Republicans take over Michigan government (Lansing: for sale, real estate, credit card)
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Well.. No Child Left Behind, high stakes testing, teacher accountibility makes educators bang their heads against the wall repeatedly until we concuss ..
Merit pay for teachers, which Synder endorses, does not take into account how the teachers are actually teaching, but rather how students perform on standardized tests. Standardizes tests do not affectively measure student achievement becuase it does not take into consideration special needs, test anxiety, socio-cultural differences, learning styles, ect. A standardized test score does not properly measure student success let alone a teacher's. What is a failing teacher? One that teaches usable skills and knowledge that will prepare the student for life? Apparently, Synder and many others think so. They define a failing teacher as someone who does not mercilessly drill unusable facts into a student's head.
People who are not in the field of education, have not been trained in education, and know nothing about the realities of education are the ones making decisions about what is and is not success in the classroom. That is so wrong to me. One really doesn't know the realities until being in the classroom, working with the students, and being limited on what to teach becuase we have to to teach to the test rather than to teach critical thinking skills that will help students become productive members of society. Now I know that politicans are never going to be educators, they are always going to be people far removed from the school systems.. but these Republican education policies show total ignorance to the realities of teaching, IMO. These policies put our teachers and students down and make the issues we have in education so much worse... IMO
I could go on and on... one of my personal soapbox issues.
People who are not in the field of education, have not been trained in education, and know nothing about the realities of education are the ones making decisions about what is and is not success in the classroom. That is so wrong to me. One really doesn't know the realities until being in the classroom, working with the students, and being limited on what to teach becuase we have to to teach to the test rather than to teach critical thinking skills that will help students become productive members of society.
I think your opinion is reasonable, considering your perspective. As an outsider looking into the classroom and having the opinion that measuring objective results is an unfortunate necessity, let me ask you this, with all respect.
What do you tell a parent when they ask what do you know about being a productive member of society except how to become an educator?
To give context to that question, please think about the parent as being a laborer, a business owner, a middle manager and CEO at various times in her life.
What do you tell a parent when they ask what do you know about being a productive member of society except how to become an educator?
To give context to that question, please think about the parent as being a laborer, a business owner, a middle manager and CEO at various times in her life.
The meaningless facts that are tested by standardized tests (which is only part of my issues with standardized testing) do nothing to help a student in the real world. For example, as a history minor.. it's not the dates that are important to memorize (like a standardized test would ask), but to know the general patterns of history, to be able to look at events critically and thoughtfully, and to apply the knowledge towards looking at the current world and the future. The goal of education should be to teach the student how to think logically, critically, and to problem-solve, and that will help them be productive members of society. Unfortunately, standardized tests do not measure higher order thinking skills.
The meaningless facts that are tested by standardized tests (which is only part of my issues with standardized testing) do nothing to help a student in the real world. For example, as a history minor.. it's not the dates that are important to memorize (like a standardized test would ask), but to know the general patterns of history, to be able to look at events critically and thoughtfully, and to apply the knowledge towards looking at the current world and the future. The goal of education should be to teach the student how to think logically, critically, and to problem-solve, and that will help them be productive members of society. Unfortunately, standardized tests do not measure higher order thinking skills.
If I were a cynic, I'd have to respond that you have demonstrated a lack of critical and logical thinking here. I requested that you explain what you know about being a productive member of society but you're discussing the merits of standardized testing.
Would you explain why you did that and why a parent should trust your opinion when you don't seem to practice the values that you appear to celebrate?
Would you mind posting a link or links that show that Republicans are across the board for standardized testing and that Democrats are across the board against it?
Personally, I think that the entire public school system in this country is a disaster, both academically and socially. Take into consideration how many great minds throughout history were either schooled at home or in one room school houses where the kids varied in age from 5-18. Who decided once upon a time that sitting in a classroom with 30 people of all exactly the same chronological age but of varying academic abilities was a good way to learn? And the way that pop culture has infiltrated the lives of the kids, who is there to learn anyway? They're too busy sexting, texting, and downloading Lady Gaga videos on their high tech phones that they're not supposed to have in school in the first place.
No Child Left Behind -- totally the wrong idea. We need to leave a lot more behind. I'd propose some kind of standardized test to determine if children were elevated to the next grade. No more social promotion. No more teaching down to the lowest member of a class at the expense of every other child in the room. If a student lacks the fundamentals, send them back to whatever grade is required.
