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I lived there for 18 years, moved here, my family is still there, and I'm on my way back... Have you lived in Seattle? Certain things are more expensive there, but here we have nearly 10% sales tax, and insane property taxes. Hell, the property taxes on my grandparent's place near Seattle was 28k PER YEAR. My property taxes are about 10k a year in Seattle, so yes, it's pretty close once everything is figured out (I'm an accountant, we're good with numbers). I know we don't have an income tax, but even then it's not likely it'd come close, and we have TONS of unclaimed taxes here, little nit picking things here and there that technically aren't taxes, but are simply a wolf in sheep's clothing. Go ahead with the obligatory "OMG MILK IS TWICE AS EXPENSIVE HERE" line I've heard a million times, I'll wait...
MichaelinWA, it doesn't matter what you "read," I've lived in both places for years, hell I "read" Seattle was a "great place to live!!" and boy was that a lie...
I've lived in Portland, San Francisco, Chicago -
In order to save all those property taxes - you of course need to buy a place. The cost of a comparable house in Maui/Hawaii isn't even close. That $500,000 place in Seattle is over a $1,000,000 in Hawaii.
You need some electricity - highest in the nation. If your electric bill in Maui is only $300/month, you are lucky - that is considered low. All our electric is imported oil - as gas up this summer, our electric goes up.
Gas - highest in the nation. About $4.40/gallon. No decent public transportation system so you are driving.
Income tax - we don't just have it, it is among the highest in the country - 8.25% at $48,000 in income - oh, it goes up from there.
Food - our legendary milk prices are the least of your problems - everything is higher.
And guess what, you don't make nearly the same money in Hawaii - often 50% less than mainland cities for the same work.
Everyone, you all go thinking the cost of living in Maui is comparable to Seattle - we all wish.
In order to save all those property taxes - you of course need to buy a place. The cost of a comparable house in Maui/Hawaii isn't even close. That $500,000 place in Seattle is over a $1,000,000 in Hawaii.
You need some electricity - highest in the nation. If your electric bill in Maui is only $300/month, you are lucky - that is considered low. All our electric is imported oil - as gas up this summer, our electric goes up.
Gas - highest in the nation. About $4.40/gallon. No decent public transportation system so you are driving.
Income tax - we don't just have it, it is among the highest in the country - 8.25% at $48,000 in income - oh, it goes up from there.
Food - our legendary milk prices are the least of your problems - everything is higher.
And guess what, you don't make nearly the same money in Hawaii - often 50% less than mainland cities for the same work.
Everyone, you all go thinking the cost of living in Maui is comparable to Seattle - we all wish.
Lol at thinking Seattle has a decent public transportation syetem, it's among the worst in the country and is on-par with what Honolulu has to offer, just with a lot more people depending on it. I know housing is more expensive in Honolulu now (my cousin is a developer on the island, and you guys haven't been hit nearly as hard as the mainland by the real estate bust) but about 5-6 years ago they were very comparable. I was looking at places in Magnolia with no view and no real yard, little shacks built in the 30's and 40's at around 1500-1800 sqft that were easily $800k+, not a good value IMO. It's lower now, but only becuase we've followed the trend of the rest of the country, but our tax assessed values are still high so our property taxes kill us...Funny how the State likes to do that.
Gas prices, it's $4.45 for diesel by my place, and I have to commute a lot more here than I did back home, around 80 miles a day. Most islanders don't commute nearly as far as mainlanders, nor do they sit in nearly as much traffic as we do here, so it usually will work out to be less expensive to drive for 90% of people transplanting from Seattle to Honolulu. Yes, I realize traffic can be bad there, but back home we never had the 20+ mile bumper-to-bumper jams we enjoy so much here.
Income tax? Ok, at your $48k per year, you're still looking at less than half what I currently pay on property. Not to mention our sales tax is ungodly high and we pay it on everything, including my new car I bought a couple years ago...Ouch. Oh yeah, we now are charge $5 each way on highway 520 just to cross from the eastside into Seattle, and they're talking about putting the same toll on I-90 as well, so there will be no escape from $7-$10+ per day just in tolls to commute.
