What makes you an expert on NoVA? (Arlington, Fairfax: apartments, condo)
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Normie, I have to say that I am glad to see you back on the forum. You make it fun to read and you always have good information. You, along with the other regular advisors on this forum, have been a wonderful resource. I also want to say that, as yet, I have not experienced the unkind or rude attitude that is referenced in this forum. I absolutely love where I live (N. Arlington 22213 near East Falls Church Metro) and the easy access to so many great places. All the people I've met and interacted with have been friendly and helpful. I guess I just don't understand why some posters have had such bad experiences that they repeatedly talk about how rude the people are. Maybe I need to pay more attention.
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Originally Posted by Fairfax Mom
Fern - I agree with you.
The people I like to hear opinions from are not the so-called highly educated or long timers - I like to hear opinions from people who have lived all over - they are the ones that can tell me how NOVA compares to other areas and if people really are more unfriendly here -
Since I am from the NJ area I can say that NJ is friendlier and less crowded - but - that is just my own biased opinion
And - if you ask why I am here when I am not happy - well - the answer is - JOBS ARE HERE
I was born and raised in Nova and lived there from 1988-2009, and have now lived in 2 other states. I thought this while I was still in Nova and now I know it even more. I HATE NOVA. Its a TERRIBLE HORRIBLE NO-GOOD VERY BAD AWFUL HORRIFIC PLACE to live. Most people and almost all drivers in Nova are jerks. Everybody just cares about themselves. Lots of spoiled brat kids. Horrible traffic. Way to much building. Lots of the few woods in Fairfax County just keep getting destroyed. Most people are here just because the jobs are here, not because they want to live in Nova. The only good things are that if you need basically anything you can just go out and get it, and seeing exotic cars pretty often was cool. I will never live in Nova again. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I relocated to Reston in May 2009 after having grown up and been educated in the Scranton/Wilkes-Barre area of Northeastern Pennsylvania. Since then I've spent nearly every weekend hopping into my car (or mass transit) to explore nearly every square inch of the region. I've gone on wine tours, have scoped out numerous mom-and-pop restaurants, have hit up karaoke bars, and have done many hikes.
Some of my favorite haunts include Berryville (minus the ugly sprawl), Winchester (ditto minus the ugly sprawl), Middleburg, Upperville, Hillsboro, Old Town Alexandria, Old Town Leesburg, Old Town Herndon, Warrenton, Culpeper, the Orange Line Corridor of Arlington, and the City of Falls Church. Essentially, if the community was planned out with pedestrians in mind first and then with motor vehicles as the "afterthought" I'm a happy camper. My disdain for Reston comes into play because so many (not all) here are self-centered NIMBYs who are vehemently opposed to any efforts to make the community more walkable by increasing density and promoting transit-oriented developments because they don't realize taking cars off the road is a good thing to ebb our intense rush hour gridlock. Like cdmurphy I, too, never understood the weird fascination many on here have with Vienna, since its downtown is largely just a schlepping of parking lots and ugly strip malls along a congested road (Falls Church City is marginally better in this regard). The "historic" part of Vienna is comprised of a massive two blocks, if that. The "tear downs" in Vienna are really a blight as well. I'm sure it's an excellent place to live, but I never really saw why it was so "superior."
Am I an expert on the area? No. Am I one of the very small minority who is unhappy here? Yes. Why do I stay here? As Fairfax Mom so eloquently put it, NoVA is where all the JOBS are right now, for better or for worse. I'm 23 and have spoken with numerous peers of mine who hate it here and also only tolerate NoVA due to the economy. Out of a spattering of peers of mine who relocated here in 2009, I'm the only one sticking it out in Reston (and God willing I'll be out of here myself in 2011). Nobody on this sub-forum has ever been able to give me a good reason why I should struggle to afford a 1-BR apartment in the automobile-oriented SUBURBS here on my salary when I could move to Pittsburgh, make a comparable salary, and be able to buy my own HOME in the city proper in a WALKABLE neighborhood? I just don't feel as if Fairfax County offers a very good "bang for your buck" factor for non-family households.
I just don't get all the hatred of NoVa. I'm always floored by the courteous behavior I encounter almost daily---people holding doors for me, small talk at the check out lines, neighbors willing to help, etc.. Dunno, maybe I've just had the luck of the draw. I arrived here in the late 70's and immediately loved the area after having lived in several Midwestern states. Being a closeted gay man in the 70's in Nebraska, Oklahoma and Texas was a frightening experience. Moving here was like escaping from North Korea and finding myself in Valhalla. You can't imagine the difference for me. I will be forever grateful to the people of the metro area for their general acceptance of gay folks. The metro area responded beautifully during the AIDS crisis during the 80's and 90's----I've buried many close friends over the years, and because of the support network (and the angels among us) that sprung up to respond to the crisis, I wouldn't have wanted to be anywhere else. Sure, there are haters and small minded people here, but they don't run the show like they do in parts of the rest of the country.
