newton vs Needham vs Wellesley (Boston, Lexington: real estate, townhomes, neighborhoods)
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We are relocating to the area with two young children (2 and 5) and wanted advice as to which town/elementary schools we should target. Our son starts kindergarten in the Fall. We have looked at all three towns and so far we think Newton may be most attractive to us (diversity, amenities, distance to city and husband work - west borough). But we are concerned about the deteriorating/overcrowding going on in their elementary schools. We are now considering Needham but not sure if they have the same problems. Can anyone give me an idea which elementary schools we should target/stay away from in Newton, Needham and Wellesley. Wellesley is third on our list because of the snob factor. Our budget limit is 1.5m. We want a sfh but are not opposed to a townhome. We rather live in newer vs. Older (don't want the expensive upkeep). Is there any other towns we should consider? We love food the arts/culture and diversity. We also want a safe and family friendly neighborhood. Also we can't seem to get a handle on the neighborhoods in these towns. Any insights on which areas within these towns we should target would be helpful too!
I currently live in Needham (with my newborn which is why I'm up right now) and before this I lived in Newton for almost ten years. Plus, I'm a real estate agent in the area and these are the three towns I spend the absolute most time in. So, I know them all pretty well.
I would absolutely agree with you that Newton offers the best combination of arts/culture/diversity/access to Boston. It's the furthest from Westborough of the three but the difference (depending upon where in Newton you might settle) is not likely to make a massive impact on commute time. Newton is the biggest of the three suburbs and is the only one of the three which is actually a city and not a town. It's made up of 13 villages which is only relevant to know in that each village has it's own unique feel. For example, Nonantum is very densely populated with a lot of multi-family dwellings on small lots. Newton Center is the polar opposite with a lot of large homes on lush green lawns. Some of the villages have little village centers with shopping/restaurants as well. Personally, I always preferred to live in an area of town with access to the T's green line as these trains run more frequently than the commuter rail trains. This is especially true if you're using the train to go to Boston on the weekend. As for housing, if you really want new construct in Newton you're likely looking at a townhome. There are some really lovely and large townhomes in Newton that are fairly similar to living in a single family house. The deterioration of the school buildings in town at the elementary and middle school levels is a serious concern. Unfortunately, the former mayor really mismanaged the city and was not pro-active above school replacement which has really left Newton in a ditch in that respect. Some of the elementary school buildings are in rough shape while others are just fairly old. They're trying to rectify the situation now, but they're basically digging themselves out of a ditch so it's a big project and will take a while and a lot of money (from the Newton tax payers).
Needham is a lot smaller than Newton. I actually moved to Needham because I felt it was a friendlier place. The people just seem to be a little more pleasant and likely because of the smaller size I tend to bump into a lot of the same people over and over which encourages familiarity. Up until about 30 years ago, this was a very blue collar town and despite the change in population the residents seem to have retained a more down to earth feel which I enjoy. You would definitely feel safe anywhere in Needham at any hour of the day or night. The town has a nice but not huge town center which does offer some very good restaurants and some shopping. Access to Boston is excellent with four commuter rail stations (which don't run on the weekend) and easy access by car. In Needham for 1.5M, you can have a brand new single family home likely between 4k and 5k square feet. For about half that, you could live in a new townhome and likely be in a more walkable location. Needham doesn't have villages but the town is split in half basically between Needham and Needham Heights (basically the two zip codes in town). Historically, the Heights side of town was always considered less desirable likely because of it's history of being the more industrial side of town (we used to have mills and other things of that nature in town which are now gone) but that attitude seems to be changing. There are also various neighborhoods some of which have names like Birds Hill and Saddle Brook Estates but many do not have names. Overall, the town is very pro-active about maintaining the school buildings. The one that's probably in the worst shape is Hillside Elementary which the town is currently working toward completely replacing. Considering your children's age, I would probably avoid that school district simply because they would have to live through the process of replacing the school. The next building which will likely get some attention is the middle school followed by Mitchell Elementary. None of the buildings in Needham have remotely reached what I've seen in the worst of the Newton schools though.
Wellesley is a town with various neighborhoods as well. They're all pretty nice and you'll feel safe anywhere in town at any time, but your concern about snob factor is one I hear quite a bit. Wellesley has a larger town center than Needham or any of the village centers in Newton and there are plenty of shops and restaurants in town. The town is also fairly pro-active about dealing with the school and the school situation is probably similar to Needham in that a few buildings are nearing the end of their life cycle but will be dealt with. For 1.5M in Wellesley, you're not likely to get a new house on a quiet street. Townhomes are a much more rare thing in Wellesley too so you won't really have that option to fall back on in order to get a newer home.
You really can't go wrong with any of these three towns. They all offer a very high quality of life and overall good school systems.
Thank you MikePRU! Congrats on the newborn! Hopefully you were able to get some sleep! It gets better. What a comprehensive response! Couldnt have asked for a better answer. Your reply confirmed my initial gut feeling of the towns and what we could get for our budget.
As much as I like Newton for all its wonderful traits, I cannot put my son through a poorly managed public school system. The primary reason we targeted these three towns was their reputable public school system, followed by distance to work/city, safety, and budget. But of lately, i have heard about the deterioration of elementary school facilities and overcrowding in Newton. I think we are going to focus on Needham. What is your take on Broad meadow vs Mitchell vs Newman? I will steer clear of Hillside.
Is it true Needham High isn't as highly regarded as it use to be? Not an immediate concern but it can be a factor for resale.