I pay about $700 a month for electricity, running that heater adds up a lot because you basically need it from September-July around here. I never paid much in HNL as I wasn't a prisoner (due to weather) in the house during my free time 10+ months a year.
You're right that many islanders don't make as much money, but I'm half myself and I feel this is more of an internal problem. What I mean by that is, many on the island are just plain lazy, extremely lazy in fact. That's one thing I don't miss, the sense of laziness and entitlement many locals have, I'm only half and "blend in" perfectly, but I'm proud to say my work ethic does not. Many just need to try harder, work harder, and study harder to improve their quality of life, they need to ditch that lazy attitude and maybe then their quality of life will go up too.
BTW, when I was living in Manhattan for 10 months, my god that place makes Seattle and Honolulu look like the poor house; unbelievable how expensive EVERYTHING is there, I know SFO is almost as bad as well. I'm not trying to start something, but I'm just giving my personal experiences, I've lived in both places and I'm leaving one to go back to the other and I can't wait.
Is it really that more expensive to move to Maui from King County? Really? Does anyone have any first-hand experience? I know they have a Costco, Safeway, etc. and gas is expensive. What about property taxes if you live there compared to King County?
We moved to Oahu a year ago from Bellingham. We would go to Maui every year to escape the rain/grey. We stayed with a previous co-worker and her husband who moved there from Bham. They used to rent a 2 bedroom place in upcountry for $1,100 a month. Their view was stellar. That place was about 20-30 min outside town/shopping. We considered Maui when we decided to move here but we chose Oahu for job opportunity and the lifestyle we wanted. We have a while before retirement age. IMHO Maui seems similar in population to Skagit and Whatcom counties.
It is expensive, but the trade-offs were worth it for our friends who still live there. We had a 4 year plan to make sure it was a sustainable move. The year before we finally moved out, we visited Oahu again (instead of a Maui vacation) with a non-vacation mindset. Went to grocery stores, checked gas prices, etc.
A 5 year plan to truly prepare, do your homework and visit a couple times might just work out for you. So, my answer to your question is that it is possible. Sounds like it's time for some real world research. Best of luck.
I really appreciate everyone's answers. I was born and raised here in the Seattle area. We just built a house in unincorporated King County. The building permit was $22,000 (school and road taxes). JUST TO BUILD. Our property taxes on a 20-year old home in a good school district are over $4,000 a year. Can't wait to see what my new taxes are going to be on this new house.
I have been to Oahu approximately 16 times over the last 20 years. Been to Kauai once, and Maui 3 times. I have been looking at prices for houses/condos, doing research, etc. on groceries, etc. I believe King County is about the same in prices as the islands (gas, groceries). I found a grocery store in Maui that had great prices! Plus there is Costco. I find I eat less in Hawaii, as I am always outside doing something. Here in Seattle, I'm inside a lot watching the Travel channel. Anyway, I think it is a possibility. I really want to retire in 10 years and I'm hoping the market won't sky-rocket like it did 15 years ago.
I believe King County is about the same in prices as the islands (gas, groceries). I found a grocery store in Maui that had great prices! Plus there is Costco. I find I eat less in Hawaii, as I am always outside doing something. Here in Seattle, I'm inside a lot watching the Travel channel. Anyway, I think it is a possibility. I really want to retire in 10 years and I'm hoping the market won't sky-rocket like it did 15 years ago.
I was thinking that often people have comparable living because they are basing it on dollar and cent not of identical lifestyles. You know the person who say they can live in NYC for the same cost as Kansas but in NYC they have a sudio in the outer boro and use public transit and seldom eat out where in Kansas they had a 2 bedroom place in downtown city, owned their own nice car, eat out often and did so much more. In NYC they are SPENDINF the same but they are not LIVING the same.
