Denver vs. Portland, OR (Colorado Springs, Golden: 2015, homes, transfer to)
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I have experience with this one. Whoever said Portland is more cosmopolitan is pulling your leg. I am a Colorado native who left 4 years for Oregon. All that water, it just seemed like a good idea, and now I'm here doing school research to move back to Denver. Contrary to what the media tells you, Denver is not full of dirty snowpiles all the time. It doesn't actually snow that much, when I lived in Vail that was a different story. And when it does snow it melts fast and the sun is shining the day after it snows. Portland is absolutely a city full of overeducated, underemployed people. Don't get me wrong, it's beautiful and green, but I can't wait to leave.
In Denver everything is close to downtown, the zoo, the botanic gardens, the natural history museum, Coors Field, Mile High, the children's museum, the Pepsi Center, the list goes on. But in PDX the zoo is 15 minutes out of the city, there is no pro football, no pro baseball, everything is more spread out. Portland is a very casual city too. I liked that at first but sometimes I want to dress up and go out. And the gray, yuck. The sun goes down one day in early November and doesn't come back until May. Even then it doesn't get hot here until July 1st. When we lived in Denver we had my son's June 3 birthday party outdoors every year and thought we could do that here too and the first year it was too cold for a pool party so we had to cancel. You can count on it being warm here in July and August and most of September.
PDx is great, there are a lot of really cool, crafty people here. It is an artier community than Denver but that Portland Church of Craft is not enough to sustain a person. Good luck with your move.
My vote would be for Portland, just for atmosphere. As to salaries, I am not sure if you can make that coming out to either place, it depends a lot on the competition when coming to Denver and LOTS of young workers want to get here. Portland's economy is slower and steady, while Denvers has always been more boom or bust. We have a low unemployment rate right now but that is largely due to more and more lower paying jobs springing up. I couldn't say for MBAs althought there are biotech jobs I don't think they pay that great either.
I personally love Portland and prefer it over Denver as a lively, cosmopolitan city. But then I grew up near there so I have webbed feet and love the rain. My wife could never handle it, which is why we're here, the next best thing and we love it here, too.
Don't rule out Douglas County out of political concerns. The county is moving about 4 points bluer every 2 years (46% for Ritter in 2006) and has a very active Democratic community, though of course still nothing like Boulder.
When thinking about which city you prefer there are so many aspects one must consider. In the long run though the climate, the nice mountains or oceans or cosmopolitain environment is all nice. When it comes right down to it though what really makes the choice is how the people in each place impress us or don't, and the job situation. Portland seems like a place where so many move to because Oregon has beautiful scenery and some semblance of liberalism in Portland and Eugene. That is all very nice but one has to work and I would think that would be the determining factor in choosing a location.
First of all, there are a lot of biotech companies up north of Denver, which, luckily for you, is also getting towards Boulder, which is very liberal. North Denver and Denver itself are liberal also. As you start to creep south into Douglas and El Paso Couties it gets red.
Here is my favorite link if you are ever curious about who votes how: Election 2004 Results
Kelly Scientific Resources is the main science job placement firm for the Denver/front range, you might want to google them, give them a call and feel them out.
Someone else will have to answer with respect to Marketing/MBA jobs.
The Denver area is sunny almost all the time. There are all kinds of people here. In my opinion people are more relaxed than east-coasters. Probably because there is so much open space here, so many great outdoors things to do, and lots of places to go if you don't feel like being around other people. If you like cycling or jogging the Denver Metro area has a great trails system. My husband's relatives are from the east, and they dress much more formally than here. You can wear jeans and capris at a lot of high-paying jobs.
Houses here are less than Portland, which means you have money left over to go to Mexico for some beach time.
denver will feel very different from boston in many, many ways, as will portland. keep searching through the forum to figure out how: it's probably been written over and over without being rewritten here. keywords like "education", "schools", "politics", "culture", "diversity", "ethnicity", "people", "restaurants", "food", "environment", "water issues", "employment", "cosmopolitan", "biotech", etc. under the denver and portland categories. you will get returns that seem a little off your interest, but will probably reveal some things in the attitudes and other things of interest. there's a thread on "the people" on the denver list, for example. look on this forum and others concerning places and cities, and you will get a feel - there will be some bias here and there, but overall, you will probably notice some trends. one comment i will make is that it seems lots of people think denver or portland will be the end all be all in some ways, while getting there and learning a few other things that they might not have guessed or considered would be as profound for them as they can turn out to be, for worse or better.
