Why is CA broke after having very high taxes (excpt Property)? (Oakland: credit card, how much)

[Lifeshadower]

Originally Posted by Curmudgeon

For the OP, as I've posted many times before, this is only a part of the problem in CA, although a major one. The rest of the madness hampering the state comes from several sources. Probably the top of the list is the idiots otherwise intelligent people keep re-electing to office in the Legislature and when they term out, members of their families. These people are interested in themselves, not the public good, but for a very, very few of them.

Next up are the many propositions specifying categorical funding or limiting revenues the people, in their infinite wisdom vote on to pass and those that greatly increase spending requirements with no dedicated funding streams identified or required. Propositions 13, 98, 63 and 83 leap immediately to mind.

Until there is realistic, non-partisan redistricting, and until Californians take enough interest in the process to educate themselves politically, and until the people eschew political party affiliation in favor of real policy, and until the super majority is no longer necessary, and until the constitution is changed to require all propositions to be self-funding, and until the people rise up and say, "No!" to deficit spending, tricks, smoke and mirrors, borrowing and unfunded mandates, the problems will only continue.

Meanwhile, CA continues to circle the drain at an ever-increasing pace!

These pretty much echo my sentiments on this whole issue.

The problem with Californians, and increasingly more and more Americans, is that we seem to be voting for every SINGLE spending platform but not really finding a sensible way to pay for it as if the money will magically appear or something. In addition, most people just aren't interested enough in what's going on in Sacramento to care what their elected officials are doing. There's so much apathy when it comes to state government that people figure that the outcome will be the same no matter what.

In a lot of ways, they are right. Nothing does change because the problem isn't only with the people we send there, but the whole structure.

As quickly as we are to blame our elected officials for all our problems, I think the voters/taxpayers should leverage more responsibility for what's been going on. Year after year, we elect the same EXACT people to the legislature doing the same EXACT thing as they have been doing since the late 1970s. What makes it even worse that since national politics in the 2000s have become so polarized, more and more people vote along party line despite any result that has been produced.

Personal responsibility; there hasn't been enough of that going around lately. If you WANT to vote for a spending program, then don't simultaneously vote for something that will prevent that program from every seeing any sort of funding. It's crazy, almost like we're 5 year old kids not sure of what we want.

What I'm glad though, at least with this discussion, is that I'm learning a lot about California's tax system. I admit, I don't know enough about it because I'm not a property owner nor have I paid income tax for a large salary yet. Oh to be in your early 20s...

[Curmudgeon]

Originally Posted by Ultrarunner

Neighbors lived/worked in Austrailia for 2 years.... loved the country and people... found the taxes oppresive.

I think that one of the problems in CA that Prop. 13 didn't address effectively, in my opinion, was that property taxes are levied on the total valuation of the home. In many states, including the one that's now ours, property taxes are levied on a percentage of valuation with breaks for the elderly and others (disabled for instance) so they're easily managable. Property taxes should not be oppressive if the much touted "American Dream" is home ownership and the premise of Prop. 13 was a tax break now for 1978 home owners rather than achievable, sustainable taxes throughout ownership and breaks during one's retirement years when they were likely most needed. Add Mello-Roos and HOA fees and the "dream" is beyond the reach of all too many.

[miyu]

Originally Posted by ashguy77

I have been wondering about this. After moving from Dallas here last year, I have to pay additional 9-10% State Income Tax. The Sales Taxes are ridiculously high. Registering my car was 4-5 times as expensive. Then why is CA broke??

STATE PENSIONS
STATE PENSIONS
STATE PENSIONS

Lowered tax revenues from the recession.

Cost of welfare for illegal immigrants and other poor people regardless of origin.

[BluSpark]

Originally Posted by miyu

STATE PENSIONS
STATE PENSIONS
STATE PENSIONS

Lowered tax revenues from the recession.

Cost of welfare for illegal immigrants and other poor people regardless of origin.

Last year George Skeleton of the LA Times did a pretty good attempt at a non-sensational look at what illegal immigrants (and their children) cost the state of California.

His estimate was about $5 billion. The proposed 2010-11 state budget is approx. $118 billion. So $5 billion is not chump change but it's not the primary cause either. But most of those costs are for education, emergency health care, and corrections (and NOT welfare checks).

Illegal immigrants are a factor in the budget gap math - Los Angeles Times

[Ultrarunner]

Originally Posted by Curmudgeon

I think that one of the problems in CA that Prop. 13 didn't address effectively, in my opinion, was that property taxes are levied on the total valuation of the home. In many states, including the one that's now ours, property taxes are levied on a percentage of valuation with breaks for the elderly and others (disabled for instance) so they're easily managable. Property taxes should not be oppressive if the much touted "American Dream" is home ownership and the premise of Prop. 13 was a tax break now for 1978 home owners rather than achievable, sustainable taxes throughout ownership and breaks during one's retirement years when they were likely most needed. Add Mello-Roos and HOA fees and the "dream" is beyond the reach of all too many.

Good point... Prop 13 could have effectively been stopped cold had the legislature index the Home-owner's exemption for inflation... it was offered only when the passage of Prop 13 looked imminent.