I wouldn't call myself an expert on NoVa, but I've lived all over the metro area for 31 years, was involved in a number of community groups, and I guess that counts for something. Yes, the cost of living is high, but being relatively non-materialistic, I've been very happy in my modest home, driving my modest car. I guess the losses I've experiences in my younger life have taught me what is really important, and it doesn't involve accumulating "toys" or trying to impress people, and I certainly don't envy or surround myself with people who think otherwise.
INobody on this sub-forum has ever been able to give me a good reason why I should struggle to afford a 1-BR apartment in the automobile-oriented SUBURBS here on my salary when I could move to Pittsburgh, make a comparable salary, and be able to buy my own HOME in the city proper in a WALKABLE neighborhood?
Assuming that you feel just as confident in your ability to find a job in Pittsburgh, I would agree with you.
I can't say I'm an expert because there's been so much change, especially in Fairfax County, and I don't get out there much to keep up with the changes. But I've been around a while and consider that I do know a few things (or at least, have opinions on them!)
I moved to the Alexandria part of Fairfax County in 1975, at age 12. I attended George Mason University. I lived in Arlington (Clarendon, Ballston, and Rosslyn) in the late 80s/early 90s, and after 5 years living in DC, moved to the Pentagon City area. At one point I was a delivery driver within NoVA, DC, and PG County, so I was a bit of an expert in getting around.
For the past 9 years, I've lived in the city of Alexandria, now just outside of Old Town. It's as suburban as I could withstand -- I did not experience a re-embracing of NoVA's suburbanity like some here have. I hate going outside the Beltway unless I'm going to the real countryside.
I disagree about NoVA being unusually snooty, or rude, or filled with jerk drivers. The driving situation has changed over the years, in my belief, because of the influx of people from around the world (not just the USA) who bring their driving behaviors with them. But visit many forums here on C-D and you'll find threads about how stupid/terrible/jerk-like their city's drivers are. There's always something to deal with, no matter where you are.
But if I lived in Ffx Co and had to drive, say, from Chantilly or Ashburn to the Pentagon 5 days a week, perhaps I would feel like fiddlestick, above. The fact that I rarely have to drive more than 20 minutes in any given trip probably helps.
NoVA is full of the "no eye contact" and cold shoulder behavior, which doesn't put me off all that much, but I have noticed when traveling how strangers in other places can be so much more engaging and approachable.
NoVA is full of the "no eye contact" and cold shoulder behavior, which doesn't put me off all that much, but I have noticed when traveling how strangers in other places can be so much more engaging and approachable.
This has been one of the biggest drawbacks I've experienced since moving here. There definitely is a "Seattle Freeze"-ish social phenomenon that I've noticed here, and you don't need to venture very far outside of Fairfax County to be relieved of it. I was just in Pittsburgh yesterday and Friday to visit someone, and I managed to strike up random 20-minute conversations with three separate neighbors of his while texting near the sidewalk as he slept inside. Whenever I go to Winchester I also have no problem making a lot of chit-chat. Here? It's a struggle, and it shouldn't be if there weren't so many overstressed and/or self-important personalities living in Fairfax County. Our forum members who live in the Purcellville, Round Hill, Hamilton, and Lovettsville areas of Northwestern Loudoun County even note a stark contrast in the "friendliness" factor contrasted against the generally standoff-ish attitudes here.
I guess different people handle this in different ways. You find the "no eye contact" social mores here to be acceptable while I find it to be off-putting because I'm derived from a more "cozy" area where everyone seemed to know (and look out for) everyone else. Here? It's like an incessant quest to be "top of the heap." I've already been the victim of being tossed under a passing bus (figuratively speaking) in order to advance the happiness and selfish desires of others, and I never had this occur to me until I moved to Fairfax County. The entire world is NOT "dog-eat-dog"; that's just something rude people in Fairfax County say to make themselves feel better about how they slight others.
I just don't get all the hatred of NoVa. I'm always floored by the courteous behavior I encounter almost daily---people holding doors for me, small talk at the check out lines, neighbors willing to help, etc.. Dunno, maybe I've just had the luck of the draw. I arrived here in the late 70's and immediately loved the area after having lived in several Midwestern states. Being a closeted gay man in the 70's in Nebraska, Oklahoma and Texas was a frightening experience. Moving here was like escaping from North Korea and finding myself in Valhalla. You can't imagine the difference for me. I will be forever grateful to the people of the metro area for their general acceptance of gay folks. The metro area responded beautifully during the AIDS crisis during the 80's and 90's----I've buried many close friends over the years, and because of the support network (and the angels among us) that sprung up to respond to the crisis, I wouldn't have wanted to be anywhere else. Sure, there are haters and small minded people here, but they don't run the show like they do in parts of the rest of the country.
I wouldn't call myself an expert on NoVa, but I've lived all over the metro area for 31 years, was involved in a number of community groups, and I guess that counts for something. Yes, the cost of living is high, but being relatively non-materialistic, I've been very happy in my modest home, driving my modest car. I guess the losses I've experiences in my younger life have taught me what is really important, and it doesn't involve accumulating "toys" or trying to impress people, and I certainly don't envy or surround myself with people who think otherwise.