I've lived in Denver and Portland for over 5 year's each and I'm not originally from either area.
I agree with the other posters that both are great places to live.
I moved from Portland to Denver after High School and maintain close relationships with friends and family in both areas. I currently live in a suburb of Denver called Lakewood.
I've lived in the Denver suburbs of Westminster, Littleton, Lakewood, Broomfield, Denver itself, Thornton, Northglenn, and others mostly on the west side of town.
In Portland I lived also mainly in the western suburbs of Hillsboro, Aloha, Beaverton, etc.
Some of the random things I have noticed about both areas:
1. Driving around Denver I see often see Oregon license plates on other vehicles at the rate of a bout 1 per day (each on on a differnt car). I have rarely seen any Colorado license plates driving around Oregon. I'm uncertain if this is a DMV or maybe vaction thing. I also run into about 1 person per month that is originally from Oregon or Washington.
2. I graduated from high school in the Hillsboro suburb of Portland with about 500 people, and less than 10% of my graduating class has left the Portland area according to the reunion statistics.
3. There is no sales tax on most items in Oregon. However other taxes tend to be higher to offset this, especially property taxes. Sales taxes in Denver can vary widely depending on the suburb you are in from approx 4% to nearly 8%.
4. To my knowledge every single gas station in the state of Oregon is full service. You cannot pump your own gas for your car. Gas prices reflect this and tend to be slightly higher. Driving back to Oregon personally I find it cumbersome to wait in a line for gas when I'm in a rush to get somewhere.The octane ratings of gas for cars are somewhat differnt in Denver due to altitude and weather considerations.
5. Public transportation in Portland is much more accesable than in Denver. The new light rail system in Denver is a carbon copy of the sytem that Portland has had for several years. The mayors of the two cities worked together on the Denver project when it was being designed. Having a car in Denver is a must to get around town. There are many buses but the schedules are often cumbersome as is the placement of the stops if you happen to live in the suburbs. The light rail in Denver covers a small area but planning on a city-gov level is underway to expand it further. The light rail in PDX runs east-west through the core of the city including downtown and to the PDX airport (DEN airport is car only). Very helpful for nightlife activites and traveling via the airport. The bus stops that I used in PDX were always well located and the buses seemed to run every 15 min. making planning a snap.
5. Having searched for jobs in both states I have found the jobs in Colorado easier to come by, but Colorado jobs these jobs also seem to tend to have a higher turn-over rate based on my own experience. Tech jobs are avail in both areas, in Portland check out the so-called sillicon forest in mostly the western suburbs. Intel is a big emloyer in the western suburbs. Tech jobs are all over Denver but concetrated between Denver and Boulder and in a area called the DTC in south/central Denver (Denver Tech Center...this area has light rail access)
6. Nightlife....One frustration I always had with Portland, and this may sound silly is with pizza. I can get a pizza most hours of the day and night in Denver. However Portland seems to shut most things down by 10p-12a. With repsect to other types of food I have found many places open all night in Denver, but fewer in Portland. The number of clubs and bars seems to be fairly evenly matched between the two cities. Both cities have movie theaters that will serve you meals while you watch movies.
7. Medical........There are many hospitals in both areas and both have good and bad spots. Having said that, OHSU (Oregon Health Sciences University) is one of the best I have had to visit anywhere in the USA. They saved my life with an airlift from Hillsboro. My words really cannot do those folks any justice. They are great and I wish we had them here in Denver.
8. People.......I think the other posters hit it on the head, really the red vs blue areas vary depending on suburb in both states. While I find people in both areas generally similar, they seem harder to meet in Denver...a bit more distant initally.
