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Venice, Italy? I have no idea what you mean when you say a city in Italy recognizes Crimea as Russian. Cities don't have any foreign policy authority.
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Originally Posted by serabal
Why do you write about Easten Ukraine? We do not possess it
You have thousands of troops in Eastern Ukraine. I have no idea whether Putin wishes to possess it, destroy it, or simply meddle in it, but the fact is that Russia occupies Crimea and Eastern Ukraine, and this is the entire reason for its global isolation and the economic sanctions.
Russian visits to Europe and the rest of the world have plummeted, as incomes/ wealth have declined. Russian businesses are isolated from participating in the biggest/wealthiest economies on earth- the U.S., Japan and the EU. The Russian presence in the West is a small fraction of years past.
Reduced income - yes. Isolation - no. Incidentally, the decline in income has made lower prices to foreigners. It promotes tourism and the localization of production in Russia.
By the way, today you can come to the Ice Hockey World Championship, which is held in Russia.
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Originally Posted by NOLA101
Russia has no major allies anywhere in the world. Russians, right now, are global pariahs.
Russia does not aspire to world domination. Russia solves problems around Russian borders. In post-Soviet countries, Caucasus, Central Asia, Middle East. And Russia has many allies in these regions.
It's fine; if this is your worldview, then you should be satisfied.
Yep, hate to be right, but everything that I predicted back in the nineties is already taking place.
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Russia is now isolated and poor,
And when it was not "isolated and poor," really?
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and you have no problem with it. This status will continue until Putin is gone and Ukraine is made whole.
Since I don't have problem with it, why would I want to see "Putin gone" and "Ukraine made whole?"
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If you need to construct fantasies to make you feel better about it ("America is interested in destroying Russia and anyone who disagrees is 'programmed'") then, yes, you certainly have that right.
America IS interested in destroying Russia, as the nineties proved it, and as Mr. Brzezinski book proved it once again. ( Ukraine and its destiny is a big part of the whole scheme by the way.) If you want to construct fantasies about "America - the peace-loving state "fair and balanced" - then yes, you certainly have the right.
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I'm not American, and I want Russia to prosper.
Except you don't understand much in what's needed for that.
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And there's no reason to think that the U.S. prefers a weak and dangerous Russia as opposed to a strong and globally engaged Russia.
You put "weak and dangerous" in the same sentence, but as usual you are wrong. The US indeed prefers a weak Russia, but dangerous? Of course not. However when Russia is weak, it becomes dangerous. And that's what the West ( US in this case in particular) doesn't seem to understand. They don't seem to learn the laws of the Universe.
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It serves no one's interests for Russia to be invading neighboring countries and threatening Eastern Europe with war,
No, Russia including, since "Eastern Europe" is nothing and no one to be "threatened with war." Why would a behemoth threaten a mosquito with the "war?"
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hence Russia has to live with the consequences if it makes these choices.
What, Russia is the five year old child judging by the "tone of your voice?"
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It's important for Europe and the U.S. to grow the Russian middle class, in order to create new consumers and advocates for democratic processes. But apparently Russia prefers a different path. Russia will have to live with its decisions.
No it's not. Russia never had "middle class" throughout history in Western understanding of it; (it was rather minuscule in Tzarist times, nothing to talk about comparably to the rest of European countries, and it was obviously absent in Soviet times.) When Russia finally had the opportunity to create that class back in the nineties, it was DENIED to Russians by the US establishment.
So what the US REALLY want is not the "growing of Russian middle class," but Russian UPPER class, loyal to American establishment and obedient to American consumerism.
There is a difference you see, but you don't understand much in the subject, do you? Yet here come your instructive escapades.
It's important for Europe and the U.S. to grow the Russian middle class, in order to create new consumers and advocates for democratic processes. But apparently Russia prefers a different path. Russia will have to live with its decisions.
The middle class has grown more under Putin than at any other time in Russian history. In 2000, the GDP per capita was $1,700, and by 2013 it grew to $14,600.
