Has anyone moved back to Montreal after leaving the city? (lawyer, job market)
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Wow... reading myself 2 years later makes me scream WOW...
In what state of mind was I when I wrote this?
Maybe I was a little nostalgic about MTL when I wrote this... I came back to finish school and as soon as I finish, I will move the hell out... Montreal is good if you do not speak english and are caucasian.
Most college grad immigrant from latin america, caraibe, africa or african decent european only find jobs in factories or taxi drivers... Since I left Boston, I have not see any minority holding an important job...
uhh.. as an african american I'm wondering which of your two conflicting opinions do you feel is the most accurate for Montreal?
I'm originally from the south but moved to Portland OR so I went from a city nearly 50% black to a city where it's like 3% black with white majority. How would going to Montreal be any different ignoring the language aspect?
Boston is one of the whitest cities in America. It has the reputation of lacking much of a black professional class, let alone a hispanic professional class. Yet Jay is right, even in Boston minorities are quite certainly better represented in positions of power and prestige than in Montreal.
Boston is NOT one of the Whitest cities in America. You're confusing Boston proper with New England as a whole, Boston itself is only 47% White.
Boston is one of the whitest cities in America. It has the reputation of lacking much of a black professional class, let alone a hispanic professional class. Yet Jay is right, even in Boston minorities are quite certainly better represented in positions of power and prestige than in Montreal.
Boston is NOT one of the Whitest cities in America. You're confusing Boston proper with New England as a whole, Boston itself is only 47% White. Furthermore, Black and Hispanic Bostonians have been in the city for nearly a century, whereas Montrealers of colour have only been there since the 70's at earliest.
uhh.. as an african american I'm wondering which of your two conflicting opinions do you feel is the most accurate for Montreal?
I'm originally from the south but moved to Portland OR so I went from a city nearly 50% black to a city where it's like 3% black with white majority. How would going to Montreal be any different ignoring the language aspect?
I am not black and things are not perfect here but one thing I can tell you is that language trumps race in Quebec and Montreal basically every single time.
The vast majority of people won't care what race you are - they'll care if you speak French (or at least are seen to be making an effort anyway).
I am not black and things are not perfect here but one thing I can tell you is that language trumps race in Quebec and Montreal basically every single time.
The vast majority of people won't care what race you are - they'll care if you speak French (or at least are seen to be making an effort anyway).
Ok, so you don't think there is strong resentment towards race like currently in France? A black person here could possibly achieve as much as he can if he works hard at it? I never see this in other french speaking cultures, there always seems to be a glass ceiling at some point. I will plan a trip for myself to go though thanks. Yes I'm learning French and picking up some Quebecious French parallel to my learning.
Ok, so you don't think there is strong resentment towards race like currently in France? A black person here could possibly achieve as much as he can if he works hard at it? I never see this in other french speaking cultures, there always seems to be a glass ceiling at some point. I will plan a trip for myself to go though thanks. Yes I'm learning French and picking up some Quebecious French parallel to my learning.
I think there can be barriers to advancement for black people in all white-dominated societies. The experience of individuals is extremely variable and personal of course. But there are many successful black people in Montreal just as there are in every city and Canada and the U.S.
Boston is NOT one of the Whitest cities in America. You're confusing Boston proper with New England as a whole, Boston itself is only 47% White. Furthermore, Black and Hispanic Bostonians have been in the city for nearly a century, whereas Montrealers of colour have only been there since the 70's at earliest.
Wiki says 54%, but either way it is a very white city by American standards. Name some major cities that are whiter than Boston. Seattle, Minneapolis. Hence the trend on city data where those looking for a white city tend to narrow it down to these cities. We can even toss in Portland despite its small size. Not just demographically but culturally Boston is one of the whitest cities and is well known for being a bit of an old boys club. In the eastern US Boston is well known as a place where blacks shouldnt count on mobility, yet it is still ahead of Canadian cities.
Also, blacks have been in the city since the 1600's (a century?), hispanics perhaps a century to get technical but were in no significant numbers until recent decades, much like Montrealers of color. I dont buy the argument that everyone running things seems to be a white Jean DuPont because immigration is recent. You can look at other Canadian cities like Toronto, Calgary, and Vancouver and see a difference. Or even more so the US where Indians, Africans, and Asians are very recent but more successful than white and black 'natives'. Perhaps the best course of action is to discuss the issue and get it out in the open. I feel that such topics are swept under the rug in Canada or taken as an insult which only hampers meaningful discussion and progress.
Ok, so you don't think there is strong resentment towards race like currently in France? A black person here could possibly achieve as much as he can if he works hard at it? I never see this in other french speaking cultures, there always seems to be a glass ceiling at some point. I will plan a trip for myself to go though thanks. Yes I'm learning French and picking up some Quebecious French parallel to my learning.
Lol.