9.Farmbelt.....The farm belt seems closer to Portland than it is to Denver. While most cites have a saturday market, being closer to the source is always good as far as fresh crops goes. Portland has 1 or more wineries close to town, some in town. All that I know of for Denver is about an hour drive or more. Portland has a really neat experimental rose garden that I very highly recomend that you look up and or visit (overlooks the city of Portland).
10. parks......so many parks in both places really difficult to say which is better. Depends on what you like in a park.
11. The Denver Broncos (NFL), The Colorado Rockies (Baseball) , The Avalanche (NHL), soccer, and various other sports teams are centrally located downtown. As are most of the musuems. All of these are great times and are worth a look. Portland seems to lack in the profession sports area, but there is college and High school sports to consider in both areas. Portland boasts 1 major stadium downtown (Rosegarden) and Denver has at least 3 (Mile High Stadium, Pepsi center, Coors Field, etc. as well as many large to small concert venues. The Denver music scene is very interesting right now.
12. Not sure if anyone has mentioned natural hazards yet, but there are some intersting things to note. Portland is located at the intersection of 2 large rivers (Columbia and Willamette both very scenic) so flooding can sometimes occur (but seems intermitten and rare). Also Portland is near two active volcanoes, the 1st being Mt Hood which hasn't erupted since Lewis and Clark visited the area (as far I know) and the more famous MT St Helens which is currently erupting (minor) but not impacting populated areas. There are also on occasion earthquakes in Portland and as far as I know is over due for a "big one" like in California. Denver does not have volcanoes but it does have heavy T-storms during parts of the year. There is less drizzle in Denver and more lightning, hail, and occasional weak tornadoes. There is the obvious snow, but we rarely get snowed in (1-2 times every 2-3 years for a few days, normally less than a week), infact snow usually melts in the city in a day or two and most cities are good about sand/salting and plowing streets...the mountains are another story though.....many roads in the higher altitude areas (above and outside of Denver metro) close during winter and do not open till mid-late spring. This does not generally include routes to ski areas which are usually well maintained and very scenic at any time of the year.
Well I have to stop writing for a bit. Hopefully this helps. Sorry If I over covered or repeated anything. Let me know if any questions
Mazimitsu, thanks for a great recap of the two cities.
EVERYONE please give mazimitsu POSITIVE REP by clicking on the scales of justice (upper right), thanks.
Regarding the light rail, I'm glad to see the two mayors work together, as the cost to design and tool-up from scratch a new light rail car and system is huge; conversely, if you can use an existing design and factory tooling, there are huge cost avoidances or savings. There was a time (a smarter time) in our nation's past when the Presidents of most big city streetcar lines formed a Conference Committee to design and built a single standard streetcar for all cities, with the intent being to reduce the cost to buy and maintain the cars. Thus was born the PCC Car, still seen in some cities like Phila or SF, CAL, for more, see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PCC_streetcar
Location: Governor's Park/Capitol Hill, Denver, CO
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I have been silently observing this thread as I love both cities. I just wanted to point out how congenial the discussion is and that it is very representative of the people that live in both cities. Yes the climates are different and the details are compared, but it is nice to see candor presented in a polite fashion verses comparisons of other cities on City-Data.
I have been silently observing this thread as I love both cities. I just wanted to point out how congenial the discussion is and that it is very representative of the people that live in both cities. Yes the climates are different and the details are compared, but it is nice to see candor presented in a polite fashion verses comparisons of other cities on City-Data.
It also helps that this was posted in the Denver forum, as opposed to the General U.S. forum which seems to have more trolls that make the discussion more strident.
Location: Governor's Park/Capitol Hill, Denver, CO
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Reputation: 1135
Quote:
Originally Posted by goozer
It also helps that this was posted in the Denver forum, as opposed to the General U.S. forum which seems to have more trolls that make the discussion more strident.
We have our share of Debbie Downers and Creeping Trolls in this Denver forum and I am surprised they have not yet jumped in, but you are right. I recent was checking out the General U.S. discussions and wow, they really like to slug it out. Too much wasted energy and for what? They just end up making their own cities less desirable as well as themselves.
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transplant to Portland and Denver