I was thinking maybe that was what you were experiencing until you mentioned the gas and groceries being the same and that was the dead give away you have no idea what your saying.
When people are thinking of moving to Hawaii, they need real honest advice, not someone who comes and pretends they know what they are talking about based on some internet cost of living comparrison they did.
Does Hawaii charge income tax on unearned income?
I think the key to making it work is cutting out the frivolous spending. It's really easy to spend an extra 10-20 a day on coffee, eating out, etc. I don't want to deny myself the odd little pleasure in life, but when my gf and I take the time to put a little effort into making our food, it's usually superior to what we get in a restaurant for a quarter of the price. I'm thinking that's the key for us to make our budget work in Hawaii (when that time comes) - being more disciplined in our daily spending. Also, we'll have the time to grow our own food which probably won't save much money, but should be very rewarding.
I was thinking that often people have comparable living because they are basing it on dollar and cent not of identical lifestyles. You know the person who say they can live in NYC for the same cost as Kansas but in NYC they have a sudio in the outer boro and use public transit and seldom eat out where in Kansas they had a 2 bedroom place in downtown city, owned their own nice car, eat out often and did so much more. In NYC they are SPENDINF the same but they are not LIVING the same.
I was thinking maybe that was what you were experiencing until you mentioned the gas and groceries being the same and that was the dead give away you have no idea what your saying.
When people are thinking of moving to Hawaii, they need real honest advice, not someone who comes and pretends they know what they are talking about based on some internet cost of living comparrison they did.
But living the same =/= quality of life, and quality of life is very subjective. When I was living on Oahu I found my quality of life much higher, but not the same lifestyle as Seattle. I spent less money eating out, for example, just becuase I was outdoors more surfing, swimming, running, and often playing basketball in my free time. I was able to entertain myself without spending nearly as much money on things like expensive restaurants and movies like I do here in Seattle (and even in New York for that matter). You're more at the mercy of the winter here.
Oh yeah, when I was living back home in Hawaii the Costco usually only ran a little higher price-wise than the Costcos here in Seattle, so if you're savvy you don't have to break the bank on groceries. I went back this Thanksgiving and I had almost forgotten what a warm November felt like, the wet pavement, darkness, windy cold rain, leafless trees, and muddy everything in Seattle really wears me down after a while.
OP, if you're heart tells you to move, don't let some internet experts hold you back. I can't stand the arrogant naysayers who don't know your circumstances and come with a blaring "NO YOU CAN'T DO IT, YOU DON'T KNOW ANYTHING!!!" attitude. Tons of people have made the move and are still there, and couldn't be happier. I, for one, can't wait until I'm back on the islands, I miss the warm sea air and palm trees the longer I'm here; and you should never have to live somewhere that you're really unhappy in as we all have the power to change our circumstances with a little drive and determination. You have to be prepared to spend more money and maybe be more frugal, but like everything in life, there's a give and take.
Actually, IMHO, it's more than likely that the market will skyrocket like it did before. They really haven't made any changes to the folks who make the financial rules and the market has been doing these mood swings consistently for the past several decades. It seems a much slower swing than usual, now though, since previously we were running about a seven year cycle from peak to peak. Peak was around fall of 2005 in this area. House and property prices would double or a bit more then fall back down to around what was the previous low plus ten to fifteen percent then start the whole cycle again.
Buying a rental house on Maui now while prices are down and then having one of the local rental agencies take care of it for you may make an eventual retirement in Maui possible in ten years.
I'm not a Realtor, though, nor anyone in the financial end of things so my opinion is just a personal opinion.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunaimer
I really want to retire in 10 years and I'm hoping the market won't sky-rocket like it did 15 years ago.
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). I know we don't have an income tax, but even then it's not likely it'd come close, and we have TONS of unclaimed taxes here, little nit picking things here and there that technically aren't taxes, but are simply a wolf in sheep's clothing. Go ahead with the obligatory "OMG MILK IS TWICE AS EXPENSIVE HERE" line I've heard a million times, I'll wait...
