2023 Real Estate Observations (Duxbury, Westwood, Sutton: premium, degrees, to stay)

[matrix5k]

Originally Posted by BostonMike7

My only "but..." to that is interest rates. Those sold last summer. I think interest rates started their ride up the fall, so hard to say if they would have sold at the same price this summer.

But according to people in this thread, list price doesn't matter. It's only how much it sells above or below ask!

[msRB311]

I still don't know how list price doesn't matter. I know someone who listed their home for way over asking on Nantucket last fall and no one bit. The list price had something to do with the lack of interest. They ended up taking it off the market after a few months.

[BostonMike7]

Originally Posted by matrix5k

But according to people in this thread, list price doesn't matter. It's only how much it sells above or below ask!

I don't put too much weight on it. It's a guide more than anything.


I go back to car analogies because I'm a car guy. If i list a Ford Focus for $75K and it doesn't sell, does that mean the market is flat and nobody is buying? At the same time, if i list a brand new Porsche GT3RS for $75K, and sell it for $175K to an eager bidder, does that mean the market for them is hot and people are paying over list? It just means I didn't price either car properly.

Actually, in the case of the Porsche, I did leave money on the table because that's a $241+K car new.

[MikePRU]

Originally Posted by msRB311

I still don't know how list price doesn't matter. I know someone who listed their home for way over asking on Nantucket last fall and no one bit. The list price had something to do with the lack of interest. They ended up taking it off the market after a few months.

As I've said over and over again in this thread, list price is the single most important tool in the marketing of a house. This being said, the amount over/under the list price that a house sells at is not an indicator of how successful the sale was. It seems most other people who have responded to you have said the same thing.

So basically what people are saying is that list price is not relevant when determining what to offer for a house or when judging the level of success of the sale. Why? Because you can set the list price where ever you want. If you list a house that's worth $1.5M for $1 and it sells for $1.4M is that a successful sale? It sold for $1.4M over the asking price didn't it?

Originally Posted by BostonMike7

I don't put too much weight on it. It's a guide more than anything.


I go back to car analogies because I'm a car guy. If i list a Ford Focus for $75K and it doesn't sell, does that mean the market is flat and nobody is buying? At the same time, if i list a brand new Porsche GT3RS for $75K, and sell it for $175K to an eager bidder, does that mean the market for them is hot and people are paying over list? It just means I didn't price either car properly.

Actually, in the case of the Porsche, I did leave money on the table because that's a $241+K car new.

Exactly. You can set the price where ever you want. So who cares?

[newenglandgal123]

Originally Posted by MikePRU

As I've said over and over again in this thread, list price is the single most important tool in the marketing of a house. This being said, the amount over/under the list price that a house sells at is not an indicator of how successful the sale was. It seems most other people who have responded to you have said the same thing.

So basically what people are saying is that list price is not relevant when determining what to offer for a house or when judging the level of success of the sale. Why? Because you can set the list price where ever you want. If you list a house that's worth $1.5M for $1 and it sells for $1.4M is that a successful sale? It sold for $1.4M over the asking price didn't it?



Exactly. You can set the price where ever you want. So who cares?

Just because something sells for $100-300K over list doesn't mean it's the most accurate/true price for that particular property....it's only worth it to the one outlier person who grossly overbid. If that person didn't grossly overbid/take them out of the buyer pool....then what would it actually have sold for?! Bidding $100-300K over list is not normal yet so many think it is.


Also, when have you ever seen an agent list a house here for $1? I'll wait......

[MikePRU]

Originally Posted by newenglandgal123

Just because something sells for $100-300K over list doesn't mean it's the most accurate/true price for that particular property....it's only worth it to the one outlier person who grossly overbid. If that person didn't grossly overbid/take them out of the buyer pool....then what would it actually have sold for?! Bidding $100-300K over list is not normal yet so many think it is.

So . . . you're missing the point. There's no such thing as an accurate price. The price isn't there to measure anything and that's why it can't be accurate or inaccurate. Price is ONLY a marketing tool and so the only good price is one that gets the house sold for the maximum dollar amount. This might mean pricing it grossly lower than what it's worth. It might mean pricing it somewhat higher than what it's worth. Price and market value are two separate and distinct things that at best can be described as loosely connected.

Unlike many in this group I get to frequently see "behind the curtain." When I represent a seller, I get to see what all the offers are. When I represent a buyer, I try to find out what the other offers came in at. I can tell you that it doesn't happen with incredible frequency that one person comes in and makes an offer that just smashes the competition. It happens but more often than not the second best offer is right behind the best one. If you take the best offer out of the pool it doesn't grossly lower the value as you are supposing. Your assumption that there's this small percentage of buyers who are just INSANE and offer INSANE amounts to buy houses is incorrect.