This doesn't really exist in English speaking cultures either. Black people certainly aren't doing well in the US or UK so I don't see why you're pointing out Francophone nations as unique in this regard. There isn't a single Western nation that is open and welcoming to Black people.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hobbesdj
Wiki says 54%, but either way it is a very white city by American standards. Name some major cities that are whiter than Boston. Seattle, Minneapolis. Hence the trend on city data where those looking for a white city tend to narrow it down to these cities. We can even toss in Portland despite its small size. Not just demographically but culturally Boston is one of the whitest cities and is well known for being a bit of an old boys club. In the eastern US Boston is well known as a place where blacks shouldnt count on mobility, yet it is still ahead of Canadian cities.
Also, blacks have been in the city since the 1600's (a century?), hispanics perhaps a century to get technical but were in no significant numbers until recent decades, much like Montrealers of color. I dont buy the argument that everyone running things seems to be a white Jean DuPont because immigration is recent. You can look at other Canadian cities like Toronto, Calgary, and Vancouver and see a difference. Or even more so the US where Indians, Africans, and Asians are very recent but more successful than white and black 'natives'. Perhaps the best course of action is to discuss the issue and get it out in the open. I feel that such topics are swept under the rug in Canada or taken as an insult which only hampers meaningful discussion and progress.
I'm talking non-Hispanic Whites. And the fact that Boston is "Whiter" than the average large American city doesn't negate the fact that it still is majority minority, so obviously there will be proportionally more people of colour in places of authority in comparison to Montreal. Furthermore, I don't get where you think Boston hasn't had Blacks in significant numbers until recent decades when Blacks have made up more than 10% of the population (roughly proportional to their representation in the US overall) for over 50 years. I have relatives who left the Caribbean and moved to Boston in the 50's so I dunno what you're talking about.
As for Montreal, that city proper is 70% White and the 30% that isn't is almost entirely made up of recent immigrants (as in the last 20-30 years) who are just now coming into their second generation in Canada. I only know of a handfull of Black people in places like Little Burgundy who can say their grandparents were born in Montreal, otherwise damn near everyone I know of colour here has parents from elsewhere or is an immigrant themselves.
Last edited by lexdiamondz1902; 05-31-2014 at 02:06 PM..
Boston is NOT one of the Whitest cities in America. You're confusing Boston proper with New England as a whole, Boston itself is only 47% White.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lexdiamondz1902
And the fact that Boston is "Whiter" than the average large American city doesn't negate the fact that it still is majority minority
If I understand correctly, youve changed your stance and now we both agree that Boston is a very white American city. Only Seattle, Minneapolis, and little Portland are whiter major cities.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lexdiamondz1902
Furthermore, I don't get where you think Boston hasn't had Blacks in significant numbers until recent decades when Blacks have made up more than 10% of the population (roughly proportional to their representation in the US overall) for over 50 years. I have relatives who left the Caribbean and moved to Boston in the 50's so I dunno what you're talking about.
Lex, please read my post again. I didnt say that. I said blacks have been in Boston for four centuries. Here is what I said:
Quote:
Originally Posted by hobbesdj
Also, blacks have been in the city since the 1600's (a century?), hispanics perhaps a century to get technical but were in no significant numbers until recent decades, much like Montrealers of color.
Phyllis Wheatley and Prince Hall are examples of prominent colonial black Bostonians. It is Hispanics who were nonexistent until relatively recently.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lexdiamondz1902
Lol.
This doesn't really exist in English speaking cultures either. Black people certainly aren't doing well in the US or UK so I don't see why you're pointing out Francophone nations as unique in this regard. There isn't a single Western nation that is open and welcoming to Black people.
If black people arent doing well in America, then their situation in Quebec and Canada is abysmal. African immigrants are the most educated Americans, and their offspring are more likely to achieve a secondary degree than any other group of Americans. In addition, there is no city in Canada remotely resembling the black professional class of DC, Atlanta, New York, or Chicago. To say there isnt a single western nation that is open and welcoming to black people is quite an assertion when the democratically elected head of state is black. Black folks could certainly be doing better, but nonetheless Black Americans are the richest and most well educated blacks on the planet. In Canada, France, and Britain blacks are also at the bottom but with next to no representation among the upper classes and social and economic elites.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lexdiamondz1902
As for Montreal, that city proper is 70% White and the 30% that isn't is almost entirely made up of recent immigrants (as in the last 20-30 years) who are just now coming into their second generation in Canada. I only know of a handfull of Black people in places like Little Burgundy who can say their grandparents were born in Montreal, otherwise damn near everyone I know of colour here has parents from elsewhere or is an immigrant themselves.
Unfortunately that argument falls short of the mark. As stated, immigrants of all ethnicities fail to achieve economic and social sucess in Montreal relative to American cities. The question is why. Why are African, Asian, and Indian immigrants to say Boston or New York, for example, usually more economically and socially succesful than those who went to Montreal or other Canadian cities? They are all recent immigrants so why is it thst those in Canadian cities are relatively less succesful?
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