Standardized tests are objective. If a teacher can't get their students to learn certain pre-known objectives -- they've failed. Student's need to be drilled over and over again until they know the basics. Analysis of what it all means will come with time.
Most of us don't need to be trained in education to know what we'd like regarding education since we've all been there. I see a lot of things happening in education as failed experiments. The schools seemed to have worked better in the past. Put a 1950's curriculum in front of most students today and they'd utterly fail.
One of my pet peeves is computers in the classroom. Unless the objective is to put an entire curriculum on DVD and have computer instruction -- they should all be removed until at least high school. It's a very costly thing to do with no benefit except from parental feedback that little "Johnnie" knows more about computers than his parents. Computer technology changes so much that anything kids learn prior to high school about them will be obsolete when they graduate.
Computers are high priced items that depreciate entirely in about 3-4 years. They also take an administrative staff to keep them functional and virus-free. I'm not a technophobe and have a degree in Computer Science and work professionally as a network engineer. I've worked consulting jobs in school districts and in my opinion it's a complete waste of tax-payer money. The money would be better spent reducing teacher/student ratios and providing new books.
I find it amazing that the only tools that used to be necessary were books, a blackboard, and chalk and they provided better results than all the crap that is now "required". I think a lot of the problem is on the parents rather than the teachers. They either don't care about education or want it completely separated from the home environment. The kids are not disciplined and as a result have the attention span of a gnat. I think a lot of parents would forego the whole education thing in school as long as they had sports or whatever extracurricular thing their child wanted to participate in. We should really just get back to basics in our tools, subject matter, and testing.
I'm not sure how merit pay would work out. The students are generally not distributed evenly with regard to aptitude. If a teacher gets a good deal of the below-average students, he can't expect to have as good of an outcome as a peer with the above-average students. The only way it would be fair is if standardized testing were used and the results were relative to how the same students tested the previous year.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ricobaby89
Well.. No Child Left Behind, high stakes testing, teacher accountibility makes educators bang their heads against the wall repeatedly until we concuss ..
Merit pay for teachers, which Synder endorses, does not take into account how the teachers are actually teaching, but rather how students perform on standardized tests. Standardizes tests do not affectively measure student achievement becuase it does not take into consideration special needs, test anxiety, socio-cultural differences, learning styles, ect. A standardized test score does not properly measure student success let alone a teacher's. What is a failing teacher? One that teaches usable skills and knowledge that will prepare the student for life? Apparently, Synder and many others think so. They define a failing teacher as someone who does not mercilessly drill unusable facts into a student's head.
People who are not in the field of education, have not been trained in education, and know nothing about the realities of education are the ones making decisions about what is and is not success in the classroom. That is so wrong to me. One really doesn't know the realities until being in the classroom, working with the students, and being limited on what to teach becuase we have to to teach to the test rather than to teach critical thinking skills that will help students become productive members of society. Now I know that politicans are never going to be educators, they are always going to be people far removed from the school systems.. but these Republican education policies show total ignorance to the realities of teaching, IMO. These policies put our teachers and students down and make the issues we have in education so much worse... IMO
I could go on and on... one of my personal soapbox issues.
Excellent post, Sparrow_temp! I tried to rep you, but apparently I repped you recently for something else and I can't do it again, so consider yourself repped.
WOW this thread sure has morfed from the orginal idea.
"Republicans take over Michigan government So, Rick Snyder, "one tough nerd", stomped Bernero in the gubernatorial election and the Republicans also took the state House and Senate.
Now what? What kinds of changes do you think they'll make to the State of Michigan and will they actually be able to improve Michigan's economy and job market? Realistically, what do you think they'll be able to accomplish?"
michigan took a turn for the worse with the midterms. snyder wont do anything to improve this state mark it down. 4 years from now he'll get voted out for a democrat. casperson is for the kenicott disaster up here in the UP so kiss the last self sustaining population of coaster brook trout on superior's south coast goodbye as well as eagle rock (rio tinto/kenicott stomping on native religious rights) and the rest of that whole exceptionally senic area. benishek supports corperate rights over those of the people and expects taxpayers to clean up the messes caused by big oil or any other extractive industry. bob young said enbridge wasnt responsible for the cleanup when their unmaintained 40 year old pipeline burst spewing thousands of gallons of oil into the kalamazoo river near marshal this past summer.
michigan took a turn for the worse with the midterms. snyder wont do anything to improve this state mark it down.
Which of the points in the ten point plan is he wrong about?
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Al