Originally Posted by newenglandgal123

Also, when have you ever seen an agent list a house here for $1? I'll wait......

I've read about it happening numerous times. In fact, it happens so frequently that way back in 2016 Realtor.com wrote an article about it.

https://www.realtor.com/news/trends/...or-1-listings/

[newenglandgal123]

Originally Posted by MikePRU

So . . . you're missing the point. There's no such thing as an accurate price. The price isn't there to measure anything and that's why it can't be accurate or inaccurate. Price is ONLY a marketing tool and so the only good price is one that gets the house sold for the maximum dollar amount. This might mean pricing it grossly lower than what it's worth. It might mean pricing it somewhat higher than what it's worth. Price and market value are two separate and distinct things that at best can be described as loosely connected.

Unlike many in this group I get to frequently see "behind the curtain." When I represent a seller, I get to see what all the offers are. When I represent a buyer, I try to find out what the other offers came in at. I can tell you that it doesn't happen with incredible frequency that one person comes in and makes an offer that just smashes the competition. It happens but more often than not the second best offer is right behind the best one. If you take the best offer out of the pool it doesn't grossly lower the value as you are supposing. Your assumption that there's this small percentage of buyers who are just INSANE and offer INSANE amounts to buy houses is incorrect.



I've read about it happening numerous times. In fact, it happens so frequently that way back in 2016 Realtor.com wrote an article about it.

https://www.realtor.com/news/trends/...or-1-listings/

There have been some homes posted here recently that have sold for $300K -400K over list. I find it hard to believe that there are multiple bidders offering that much over!
As a FSBO, I have gotten to see what the other offers were as well. I've had an instance where one offer came in and smashed the competition. All cash, plus it was the highest offer over list, no contingencies and they were ok with having the closing whenever it worked best for me.

As for the dollar listings, I've never seen one listed for a dollar in the state of MA. If you have, I'd be curious to see it! (residential ones....not the commercial property noted in the article link you provided either please....)

[MikePRU]

Originally Posted by newenglandgal123

There have been some homes posted here recently that have sold for $300K -400K over list. I find it hard to believe that there are multiple bidders offering that much over!
As a FSBO, I have gotten to see what the other offers were as well. I've had an instance where one offer came in and smashed the competition. All cash, plus it was the highest offer over list, no contingencies and they were ok with having the closing whenever it worked best for me.

You can find anything you want "hard to believe." I can tell you that whether you believe it or not, that doesn't preclude it from being a fact or the truth. There seems to be a resurgence in people who believe the world is flat too. Just because those people think it is doesn't make it so.

I can assure you the dataset I'm using to make this statement is much bigger and likely more recent than whatever experiences you're relying on because I live and breath real estate. It's my career.

Originally Posted by newenglandgal123

As for the dollar listings, I've never seen one listed for a dollar in the state of MA. If you have, I'd be curious to see it! (residential ones....not the commercial property noted in the article link you provided either please....)

You seem to think I just make this stuff up. Here's one from last year:

https://www.realtor.com/realestatean...il/M3022298399

FYI, over the last 5 years there have been 183 listings in MLSPIN that have been priced at $1. Also, I'm just going to say up front that no I'm not going to provide you with all of those listings to prove it. You can take my word or not.

[msRB311]

I still think list price matters. Seems like we're beating a dead horse here.

from what i've heard, people list homes for $1 if they're handing it off to a family member or whoever they'd like to inherit it.

[Iced_Coffee]

Originally Posted by msRB311

I still think list price matters. Seems like we're beating a dead horse here.

from what i've heard, people list homes for $1 if they're handing it off to a family member or whoever they'd like to inherit it.

It matters in the sense that it can be a tool for a seller (it's excellent for marketing a house, as MikePRU has explained). However, the listing price has no bearing on the actual, true, market-value of the house. See: examples of houses listed at $1 and selling for what they're actually worth.

I think it's fair game to discuss whether a buyer has potentially overpaid for a house. However, I don't think there's much value in doing so only from the perspective of how much above asking they paid. Just think of it this way - say my neighbor and I both sell our houses with similar specs and we both get $750k for them. I listed mine at $650k and they listed theirs at $750k. Did the buyer of their house get a deal? Did the buyer of my house overpay? The answer might be yes, no, or maybe. But you need more than just sale price minus list price to determine that. It might be tempting to look at the buyer of my house in this example and go "oh, another one at $100k over list " in isolation, but you'd be missing the important context.