I come from Farm Stock and the dream is to own land... many that come here dream of owning... something that might not have even been possible in the land of their birth.

Prop 13 became law when I was a child... I bought my first home years later and Prop 13 was still a benefit and one I'm thankful for... if for nothing else in that it provides a measure of stability.

[Ultrarunner]

Well it's official... just received my new property tax bill and anyone that says California property is taxed at 1% doesn't have a clue.

My property tax is more than 1.5% based on the Assessor's inflated opinion of the value of my 1725 square feet home built in the 50's... with Formica counters and linoleum floors

Fair market value is at least 100k less and I am again appealing... last year I got it lowered 90k and this year it was raised 83k

My real property tax is a whopping 1.88% based on the Fair Market Value.

In addition... there are several ballot measures where my city is asking property owners to come up with another nearly $800 per residential parcel and, if passed, would push me over 2%

Maybe, my neighbors that bought when I did and walked away are really the smart ones?

We are being asked to pay hundreds of dollars more for everything from Police, Fire, Schools and even a $24 dollar a year per line telephone tax and higher county vehicle license fees...

All of this in a city that spent millions building a new, never to be used police substation only to tear it down 4 years later and give Police Pensions to 50 year old retired Police Officers with lifetime medical ranging from 100k to 183k per year and schools that spend nearly 15k per student per year.

Property Owners are tired and many have finally said enough is enough...

End of Rant... see you at the polls.

[EscapeCalifornia]

Originally Posted by Ultrarunner

Well it's official... just received my new property tax bill and anyone that says California property is taxed at 1% doesn't have a clue.

My property tax is more than 1.5% based on the Assessor's inflated opinion of the value of my 1725 square feet home built in the 50's... with Formica counters and linoleum floors

Fair market value is at least 100k less and I am again appealing... last year I got it lowered 90k and this year it was raised 83k

My real property tax is a whopping 1.88% based on the Fair Market Value.

In addition... there are several ballot measures where my city is asking property owners to come up with another nearly $800 per residential parcel and, if passed, would push me over 2%

Maybe, my neighbors that bought when I did and walked away are really the smart ones?

We are being asked to pay hundreds of dollars more for everything from Police, Fire, Schools and even a $24 dollar a year per line telephone tax and higher county vehicle license fees...

All of this in a city that spent millions building a new, never to be used police substation only to tear it down 4 years later and give Police Pensions to 50 year old retired Police Officers with lifetime medical ranging from 100k to 183k per year and schools that spend nearly 15k per student per year.

Property Owners are tired and many have finally said enough is enough...

End of Rant... see you at the polls.

Maybe its time to get out of Oakland. I was paying 1.12% in a small city in SoCal.

[Vascodagama]

Originally Posted by Ultrarunner

Well it's official... just received my new property tax bill and anyone that says California property is taxed at 1% doesn't have a clue.

My property tax is more than 1.5% based on the Assessor's inflated opinion of the value of my 1725 square feet home built in the 50's... with Formica counters and linoleum floors

Fair market value is at least 100k less and I am again appealing... last year I got it lowered 90k and this year it was raised 83k

My real property tax is a whopping 1.88% based on the Fair Market Value.

In addition... there are several ballot measures where my city is asking property owners to come up with another nearly $800 per residential parcel and, if passed, would push me over 2%

Maybe, my neighbors that bought when I did and walked away are really the smart ones?

We are being asked to pay hundreds of dollars more for everything from Police, Fire, Schools and even a $24 dollar a year per line telephone tax and higher county vehicle license fees...

All of this in a city that spent millions building a new, never to be used police substation only to tear it down 4 years later and give Police Pensions to 50 year old retired Police Officers with lifetime medical ranging from 100k to 183k per year and schools that spend nearly 15k per student per year.

Property Owners are tired and many have finally said enough is enough...

End of Rant... see you at the polls.

You think you pay too much tax and fee's now, just wait until next year. If Jerry Brown gets elected (yet again) you will see a mass exodus of businesses and responsible tax payers leaving the state.

[Ultrarunner]

Originally Posted by EscapeCalifornia

Maybe its time to get out of Oakland. I was paying 1.12% in a small city in SoCal.

My job is my one reason for staying...

Friends have been after me to visit them in Alaska... they moved several years ago and couldn't be happier... don't know about a diet of Caribou...

1.12% sounds like a bargain... neighboring communities here are also high.

My response was directed to the title of this thread inferring CA doesn't have high property tax... can't speak to all of CA... but I can provide the proof some of us have seen property tax increases to nearly pre Prop 13 levels...

[Charles]

Originally Posted by Ultrarunner

anyone that says California property is taxed at 1% doesn't have a clue.

Even though you are paying the tax assessor an amount greater than 1% might not mean your property tax is greater than 1%.

I too am paying a lot more than 1% (also about 1.5%) but there are other line items on the bill including bonds, mello roos, water district, Rancho Santa Margarita special assessments, and a couple things I can't remember. But my basic levy rate was indeed 1%.