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Which map? You can get great election result maps at www.uselectionatlas.org Just click the Election Results link. Both parties have plenty of poor and plenty of nice areas.
Not to disrespect the poverty problems of Appalachia since I don't know much about it, but that photo looks like a regular middle-class house from where I live in mostly "white", central Maine. In the right area, it would cost approx. $80-100,000. The average price of a home in the United States seemed to be around $150,000 as I last read. It may be true then that Appalachia does represent the majority of the American economy, and we can all agree that is pretty alarming.
It can be easy for Americans to see the potential of poor Americans to bootstrap it as the myth goes, and skyrocket miraculously from extreme poverty into middle-class society (from one area of the US to another, perhaps). However, as Mary_Moon says, it depends on how these persons relate to work and education -- I will add, how they relate financially to education as required to perform the middle class jobs (or does a job happen in a vacuum?).
In order to remove individualized blame, let's not forget that the struggle of a middle-class person worth 25k to feed her children may be just as disheartening as the struggle of a poverty-stricken person worth 10k to feed herself. As one example, either of these is probably not the best starting point for a degree-track program without the availability of welfare - we're all against welfare here, I assume.
I for one would love to hear a complete and true success story from a previously poverty-stricken Appalachian, or American, who "made it out." I have not yet heard one.
Yes, that house really doesn't look especially bad. It looks like the roof is okay, there's a nice front porch and even a handicap ramp up to it. It looks like an okay house for someone without too much money and not an overly large family.
Just like in trailer parks, you can find affordable homes that people live in just fine, they've got indoor toilets, running water, enough heat in the winter. They can be clean, they may not have 4000 sq ft of floor space and marble floors but are perfectly liveable.
Even here on the Southwest border, one cannot assume anything from the exterior of a home. It can look poor but go inside and it's neat and clean and also has an HDTV connected to a video game player and there are kids with computers and iPhones.
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Just because one area is doing poorly doesn't mean that the entire nation is... Johnson visited Appalachia in 1964 to get his "War on Poverty" program moving and it has gone nowhere. They're stuck in conditions similar to 1964. I'm not sure why you didn't mention that piece. And yes, people are always going to do bad as well as people whom are going to do good. America is the greatest country. You won't appreciate it until you probably move off because we're going to have an "economic collapse". Please, go to Texas, North Dakota, Massachusetts, Washinton state, and tell me we're miserable.
Most people intend to use Medicare one day if they are not old enough to be on it already. Nobody wants to think that he is on/planning to use a anti-poverty program. So we conveniently forget. War on Poverty is for those ugly, bad people on the rough side of town.
Funny thing about the War on Poverty. Everybody conveniently forgets that Medicare is the most critical piece. Wonder why that is.... [/sarcasm]
Very true. Medicare was the centerpiece of the War on Poverty. In fact, former president Truman was there for the signing of the bill into law, and he and his wife Bess were the first two people handed Medicare cards. It was one of Johnson's proudest accomplishments in the Great Society.
I for one would love to hear a complete and true success story from a previously poverty-stricken Appalachian, or American, who "made it out." I have not yet heard one.
I am a retiree and am old enough to remember the large number of people from Appalachia and other southern regions who emigrated to Detroit for jobs in the auto industry in the 50's & 60's. I had many friends from school who's parents brought them to Detroit in search of work. My own parents moved to Detroit from West Texas in 1935 to escape the dust bowl and the ravages of the depression. The people from Appalachia settled in certain sections of Detroit as did the European immigrants finding their own enclaves. Back in the 50's & 60's most of the South was financially depressed including cities such as Atlanta. So people moved to Detroit from all of the southern states seeking work. All of the people I knew were very hard working and appeared grateful to have jobs that afforded them a nice middle class existence.
In the 50's and 60's work was booming at the auto plants. People without H.S. educations could get jobs working on the assembly lines or pushing brooms. If you had a H.S education you probably would be selected to participate in their various apprenticeship programs. An opportunity to learn a skilled trade with good pay and a defined benefit retirement program. In addition, overtime hours were the norm with time and a half pay. These factories were producing 24/7 back in the day. Tough working environment though. Extremely loud machines that were never idled, oil 1/2 to 1" deep on the floors and no air conditioning.