Great post! Rep point for you! I think many of us feel that exact same way. We're just living our lives, trying to help our friends and neighbors, not caring who buys what or how others choose to live their lives.
This has been one of the biggest drawbacks I've experienced since moving here. There definitely is a "Seattle Freeze"-ish social phenomenon that I've noticed here, and you don't need to venture very far outside of Fairfax County to be relieved of it. I was just in Pittsburgh yesterday and Friday to visit someone, and I managed to strike up random 20-minute conversations with three separate neighbors of his while texting near the sidewalk as he slept inside. Whenever I go to Winchester I also have no problem making a lot of chit-chat. Here? It's a struggle, and it shouldn't be if there weren't so many overstressed and/or self-important personalities living in Fairfax County. Our forum members who live in the Purcellville, Round Hill, Hamilton, and Lovettsville areas of Northwestern Loudoun County even note a stark contrast in the "friendliness" factor contrasted against the generally standoff-ish attitudes here.
I guess different people handle this in different ways. You find the "no eye contact" social mores here to be acceptable while I find it to be off-putting because I'm derived from a more "cozy" area where everyone seemed to know (and look out for) everyone else. Here? It's like an incessant quest to be "top of the heap." I've already been the victim of being tossed under a passing bus (figuratively speaking) in order to advance the happiness and selfish desires of others, and I never had this occur to me until I moved to Fairfax County. The entire world is NOT "dog-eat-dog"; that's just something rude people in Fairfax County say to make themselves feel better about how they slight others.
I never had a problem talking to people in the stores in Vienna and don't have out here in western Loudoun either. My neighbors in Vienna were friendly and very helpful. Same out here. I haven't met snobby people in either place. <shrugs>
I guess different people handle this in different ways. You find the "no eye contact" social mores here to be acceptable while I find it to be off-putting because I'm derived from a more "cozy" area where everyone seemed to know (and look out for) everyone else. Here? It's like an incessant quest to be "top of the heap." I've already been the victim of being tossed under a passing bus (figuratively speaking) in order to advance the happiness and selfish desires of others, and I never had this occur to me until I moved to Fairfax County. The entire world is NOT "dog-eat-dog"; that's just something rude people in Fairfax County say to make themselves feel better about how they slight others.
See, this is where I think many newcomers come up with their complaint that NoVA is really rude. They, like you, instantly interpret this "Seattle-freeze-like" characteristic as implying that the other person holds them in low regard. You think they are purposely slighting you, to feel better about themselves. Why?
Do we likewise assume that the stereotypical New England taciturn nature, or Germany's coldness, means that those inhabitants are rude, fighting to get to the top of the heap, and liable to take advantage of you? Their silence or lack of sociability with strangers might fit your definition of "rude", but how do you get from there to a psychological profile of that person as feeling superior to you?
It just is what it is, for various reasons. You have to break through it with extra effort. I say "good morning" to people I pass in my neighborhood whether they seem reciprocating or not. But would I do that at a Metro station platform? No way. See, there are social attitudes about appropriate conduct in various contexts, and these attitudes differ among geographical regions. It doesn't imply bad character of the people.
Even Denton56 above casts it in terms of "people who you can talk to in stores" versus "snobby people". I just don't understand this immediate assumption that a characteristic of being reluctant to engage in social chit-chat with strangers equates with snobbishness. Consider that their behavior may have nothing whatsoever to do with their internal feelings or attitudes about the people around them, or you.
See, this is where I think many newcomers come up with their complaint that NoVA is really rude. They, like you, instantly interpret this "Seattle-freeze-like" characteristic as implying that the other person holds them in low regard. You think they are purposely slighting you, to feel better about themselves. Why?
Do we likewise assume that the stereotypical New England taciturn nature, or Germany's coldness, means that those inhabitants are rude, fighting to get to the top of the heap, and liable to take advantage of you? Their silence or lack of sociability with strangers might fit your definition of "rude", but how do you get from there to a psychological profile of that person as feeling superior to you?
It just is what it is, for various reasons. You have to break through it with extra effort. I say "good morning" to people I pass in my neighborhood whether they seem reciprocating or not. But would I do that at a Metro station platform? No way. See, there are social attitudes about appropriate conduct in various contexts, and these attitudes differ among geographical regions. It doesn't imply bad character of the people.
Even Denton56 above casts it in terms of "people who you can talk to in stores" versus "snobby people". I just don't understand this immediate assumption that a characteristic of being reluctant to engage in social chit-chat with strangers equates with snobbishness. Consider that their behavior may have nothing whatsoever to do with their internal feelings or attitudes about the people around them, or you.
For me this is not the issue, speak to me or don't speak to me, but if you make eye contact with me and I smile at you, then what is it going to hurt you to smile back, heck it might even make your day better.
I don't usually chit chat with those I don't know but if spoken to I will speak to them, to do otherwise IMO is rude and shows a lack of manners. Likewise, if someone smiles at me I smile back. I just can't understand why it is so hard to have manners and be polite.
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