Nasal cancer (powder, kidney, border collie, how much)
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Erica- So happy to hear Scout is doing well. It sounds like the treatment Scout received as far as the definitive radiation ( & no chemo, no IMRT) is exactly what Allie is currently receiving. Her right eye is in the radiation field, she has already started to lose her hair under that eye. It's been a bit of a hard weekend because we are seeing the side effects (the hair loss & redness under her eye) begin. As far as nasal bleeding/difficulty breathing, that all stopped about 2 weeks ago. She's going in for her last week tomorrow. Looks like we are trading some side effects for the others. It's so hard.
Can you tell me what Scout's side effects were throughout treatment as well as afterwards? Allie is getting the 18 treatments vs. the 10, don't know how that will differ for side effects.
Virginia10- how is your ally doing?
Also, does anyone have any experience or feedback with K-9 immunity? Is this something you would recommend to start after her treatment or ASAP?
Also, that was such a wonderful post, DashDog...living in the moment and enjoying them each second is so key.
Alliebear, My dog Ally is doing well now. It looks like the heavy duty antiobiotic they put her on for the nasal infection is clearing up the infection. The breathing is much more normal at night except when she is bleeding (but that is not a lot right now) and the snoring which she does sometimes. From what I understand there are different types of cancers in the nose- my Ally has a osteosarcoma which usually is not found in the nose, but is a nasty kind to have. When she stopped taking the anti-inflammatory her appetite returned. She loves to go on walks during the day. Sometimes she bounces around like a puppy and other days she goes much slower. Right now there are days I look at her and think she is back to normal and then I am jolted back to reality by her labored breathing and blood which starts coming out of her nose. I find this very depressing. I am always second guessing my decision, and know, if like you I moved forward with the radiation that I would be second guessing that decision too. The other day a friend told me that her neighbor's dog was diagnosed with cancer and given a year to live. They moved forward with chemo and now four years later the dog is in remission. I was so excited that I was going to take my Ally down to start the treatments. Then I goggled the type of cancer the neighbor's dog had and found that it was highly treatable and depression set in again. I am wondering if I should try metronomic therapy I have read about in some posts on this thread, or if that is useless without doing the radiation. The oncologist said it would not hurt, but he did not feel it would help either. I wish the best thoughts for your Allie. I have been very impressed by the kindness and the willingness of people to share on this site. Please write about any information you find about the k-9 immunity. It's so hard to know when you find products on the web if they are really useful. I believe you said something about being near a vet college. I live in Southern Calif., but have not been able to find one in this area, which did surprise me. Hoping that you have many more "moments" to enjoy with your Allie.
Virginia- I'm happy to hear the bleeding has slowed a bit for Ally. I know it's such a cycle..one things slows, another starts. You are right, it's depressing!!! The second guessing and 'what if' game will get the best of you. I find just focusing on 'she's here & happy now' and taking her to do something she loves helps. I am sure everyone on this board does the same thing.
I don't believe Allie is receiving metronomic therapy. I'm not familiar with that treatment...I will have to look it up!
Like you said in an earlier post, these nasal cancers are tough. We did make the decision to do the radiation knowing it would only buy her another year or year and a half until it comes back...not sure how many cases of nasal cancer remission there are, but it's hopeful to hear with some of the holisitic treatments like neoplasene dogs like Dash and Scout continue to do well. I don't know if I will do neoplasene, but I plan to take Allie to a new holisitc vet when she is finished w/ the radiation to weigh all of the possible treatment options...I completely agree with your comment about the kindness on this board. It helps so much to know what others are doing and their feedback...especially about products like neoplasene.
We are actually taking Allie to the University of Missouri..they have a large vet teaching hospital there and it is the only place that will do the radiation. It's 2 hours away so we (have family members helping out with this...such a blessing!) make the drive two hours there, stay for treatment and drive back home. We are all glad it's our last week!!
I hope you and Ally have a great, easy-breathing Monday (and everyone else on the board too!).
Just a message to people whose dogs are ill. You may want to check out pet cemetery services in your area in advance. We have a wonderful place here in Vermont called White Rose, where they treat your pet with such respect and dignity. They offer a range of services for handling the body. You can even wait while your pet is cremated and then spread the ashes outdoors. It makes such a huge difference to be able to spend time with your furbaby after they pass on. It made a difference to me. I was never aware of these services until now, and I want to spread the word.
Alliebear,
Yes, it does sound like your dog is receiving similar treatment to Scout's. We also drove him 2 hours/day to Boston for his treatment. I was able to stay with family most of the time, but it was still a long, hard treatment period! Scout's bad side effects didn't set in until the very end and two/three weeks following treatment. He didn't end up with mouth sores and didn't struggle with eating, but the rawness and sores on his face were pretty darn bad. I can't look at pictures of him now--they are too sad. The worst was when he would manage to rub at them. We had to keep an e-collar on him for two weeks straight--and he's not a dog to mess with stuff. Everytime I thought we had the sores healing up, he would manage to roll and mess his face up again. Keeping the face clean with just warm water seemed to help. I also remember his oncologist rubbing some of the skin/fur off, which seemed to speed up the process. We kept him on pain killers for a few weeks. He also was very tired and depressed afterward. He'd always been a super active dog, and I couldn't get him to even get off the couch in the weeks following radiation. I finally brought him back to Angell and the vet told me to drag him out on a walk. I did, and he got his energy back pretty quick. You'll have to watch really carefully for ulcers in the eye that was in the field--we got one early on. I'm crazy about putting drops in, and it seems to help.
