Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
This technology is gong to change the way the world works. Its nothing less than what PCs have done over the last 20 years. I know we have talked about this before, but this is not a plastic receiver that has to be reinforced. Its a full on SS gun that was printed all but the springs. And it works like a Colt from the Factory. The cost right now is expensive but the first Viagra to be developed cost 2 million bucks. I can see people going to gun parties like they do to make AKs and ARs today and making their own 1911s or other hand guns. Its a game changer. How do you have gun control when anyone can get a 3D printer and a set of instructions off the internet and build one? Now if we can print gun powder and primers. LOL
,,,,,I can see people going to gun parties like they do to make AKs and ARs today and making their own 1911s or other hand guns. Its a game changer. How do you have gun control when anyone can get a 3D printer and a set of instructions off the internet and build one? Now if we can print gun powder and primers.
Anyone could always make their own firearms. Why have a "gun party" and be out the wear and tear and loss of materials for others? Most people do not have the mechanical skill to repair a toaster much less assemble a firearm. I own and operate a duplicutter for copying gun stocks, turn styles and many other objects in wood, plastic, aluminum or even steel. I do not share this machine with others as it was expensive and I do not want to ever have to blame anyone else if anything fails on it.
I have made my own gun powder at times. I prefer to buy it.
Anyone could always make their own firearms. Why have a "gun party" and be out the wear and tear and loss of materials for others? Most people do not have the mechanical skill to repair a toaster much less assemble a firearm. I own and operate a duplicutter for copying gun stocks, turn styles and many other objects in wood, plastic, aluminum or even steel. I do not share this machine with others as it was expensive and I do not want to ever have to blame anyone else if anything fails on it.
I have made my own gun powder at times. I prefer to buy it.
I think you missed the entire point. It was not about you but about new technology that makes it easy to make ones own gun. We all know its legal to make your own gun and there are many gun making parties that go on in many states where you can be the one to press the button to make a billet into a receiver. Now its press a button and print one and it seems to be good quality. I think assembling a 1911 is not really rocket science and I believe many or most people who comment on this forum have or can do it. I had never really worked on guns but I changed out my own trigger, grip safety, main spring housing , rear sight, and safety with relative ease. I also removed the thee parts that make my 80 series different form a series 70 with no difficulty at all.
This new 3d printing will do to manufacturing what PCs did for information. My main point was that its gong to be difficult to stop people from getting guns when with a 3d printer and program instructions you can print one out. Gun control is going to be near impossible on any level. Your machine is going to go the way of the dodo bird. Complicated machines that cut and make parts by mechanical labor are gong to be like type setting in the days of laser printers. A museum piece at best.
I think assembling a 1911 is not really rocket science and I believe many or most people who comment on this forum have or can do it. I had never really worked on guns but I changed out my own trigger, grip safety, main spring housing , rear sight, and safety with relative ease. I also removed the thee parts that make my 80 series different form a series 70 with no difficulty at all.
That's your first mistake, I make a fair income in a rural area taking a bag of parts that someone thought they could reassemble into the firearm they had, and finding at the 11th hour that they couldn't. Mostly it's just a little bit of patience, a few tricks here and there and some confidence.
Quote:
Originally Posted by saxondale351
This new 3d printing will do to manufacturing what PCs did for information. My main point was that its gong to be difficult to stop people from getting guns when with a 3d printer and program instructions you can print one out. Gun control is going to be near impossible on any level. Your machine is going to go the way of the dodo bird. Complicated machines that cut and make parts by mechanical labor are gong to be like type setting in the days of laser printers. A museum piece at best.
Don't be so sure, additive manufacturing (which is what 3D printing is) has been around forever (do you own any plates, bowls, vases, etc made of ceramic). Certain materials lend themselves to this kind of process others less so. Certainly speed of manufacture is one aspect that needs to be considered, you can machine an AR lower from billet in around 20 minutes, most 3D printers would take around a day or more to produce the same (and that's thermoplastic, not aluminum I have no idea how long sintered metal printers take, but I can't imagine it would be faster than thermoplastic).
As far as gun control, no it's not going to be almost impossible, it may be easier. How easy is it to watch a movie without the required security and rights management? Even the signal between your player and TV is encrypted (and that's something that has happened in under the last 10 years). If you've ever lost your rights management database on your PC/device/etc. it has to dial home before it will give you access to your music bought via a music provider, or your books from Amazon or Moby and sometimes not even then. These can all be triggered by the provider too, to refresh your licenses. What's to stop that happening to a 3D printer? How long will it be before 3D printers that are easily available to the public will only print CAD files from approved and verifiable sources? With the correct fee's paid to the owners of those files? When that happens, then how difficult would it be for a government to leverage that same system to block printing of any firearm by an unapproved manufacturer? Possession of a printer without a management system will be prohibited and subject to fines and imprisonment. It's the same system, just extended to new tech.