GDP per capita fell from 1990 to 2000. In 1990 it was $3,400, and that dropped to $1,700 in 2000.
So I am having a difficult time understanding how you cannot understand the fact that this happened under Putin, and it was a direct result of his actions, thus he enjoys a huge amount of support. You keep harping on Russia's economy, yet are obtuse to how much it has grown. Your blind hate for Putin blinds you to the realities of what good things he has done for Russians.
Yes, a better democratic process would be nice, however, there are two large issues that prevent this;
1. The second largest political party is the communist party.
2. The third largest party is the nationalist party.
It is extremely difficult to conduct democrat reform maneuvers when there is a sizable population that would either be against it, or exploit it to their benefit which would be detrimental to others, sort of like voting into power Hamas or something. People can and have indeed voted the worst of worst people into power, and when in power, make reforms to consolidate and hold power even more.
If the communists or nationalists ever got into power, they would most likely pursue policies to ensure they always retain power, all the while piling on their policies onto the state, and I cannot think of any good that would come out of their policies.
Until these threats die down, I see democratizing Russia more as threatening Russia itself. The sizable number of idiots would vote in communists or nationalists, and once they are in power, the only way to get rid of them would be through a coup or revolt.
Putin at the same time has to appeal just enough to the communists and nationalists not to set off any internal dissent as well. He cannot completely dismiss them, yet cannot embrace them nor allow them power.
The middle class has grown more under Putin than at any other time in Russian history. In 2000, the GDP per capita was $1,700, and by 2013 it grew to $14,600.
GDP per capita fell from 1990 to 2000. In 1990 it was $3,400, and that dropped to $1,700 in 2000.
So I am having a difficult time understanding how you cannot understand the fact that this happened under Putin, and it was a direct result of his actions, thus he enjoys a huge amount of support. You keep harping on Russia's economy, yet are obtuse to how much it has grown. Your blind hate for Putin blinds you to the realities of what good things he has done for Russians.
Yes, a better democratic process would be nice, however, there are two large issues that prevent this;
1. The second largest political party is the communist party.
2. The third largest party is the nationalist party.
It is extremely difficult to conduct democrat reform maneuvers when there is a sizable population that would either be against it, or exploit it to their benefit which would be detrimental to others, sort of like voting into power Hamas or something. People can and have indeed voted the worst of worst people into power, and when in power, make reforms to consolidate and hold power even more.
If the communists or nationalists ever got into power, they would most likely pursue policies to ensure they always retain power, all the while piling on their policies onto the state, and I cannot think of any good that would come out of their policies.
Until these threats die down, I see democratizing Russia more as threatening Russia itself. The sizable number of idiots would vote in communists or nationalists, and once they are in power, the only way to get rid of them would be through a coup or revolt.
Putin at the same time has to appeal just enough to the communists and nationalists not to set off any internal dissent as well. He cannot completely dismiss them, yet cannot embrace them nor allow them power.
But erasure says that Russia doesn't have a middle class, so how can it have grown?
Beautiful words. But at the same time, Alexander III made an alliance with France against Germany, which further defined the fate of Russia.
Of course he made! His words meant that any ally will betray. Because each country has it's owm interests. When we have the same interests we are allies and when we have different interests we are enemies
But erasure says that Russia doesn't have a middle class, so how can it have grown?
Russia has a middle class.
There is no real definition of middle class, but to use the generic standards, yes, Russia has a middle class. Many people have cars, own a home or two, travel internally and internationally, Internet, 3g, cell phones, consumer goods, etc. I have lived there and with the exception of the poor medical system, day to day living was not much different than in the US or London. I would say day to day living there is equitable to Greece or Turkey to be a bit more accurate; hectic, lack of perfection, but enough to satisfy the need for western amenities. Just as long as I did not need emergency medical care of course.
The middle class can stand to grow more, but it is not like it does not exist. Also, people forget the huge under ground economy Russia has (with economists stating it was this economy that was responsible for Russia's quick rebound from the 1990's financial crisis). For every person working some normal job, it is like every third one has got some side things going getting under the table money.
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