I have never seen any statistics on how many of the workers from Appalachia left their jobs to go back home. Honestly, I don't think too many. Instead family members seemed to head North to join them. I think it is more of an issue that too many people refused to leave their regions to seek work. Bobby Bare had a huge hit with the song "Detroit City" in 1963. It describes the loneliness felt by one auto worker:
Bobby Kennedy visited Appalachia in the mid 60's. His visit was reported on a show such as 20/20 or 60 minutes. He meant well with his visit but the people he visited seemed uninterested and acted as though he was imposing into their lives.
Fast forward 50 or 60 yrs. Absolutely no jobs anywhere for a uneducated worker. They have been trying to educate the young people from Appalachia for many decades but apparently without much success. It seems as though too many people are turning to meth labs as they did with moonshine so many years ago.
I am sure that some people are motivated enough to get an education and leave but probably too few to make a dent in the poverty statistics. Too few left in the 50's & 60's and too few leave today.
A lot of people forget that Appalachia doesn't end at the Mason-Dixon line. There are plenty of mountain people in Central PA, Upstate NY, and New England. Also worth mentioning that the government spends a ton of money on parents, whether they need it or not. Public schools with meals and transportation, more tax credits and deductions than you'd believe. Middle class suburban parents are the real welfare queens in this country.
While these northern areas are geographically part of the Appalachian Mountains and are defined as "Appalachia" by the ARC, they don't constitute what I'd call "core" Appalachia, nor what most people think of when they hear Appalachia. I'd call "core" Appalachia southwest VA, WV, and eastern KY. Other "bad" parts on the periphery of the "core" are western PA, eastern TN, eastern OH, and western NC. All those benefits and tax credits also apply to Appalachians.
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Originally Posted by Hip Priest
Sadly, things really are that bad in that part of southern Appalachia. One of my best friends is from Hazard, KY, and he's told me all about the crushing poverty in the region. Most of the people who live there are good folks, but they literally have nothing, because there are no opportunities for them to succeed. He got out, but many can't. It's a shame that in the richest country in the world in 2014, we have people existing in these conditions (I would have said living, but they're truly merely existing.). Talk about wealth disparity!
Most people anywhere are law-abiding and just trying to get to by, but a lot of people here in Appalachia have turned criminal, in my opinion, because there are no jobs, no hope, and nothing productive for them to do. If people had an honest way to get by, I think many would turn to honest instead of criminality, but they do what they have to survive.
Kingsport is a decent sized city for the area, but jobs (even for experienced adults, much less teenagers and young adults) are few and far between, pay little, and there isn't much to do, especially for young people when 40% of the town is over 50. Outside of church, there isn't much of a civic structure. This leads to people with too much time on their hands and then they get into trouble.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbeforeb
Just because one area is doing poorly doesn't mean that the entire nation is... Johnson visited Appalachia in 1964 to get his "War on Poverty" program moving and it has gone nowhere. They're stuck in conditions similar to 1964. I'm not sure why you didn't mention that piece. And yes, people are always going to do bad as well as people whom are going to do good. America is the greatest country. You won't appreciate it until you probably move off because we're going to have an "economic collapse". Please, go to Texas, North Dakota, Massachusetts, Washinton state, and tell me we're miserable.
You're right - most of the country is progressing and moving forward. The economy is recovering, albeit in fits and starts, in most places, but it hasn't and won't recover here in Appalachia. The industries the area was built on (lumber, mining, tobacco) have all seen their heyday and aren't coming back to provide jobs for the masses. With poor education systems and harsh topography, there really is no catalyst for job growth.
Most people intend to use Medicare one day if they are not old enough to be on it already. Nobody wants to think that he is on/planning to use a anti-poverty program. So we conveniently forget. War on Poverty is for those ugly, bad people on the rough side of town.
Personally, I despise Medicare because it's costs have gone up dramatically more than ever projected (and this fact is ignored in mainstream media). It's further proof that the War on Poverty (just like the war on drugs) is a failure (for the people) but a victory for the elite. The true goal for all of these "wars" is centralizing power and control in the hands of a few.
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