However that said, if you have an old fashioned CNC milling machine, and lathe, then they'll still be able to turn out an AR lower every 20 minutes from an aluminum billet.
That's your first mistake, I make a fair income in a rural area taking a bag of parts that someone thought they could reassemble into the firearm they had, and finding at the 11th hour that they couldn't. Mostly it's just a little bit of patience, a few tricks here and there and some confidence.
Don't be so sure, additive manufacturing (which is what 3D printing is) has been around forever (do you own any plates, bowls, vases, etc made of ceramic). Certain materials lend themselves to this kind of process others less so. Certainly speed of manufacture is one aspect that needs to be considered, you can machine an AR lower from billet in around 20 minutes, most 3D printers would take around a day or more to produce the same (and that's thermoplastic, not aluminum I have no idea how long sintered metal printers take, but I can't imagine it would be faster than thermoplastic).
As far as gun control, no it's not going to be almost impossible, it may be easier. How easy is it to watch a movie without the required security and rights management? Even the signal between your player and TV is encrypted (and that's something that has happened in under the last 10 years). If you've ever lost your rights management database on your PC/device/etc. it has to dial home before it will give you access to your music bought via a music provider, or your books from Amazon or Moby and sometimes not even then. These can all be triggered by the provider too, to refresh your licenses. What's to stop that happening to a 3D printer? How long will it be before 3D printers that are easily available to the public will only print CAD files from approved and verifiable sources? With the correct fee's paid to the owners of those files? When that happens, then how difficult would it be for a government to leverage that same system to block printing of any firearm by an unapproved manufacturer? Possession of a printer without a management system will be prohibited and subject to fines and imprisonment. It's the same system, just extended to new tech.
However that said, if you have an old fashioned CNC milling machine, and lathe, then they'll still be able to turn out an AR lower every 20 minutes from an aluminum billet.
I don't see it. If any of that were a real problem you could not watch down load any movie or music you want via torrent. Pirate under ground is big, no its huge. To view a movie or listen to music is one thing but you can't stop the plans for guns to get to some printer. And most criminals will not be printing it, they will simply buy form the people who can print it. I have a friend who not only used to hack the dish network but now just watches movies a month or several before they are released here in the states. Music, any album almost in the world you can get via a torrent. I know for a fact you can get the AR lower 3d printer plans via torrent after the gov made places take them down. It reminds me of when I bought my first laser CD player and I actually had to register it with the gov. Now I can buy a laser pointer at the Circle K for 1.99 as I get my polar pop.
I don't see it. If any of that were a real problem you could not watch down load any movie or music you want via torrent. Pirate under ground is big, no its huge. To view a movie or listen to music is one thing but you can't stop the plans for guns to get to some printer.
And if the printer applies a rights management system so only plans that are rights managed are permitted to be printed...? And if printers without rights management systems are banned and made illegal to possess...?
You understand the legal penalties for using pirated music and video too, I assume... Let's just say if you're found in possession of too much, you won't be legally owning a gun again in this lifetime.
Quote:
Originally Posted by saxondale351
I have a friend who not only used to hack the dish network but now just watches movies a month or several before they are released here in the states.
Uh-huh...
You can find post-prod cuts on torrent sites occasionally. However getting the finished product it before release, nope, that's BS. Normally they're limited to a handful of trusted workers at the studio, if they're digitally distributed to movie theaters, they're RM has a date encoded for when it can be shown, theaters cannot show movies on equipment that does not meet studio RM requirements.
Have you ever been involved in the release of any major media entity? I have (video game, not movie), and there were two people in the world who had access to the encryption keys for digital signing (one and a spare, in case the primary was dead, or unavailable, and I'm not joking about the primary being dead either), that way if something hit street before it went to production we knew who could be responsible, and it's not difficult to figure out who messed up when there are only two of them. Any other media released that was not digitally signed would not operate on commercial hardware, indeed it would report back that an illegal copy had been discovered and which user tried to use it. We're talking about a Billion dollar sales market in the first week, do you think that perhaps the companies involved will be a little paranoid about losing control of it?
Physical copies were also strictly controlled, by the same two individuals, but without as tight constraints obviously since one copy was just one copy, BFD.
