Discussion of SWF FAQ Sticky (Cape Coral, Fort Myers: real estate market, foreclosures, rent)

[kroeran]

starting a separate thread for this...

this is Franks posting

===
Perhaps Koreran has a point.

IF what you folks are saying is,
"Ft. Myers/Cape Coral IS different then the rest of Florida, in that jobs, Real Estate, etc, IS different, (read worse, unique, etc). There are facts pertaining to here that folks considering moving here need to know"

THEN, I would consider a sticky post with a topic titles something like......"Things you need to know before moving here"

Despite what some "strange" folks think, I do not live there. I do not own property there. I do not know the area well at all.

I would insist this sticky be;
1) BALANCED I repeat BALANCED
2) Factual
3) Well written
4) Not "the sky is falling, Hell-hole, we don't want you" type of post.
5)Must have the good and the bad points about the area....perhaps with links to the local visitors bureau, Chamber of Commerce, etc.


As an outsider, this is how I see it. Ft. Myers/Cape Coral area is a beautiful place with Florida beaches, weather, etc. For those who are retired, set financially, etc, it can be one of the best places ever to live. The problems unique to the area are;
a) high unemployment
b) a Chaotic Real Estate market with foreclosures, Chinese drywall, etc. Do your homework....many good deals AND many BAD deals.
c) An above average amount of local Government problems

If you are considering moving here because you have problems where you are now.....our sunshine will not fix those problems. Lack of jobs, etc make this a place that will exacerbate any problems you may now have. Please do not add to our problems here.
BUT.....if you don't need a job, do your homework as to what and where to buy, this place could be great and we welcome you.

Something like THAT folks........now it is up to you. It's your forum, your place. I have tried to keep this sub-forum BALANCED and helpful, but it has been difficult and success has been limited due to excessive negative unbalanced posting that has turned many good posters off and have scared many helpful people away. Sad really.

Frank

[kroeran]

pulling this sort of thing together is what I do for a living, so I would be willing to volunteer to develop a first draft, which we could then pick apart in a thread over a period, and if a concensus was to emerge, we would submit that to Frank for his approval.

if someone else wants to take a crack at the first draft, thats fine by me too.

once the sticky is developed, it should be open to debate and editing as time goes by, to keep it fresh, I would suggest.

[rikoshaprl]

You develop stickies for a living? Only kidding. There are some great posts from the past that could be inserted into the new sticky.

[hiknapster]

You left out School Choice. It is the only school system that I know of that takes "School Choice" and uses it for the school system to actually pick the school for the student, under the guise that the parent is doing it. They claim it is hugely popular. I have never met anyone in "real life" that even slightly liked it. And on this forum not one post has ever said it was even, kind of, sort of, okay.

Children often sit for hours on school buses. It was like that when I moved there in 1998 and it like that now. It also changes the dynamic of the neighborhood. Lee County is tough enough with the demographic skewed to an older age group. In other words, it is hard to find kids in the neighborhood to play with. Then Lee County, in its infinite wisdom, breaks up those kids and sends them to different schools.

I did a lot of recent research and it does look like they receive grant money for the busing. Anyway. it is something that prospective parents need to know. It's HUGE to buy a home only to find that the school you thought your kids would attend is not going to be the one.

We also need this link: Table 1. Civilian labor force and unemployment by state and metropolitan area You can see what the latest numbers for unemployment in Fort Myers/Cape Coral look like, and folks can compare the numbers to where they live now, other places in Florida, and other parts of the country.

[nhkev]

Hik I don't mean this to start a debate, but........ I have made the remark before that unemployment rates are not always equal. My premise for this is the unemployment rate is based off a percentage of the workforce not the population. As you said in your previous post the area is skewed towards elderly and snowbirds , as well as some part year homeowners that maintain their residencies up north.
from a newspress article
Trouble is, that’s still about 600 fewer jobs than in August 2009. And, 37,649 people are looking for work here — or nearly 600 more than in August 2009.