If school is the critical factor, and your husband's commute is to Westborough, then I would suggest you keep an eye to Acton and Lexington as well. Both have excellent schools across the whole district, good town finance, reasonable commute to Westborough, and diversity and tons of amenities for families. The downside of course is you are farther away from Boston.
For 1.5m you can find new built single family house in Lexington. I don't know much about Acton but I am guessing your budget can go far in Acton too.
Thanks Claiz! I think we are going to expand our search to include Lexington. I mapquested Lexington to Westborough and it is a slightly longer commute than the other towns we are looking at. The school districts look solid in Lexington and the houses seem a bit more affordable. We would have liked the convenience of being closer to Boston/more urban feel but at the end of the day, how often will we be going into the city with two young kids in tow. I don't want to pay for a house at my limit and still have to explore private school - which may be the case at my budget in Newton/Wellesley/Needham. It is quite a shame that these towns have neglected the elementary schools. They are beautiful towns and in great locations.
If school is the critical factor, and your husband's commute is to Westborough, then I would suggest you keep an eye to Acton and Lexington as well. Both have excellent schools across the whole district, good town finance, reasonable commute to Westborough, and diversity and tons of amenities for families. The downside of course is you are farther away from Boston.
For 1.5m you can find new built single family house in Lexington. I don't know much about Acton but I am guessing your budget can go far in Acton too.
I suppose you can throw Lexington into the bucket since inventory is low everywhere, but the OP should know it's farther than the other towns from both Westboro and Boston. Compared to Wellesley it will take 20-25 extra minutes in the morning to get to Westboro because it's gridlocked the entire stretch of I-95 from Rt-2 down to the Mass Pike. At least from Needham the OP doesn't need to get onto I-95 since there are back roads to get onto the Pike.
I suppose you can throw Lexington into the bucket since inventory is low everywhere, but the OP should know it's farther than the other towns from both Westboro and Boston. Compared to Wellesley it will take 20-25 extra minutes in the morning to get to Westboro because it's gridlocked the entire stretch of I-95 from Rt-2 down to the Mass Pike. At least from Needham the OP doesn't need to get onto I-95 since there are back roads to get onto the Pike.
I agree. I would cross Acton and Lexington off the list based on commute. The stretch of RT 128 from Burlington down to the MA Pike/RT 9 area is a log jam during rush hour. Lexington is a great town, but living there will add more time to the commute than Google Maps indicates.
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Originally Posted by cc888
Thank you MikePRU! Congrats on the newborn! Hopefully you were able to get some sleep! It gets better. What a comprehensive response! Couldnt have asked for a better answer. Your reply confirmed my initial gut feeling of the towns and what we could get for our budget.
Thanks. This is actually our second. It's been a bigger jump from 1 to 2 kids than we could have expected. It's totally different than going from 0 to 1.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cc888
As much as I like Newton for all its wonderful traits, I cannot put my son through a poorly managed public school system. The primary reason we targeted these three towns was their reputable public school system, followed by distance to work/city, safety, and budget. But of lately, i have heard about the deterioration of elementary school facilities and overcrowding in Newton.
I enjoyed my time living in Newton but it wasn't a great fit for the way I live my life. I don't feel like I've sacrificed anything at all living in Needham. The town offers much of the same things that I loved about living in Newton Center and also has some characteristics that Newton didn't that are pluses in my opinion.
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Originally Posted by cc888
I think we are going to focus on Needham. What is your take on Broad meadow vs Mitchell vs Newman? I will steer clear of Hillside.
I hear good things about all of them. I personally live in the Newman school district. The town recently sunk a lot of money into the building so I can't imagine any construction going on there in the near future. The Hillside school really is good too. It's more the disruption caused by the upcoming building replacement project that concerns me. After that, it will probably be a very sought after school. Broad Meadow and Mitchell are great schools too. They're very popular because the Birds Hill neighborhood feeds into them and many people really like that area of town.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cc888
Is it true Needham High isn't as highly regarded as it use to be? Not an immediate concern but it can be a factor for resale.
I wouldn't say the quality of education has changed at all at the high school. However, it seems like Boston Magazine changed the way they rank schools and many schools systems had drastic changes in their rankings. Personally, I don't put much stock in anything the magazine writes. Most people are aware that it's a "pay for play" periodical meaning if you advertise with them then your establishment will get awards like "Best of Boston" and favorable reviews in the magazine. This brings into question their overall credibility in my eyes. The table they give in the article has some useful statistics in it, but that doesn't mean you'll want to interpret it the same way as the author.
We were thinking of Westborough but it seems a bit far from Boston/access to urban life. We currently live in a very isolated/suburban town and really miss the diversity/culture a more urban setting offers. Nothing wrong with suburbia...just no access to a wide range of good food. Give us some reasons to change our minds!
I hear good things about all of them. I personally live in the Newman school district. The town recently sunk a lot of money into the building so I can't imagine any construction going on there in the near future. The Hillside school really is good too. It's more the disruption caused by the upcoming building replacement project that concerns me. After that, it will probably be a very sought after school. Broad Meadow and Mitchell are great schools too. They're very popular because the Birds Hill neighborhood feeds into them and many people really like that area of town.
MikePRU - thanks again for your insightful comments. The other elementary school is Eliot....is there anything we should worry about if we find a school in this school district? BTW ... going from 1 to 2 kids is very tough...just make sure you find time for #1....my doctor told me it is important to give #1 more attention during this time...as #2 doesn't know the difference if he/she is getting more/less attention than his/her older sibling. Good luck with all that! Where do you find time to post! I'm glad you have been able to post comments. Nothing like a reality check from "locals" . Perhaps we will be neighbors!
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I'm glad you have been able to post comments. Nothing like a reality check from "locals" 