Quote:
Originally Posted by saxondale351
Music, any album almost in the world you can get via a torrent. I know for a fact you can get the AR lower 3d printer plans via torrent after the gov made places take them down. It reminds me of when I bought my first laser CD player and I actually had to register it with the gov.
Won't matter, if those plans do not have rights management. No rights management, no printing of them. A speaker is a passive device, a display unit is a passive device, an iPod is an active device. Yes currently 3D Printing allows for use of unmanaged plans being printed, but, how difficult do you think it will be to prevent that? All for the common good of course, and given a couple of lawsuits for production of patented work via 3d printing the print manufacturers will comply.
The process of controlling production of articles from 3D printers is already present in many digital distribution mechanisms, it just hasn't been applied to 3D printing yet, but it will, and if you think it won't there's a bridge in Brooklyn for sale, cheap.
And if the printer applies a rights management system so only plans that are rights managed are permitted to be printed...? And if printers without rights management systems are banned and made illegal to possess...?
You understand the legal penalties for using pirated music and video too, I assume... Let's just say if you're found in possession of too much, you won't be legally owning a gun again in this lifetime.
Uh-huh...
You can find post-prod cuts on torrent sites occasionally. However getting the finished product it before release, nope, that's BS. Normally they're limited to a handful of trusted workers at the studio, if they're digitally distributed to movie theaters, they're RM has a date encoded for when it can be shown, theaters cannot show movies on equipment that does not meet studio RM requirements.
Have you ever been involved in the release of any major media entity? I have (video game, not movie), and there were two people in the world who had access to the encryption keys for digital signing (one and a spare, in case the primary was dead, or unavailable, and I'm not joking about the primary being dead either), that way if something hit street before it went to production we knew who could be responsible, and it's not difficult to figure out who messed up when there are only two of them. Any other media released that was not digitally signed would not operate on commercial hardware, indeed it would report back that an illegal copy had been discovered and which user tried to use it. We're talking about a Billion dollar sales market in the first week, do you think that perhaps the companies involved will be a little paranoid about losing control of it?
Physical copies were also strictly controlled, by the same two individuals, but without as tight constraints obviously since one copy was just one copy, BFD.
Won't matter, if those plans do not have rights management. No rights management, no printing of them. A speaker is a passive device, a display unit is a passive device, an iPod is an active device. Yes currently 3D Printing allows for use of unmanaged plans being printed, but, how difficult do you think it will be to prevent that? All for the common good of course, and given a couple of lawsuits for production of patented work via 3d printing the print manufacturers will comply.
The process of controlling production of articles from 3D printers is already present in many digital distribution mechanisms, it just hasn't been applied to 3D printing yet, but it will, and if you think it won't there's a bridge in Brooklyn for sale, cheap.
Do you really think that all that will stop it? LMAO Its not legal to get torrent music that is only on apple, blablabla, Apple has tied and failed to stop any kind of copying, the movie industry has failed to even put a dent in any kind of pirating. Its not possible. Do you really think that it can be done? The color of the sky in that world is not blue. Maybe Marmalade or apricot sky's. There is nothing that can be done to stop people from making what ever they have plans for on any 3d printer. Do you think any 3d printer company will make printers in the first place that will not execute the plans of some individual that wants to whip up a toy car for their kid? Not to mention even if they came up with some lock that needed a ID key to allow it to print, how long before they added this to the printer plans? About 60 seconds. Its not an argument that can be taken very seriously.
The real point of this is that the quality of 3d printing is fast tracking to a day when you could do most anything you want. Want a SS AR lower? print it out. Want a 1911 print it out. Want a 30 round Pmag? Print it out. Or if you have some CAD experience make a new one. Print it with your name and logo on it. the ideas are endless and will change how we do things. Now it not only will change the gun control debate, but what if you don't want to buy one from some underground org, that prints them out and sells to the criminals of the world, imagine a time when a gun shop has not guns on display but not for sale one of display guns or a computer visual. You pick your gun and go have lunch and come back to get your newly printed AR or 1911. No stock, no shipping, all the transfer paper from one company to another. A one time creation and serial no that is immediately introduced into the system as its being made. This is why I bought DDD stock. I was up over 5% yesterday alone. I bought at 23 its at 76.10 yesterday.
And if the printer applies a rights management system so only plans that are rights managed are permitted to be printed...? And if printers without rights management systems are banned and made illegal to possess...?
You understand the legal penalties for using pirated music and video too, I assume... Let's just say if you're found in possession of too much, you won't be legally owning a gun again in this lifetime.
There is over 14 metric tons of heroin imported into the US each year ( http://www.hsdl.org/?view&did=38615 ), and you think they can keep printers from being hacked?
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