Not sure what lee counties "official" population is wikipedia has this The city is one of two major cities that make up the Cape Coral-Fort Myers Metropolitan Statistical Area, the other being Cape Coral. The population estimate for the metropolitan area was 593,136 as of July 2008.[1]

Is this similar in other high unemployment areas?

So are my numbers off in some way? Now usually in this type of environment unemployment should almost always be lower than the national avg but obviously now it is not because if your economy is largely built on hospitality, tourism they usually get hit first and hardest.

[faithfulFrank]

Good points..but I think that may be 10%.
It is difficult to use just numbers, as they can often be skewed. I recall the saying, a recession is when your neighbor loses his job, a depression is when you do.......

Suffice to say that anyone coming to the area without a job secured is probably foolish.

Frank

[nhkev]

frank , I updated to reference the articles I was refering to ends up being 6.3% of population. I know it doesn't count children but if their are supposedly not many kids in the area you can't have arguments only when they work in your favor.


The number of people unemployed in Modesto peaked in March 2010 at 45,965. There are now 3,515 fewer people unemployed in the metropolitan area. From a recent trough of 41,103 in May 2010, the number of unemployed has now grown by 1,347. Modesto employment and jobs data (including jobs lost/gained in Modesto, California) is also available.

modesto's population is 211, 156 so that would come out to 19% not sure if this carries over to other hard hit areas

[hiknapster]

Wait a minute, when calculating the unemployment rate they do not count retires or children. Those people are not looking for a job! They measure the labor force. Those people aren't in it, as well as students and prisoners. I have put up the link, more than once, on how they arrive at the unemployment rate. I will go and find that again, and you are welcome.

Further, it has been argued that the unemployment rate is far from correct. True. It does not count people that gave up, people that are now underemployed, receiving much less pay, less hours, etc. But as a yardstick held against where you live now it is a very good indication.

A quick aside; I really have to say this. I must have a screw loose. I have done this day and day out for four years. I have had my current occupation for 10 months. I am amazed by the accusations that I have faced, the names I have been called, and it is from both sides. I really wish someone would see it for what it is. All I have wanted to do is help.

[hiknapster]

Here: How the Government Measures Unemployment

This was discussed at great length about a year ago.

Tjstrain said something that I found interesting. To paraphrase, he said that he was accused of saying things but when he looked back at his posts it was because people kept asking the same things over and over again and he kept giving the same answers.

I think a good portion of us are just trying to answer the questions and be helpful.

If you throw up link after link, news story after news story I don't know how helpful that is to people's specific questions.

On the other hand, playing games, being obtuse, being less than honest because you think that this forum will get your property to appreciate or sell or rent is mean and not useful. And when you are called on it personally attacking only proves that you are in deep-trouble.

I think a sticky will alleviate a lot of these problems. Us helpful people can move on.

[kroeran]

Originally Posted by rikoshaprl

You develop stickies for a living? Only kidding. There are some great posts from the past that could be inserted into the new sticky.

hah! I get to listen to a wide range of opinions and try to come up with documents that everyone agrees to...more or less

if you post some links in this thread to some of these great posts, I will summarize and incorporate them, as well as incorporate opinions on those postings as we go along...if that works

step one is to try to come to some sort of agreement on headings...like

maybe it should be called



LEE COUNTY FAQ
(Cape Coral, Fort Myers, Fort Myers Beach, Bonita Springs, Sanibel)


...start off with subject that interests everyone
WEATHER

FUN THINGS TO DO IN LEE COUNTY

BEACHES

BOATING

GOLFING

NATURE

CULTURE

SHOPPING

OTHER

DANGEROUS THINGS TO DO IN LEE COUNTY


TOURISM/HOTELS

VACATION HOMES

SNOWBIRDING

MOVING TO LEE COUNTY

NON-CITIZENS

PROPERTY TAXES

INSURANCE

JOBS

SCHOOLING

HOSPITALS

CAPE CORAL

FORT MYERS

FORT MYERS BEACH

BONITA SPRINGS

SANIBEL

UNINCORPORATED NEIGHBOURHOODS

LINKS


anything missing? anything that does not belong as a heading?

if someone wants to volunteer to develop some paragraphs under one or more of these headings...that would be great