I looked into k-9 immunity and decided against it. I'm really not an alternative med type--I don't have anything against unconventional treatments but tend to stick with the regular old stuff. I thought about neoplasene and even talked to the doctor that many others are using in CA. While I decided against that, I have been using the Budwig Protocol (cottage cheese and flaxseed oil) that Bear's Dad on this list recommended. Although it's hard to tell because of the cycles of this disease, it really seems to help. You may want to try it--it's easy and cheap. I didn't do anything, however, until I started to see a return of symptoms.
Erica, My heart went out to you and your dog when I read about what you went through during radiation. I can see that it is hard, no matter what route you take, and no matter what, you will always be second guessing your decision. We tried an alternative med treatment yesterday. I was going to see how it turned out before I posted it, but already I am worried about it. A friend who is a doctor who is now into holistic approaches suggested that we use activated charcoal with our dog Ally. He said that when he worked in the emergency room that this is what they would use on people who have been poisoned. Apparently it absorbs the poisons the body produces and is benign to the body. He said many people drink it in water to cleanse their systems. When we were told that it might help and would not hurt, we tried it. He mixed some with salt and water and we used an ear syringe to put it in the dog's nose. Right away some mucus and blood came out and he said that was good. Today, however, she has had a couple of bleeding episodes. When my husband came home he said she had a lot of blood on her nose and some was coming out and it freaked him out. A couple of hours later I saw a small puddle of blood on the floor and some coming out of her nose and I was upset. We really don't know what is too much blood, but intend to watch her closely tonight and call the oncologist tomm. and hope we did not do something wrong. Maybe this is just one of the cycles you are talking about- I feel like I am on a roller coaster. How much cottage cheese and flaxseed do you feed Scout- do you use it in place of other food or as a supplement? It is so hard to decide the right thing to do.
I think the bleeding is the hardest part for some people. Notice I did say people as it does not seem to bother the dogs. Even back in the beginning when Dash did have a major nose bleed and looked like a slasher had gotten ahold of him as there was that much blood, he was not bothered by it. I took him outside and held ice to his muzzle as cold causes the blood vessels to constrict and will help stop the bleed.
I work in a hospital so the bleeding does not bother me. I think it is very important that owners stay calm when dealing with a bleed as the dog will pick up the anxiety and that may increase the heart rate which may then increase the bleed.
I have found that the bleeds tend to be self limiting, the major ones for Dash have been infrequent but these days he tends to have blood dripping out off and on most of the time. To protect my furniture I went to Costco and bought some king sized soft fleece type blankets and have furniture covered with them. They were inexpensive, can be washed are very soft and do a great job protecting the furniture. I do not have carpet downstairs and that is where he likes to spend most of his time as he loves the coolness of the floors.
How much of the activated charcoal did he put down the nose? I would be careful and keep the amounts of any thing down the nose small as the dog could aspirate it into its lungs and end up with an aspiration pneumonia.
You feel like you are on a roller coaster because you are. With any cancer be it in a human or a pet the roller coaster ride is part of the deal so hold on tight . Wish I could say it was not that way but it is and if you are on it long enough you do start getting use to it.
Sending positive thoughts and prayers your way along with the ones I am sending to all the others . Jan
Thank you Erica for the information about Scout. I'm so happy to hear how things have worked out for you...I had a golden growing up..they are such amazing dogs. Scout is sounds like he is so active and agile & not to mention very brave!
Your post was so helpful. It's good to just know what to expect and know things might get worse before they get better. I will definitely look into the Budwig Protocol. The heads up about eye ulcers is great..will look out for those. They gave us some cream to put on her face...and sent her home with an e-collar yesterday due increased irritation/loss of more hair. She is devastated about the collar of all things..just stands in one place with those sad little eyes begging for me to take it off.....I figure we have gotten through the last 3.5 weeks of radiation, we will get through the e-collar days & sores as well and keep her comfortable with the pain meds and creams. I am so happy we only have 2 more days of radiation left and we are done for good..hoping we did some major damage to the nasty tumor.
Alliebear,
One more thing that my oncologist told me that helped. Before we decided she said that most of patients come back to her during the 2-3 weeks afterwards saying, "Why did I ever do this?" Then they come back another 3 weeks later saying, "I'm so glad I did this." If it gets really bad for a while, know that it'll get better soon. They heal and recover quickly.
Good luck,
Erica
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It's so hard. 
