu...pagewanted=all

[justtitans]

Originally Posted by CAVA1990

Am I the only one here who thinks the premise of this article is sexist and antiquated? Kids in a 2 hetero parent home have another parent called a dad who has the same choice. Why is the conundrum only about moms? As an experienced parent I can tell you there's nothing beyond breastfeeding to this job that makes women uniquely qualified. I can feed, bathe, play with, change diapers and the rest as well as anybody regardless of their anatomy.

This sounds like another lame right wing attempt to guilt women back out of the workplace.

I don't think it's that deep. Here's a quote from the article that kind of addresses your concern:

Since her husband, an attorney, earned more money than she did, it made more sense for Hayken to be the one to stay home.

How often do you find households when the mother makes more? Also if that family wants to have more children then the mother will still have to stop working for a period of time in order to have that child and to heal after the pregnancy. What kind of situation would that family be putting itself in if they risk not having income? I know there maybe some that wants equal rights for women, but it can't work both ways. Men simply cannot have children. I believe men should absolutely do our part in taking care of the children. I know I do with my child, but what you are asking probably won't make sense for most families.

[justtitans]

Originally Posted by stpickrell

$450 a week for a 4-year-old? That's pretty steep.

That's exactly what I was thinking. It was a poorly word sentence. After re-reading it a couple of times, I think they were trying to say that the child care cost was that price when the child was born, but it's extremely hard to tell based on how it was worded.

[justtitans]

I can definitely relate to this article because my wife and I are in a similar situation. She is also a school teacher so for her, her salary isn't much different than the cost of daycare, but she struggles with this. For starters she has gone to college, worked hard for her degree, and even started graduate school. At the same time she also hates the fact that she doesn't get to spend more time with our daughter and that she is looking at the prospects of working again after our second child is born (she is currently pregnant). I honestly don't know what to tell her because I know how hard she worked to get through school and I want her to accomplish her goals as a educator, but with two children, I have wondered if it's really worth it for her to work and pay for daycare for both of our daughters. For all the mothers on here, how do you all deal with that? Do you believe the career ambition plays a role in this being a difficult decision to make? What have you ultimately decided to do?

[Yankeesfan]

Originally Posted by CAVA1990

Am I the only one here who thinks the premise of this article is sexist and antiquated? Kids in a 2 hetero parent home have another parent called a dad who has the same choice. Why is the conundrum only about moms? As an experienced parent I can tell you there's nothing beyond breastfeeding to this job that makes women uniquely qualified. I can feed, bathe, play with, change diapers and the rest as well as anybody regardless of their anatomy.

This sounds like another lame right wing attempt to guilt women back out of the workplace.

In theory, you are correct, either parent can stay home. In practice, it's rarely the dad who volunteers or wants to -- and in many cases where it happens, it's because the dad is unemployed or employed only part-time. I know we have at least one at-home dad on this board, and he has commented on how rare his choice is. What does the "right wing" have to do with this? The women in the article were making their own choice. They could have asked that their husband stay home instead; that would be between them, not political. They could have said that they enjoyed their careers and were glad to pay the price necessary for good care for their children. They did not say that, or choose it.

But I do think it's valid to look at the childcare cost as a percentage of the entire family income. After all, in a two-parent household, the children are the responsibility of both parents, not just one. (And yes they should also be the responsibility of both parents in a single-parent household, but sadly the absentee parent often doesn't see it that way.)

PS -- CAVA, how many years DID you spend as an at-home dad? (I applaud you if you did !)

[chicagotodc]

We are going through this debate in my household right now; my wife makes a good (but not great) salary, but we've calculated that, all in, after we pay the nanny, take out the extra gas costs and parking costs, and lunches out, etc, she's really only bringing down that much - for a job that requires an hour long commute each way and next to no flexibility at all. There's the issue of lost 401k contributions but in PV terms, an extra $50,000 or $100,000 at retirement isnt going to make much of a difference in the grand scheme of things. With that, we are actively searching for something part time for her - not so much because we want to replace the income but because we are worried she wont be able to get back into the workforce if she doesnt do *something*.

I remember the days of being a DINK (dual income no kids).... one day when the daycare cost is gone we will be much better off.

[chicagotodc]

Also for those of you interested in this topic, see Dynamics of the Gender Gap for Young Professionals in the Financial and Corporate Sectors

http://faculty.chicagobooth.edu/marianne.bertrand/research/dynamics_1209.pdf (broken link)

A synopsis: "The presence of children is the main contributor to the lesser job experience, greater career discontinuity and shorter work hours for female MBAs. Disparities in the productive characteristics of male and female MBAs are small, but the pecuniary penalties from shorter hours and any job discontinuity are enormous for MBAs. Mean earnings by sex are comparable directly following MBA receipt, but they soon diverge. Women earn $115K on average at graduation and $250K nine years out; men earn $130K on average at graduation and $400K nine years out. Median salaries by sex also diverge in favor of men with years since graduation but not by as much as do mean salaries."

[mlv311]

Originally Posted by pgtitans

For all the mothers on here, how do you all deal with that? Do you believe the career ambition plays a role in this being a difficult decision to make? What have you ultimately decided to do?

Great question and the answer will vary by person and family. When I chose to be at home full-time, I left a very good job (great salary and benefits) in the law enforcement field. I have a graduate degree and paid for my education through scholarships, fellowships and work. I was very satisfied with my career when my first child was born. My husband and I each took 3 months off under family leave to be with our firstborn. We were fortunate to have that option. When those 6 months were up, I submitted my resignation and my employer offered me PT work. I wasn't sure how it would work out since my duties didn't change, but we managed well at home and work. When we relocated, we decided that I stay home FT. It was a tough decision to make because I have always been financially independent and have supported my mother. One of my main reasons for deciding to stay home is that, even though PT offered flexibility, I was very busy juggling a demanding job and a toddler, and the commute was horrendous. (The commute can be a big deal when you have kids if you don't have a family support network in the area. Any time a child is sick, someone has to leave work ASAP and take care of the child).

Fast forward to today where I have a second child who has special needs. I have been contacted by my employer to return to work, which is very flattering, but I don't think that I would feel at "peace" leaving my children for 12 hours with a nanny or in a daycare facility, especially my special needs child. I know it's a personal decision and every family is different. Some people don't have many options so they have to work. I always thought I'd go back to work when my kids were in school FT, but now I don't know what the future holds. While I have missed my career, I still feel that our family has benefited from having a parent at home FT. Your situation is different because teachers have a more flexible schedule. Even if she chose to stay at home initially, she probably could still work as a tutor or in some other capacity if she didn't want a gap in her resume.

Fern: I couldn't agree with you more. I share your feelings. A SAHM parent can have 12 hour days and be a mother, housekeeper, nurse, tutor, chauffeur, counselor, etc. Attaching an economic contribution of $0 for what we do is insulting and doesn't even begin to put a value on our contribution to human capital and society in general.