From LA to Denver/Considering Portland (Aurora, Lakewood: renters, home owners insurance, home)

[ksherm]

I'm sure this has been beat to death, but I am new to the forums and I have read everything I can get my hands on that is available. It is also nice to get some current information.

My girlfriend and I have decided we've had enough of Los Angeles. We are both from the midwest areas (I'm from Billings/Missoula, Montana and she is from Fargo, ND/Moorhead, MN). We initially moved out here because I am interested in entertainment marketing with a digital or social media emphasis and it seemed to be the best place. She is a wildlife biology major and while we initially thought there were opportunities here for her, we are finding there are none. Well 8 miserable months later and currently working as a barista, we've had ENOUGH. We crave a mix of big city life and community feel. Something more "real" if you will. And we aren't willing to sign another lease and spend another year here trying to wait it out.

My question is: What is the job climate like for marketing, specifically marketing for musicians, entertainment and brands? I know the economy is in the tank, but nothing is as bad as where we are now. I have a social media/digital marketing focus. I'd also like to know what it is like for a wildlife biology major wanting to do wildlife research in the field or anything very closely related. She realizes she will have to travel to the outskirts of Denver for this, but it is just a matter of how far.

We are debating between Denver and Portland right now. So any information on differences, pros, cons, industry data, recreation, etc would be amazing.

Some background info:

I am 24, she is 23. We have two dogs and a cat. The dogs are a 25 lb Boston Terrier and a Cane Corso puppy that will be 6 months by the time we move and will weigh about 60 pounds. We love a good nightlife, concerts, social life, but also enjoy recreation like snowboarding, hiking, camping and solitude activities. Feeling comfortable but with a lot of options for things to do is very important. We've never felt safe or comfortable in LA.

I'm sure I am forgetting something, but any information helps!

[davebarnes]

Kansas City is "hot" right now.

[ksherm]

I'm not really interested in Kansas City. Any useful information is appreciated.

[PNW-type-gal]

Your post in the Portland forum got moved to the "City vs City" forum (don't ask me, we have a new mod, although, in general, starting the same thread in different forums is not permitted under the TOS). Ask here about breed bans, as I believe the Cane Corso is on the banned list for Denver. Some of the surrounding cities have a similar breed ban, some don't. I have family in Denver, but since I can't bring my 30lb, 8-yr-old mixed breed dog, I don't go.

Also, a full-grown Cane Corso is around about 100 pounds - you may have trouble finding a rental with a dog that big in ANY city, even if the type of dog is allowed.

[ksherm]

That brings up a very good point. I hadn't thought about breed bans. It looks like the city of Aurora is the only surrounding area that actually bans Corsi. I know she is going to be well over 100 pounds when she is full grown. What I'm getting at is that when we move she will only be around 60 pounds. She will be a little over six months by the time we relocate. Thank you for that advice though. It is very sad that Pits are banned in a lot of these cities.

[mic111]

I admire you for following your dreams with your majors. Hopefully your girlfriend got her masters because her field may be one where there isn't much opportunity for someone with a bachelors. I really wish I could be more encouraging but have you found that there is a market anywhere for your majors? Forgetting all the other wishes on your wish list you may want to consider moving there (where you may be interning or working for free because with your ages I'm guessing you have no experience). Otherwise you may be serving coffee, working retail or waiting tables for life.

One option, which you may have thought of, is to go back to your schools and work through their programs to identify career opportunities for graduates.

Is there any chance your Cane Corso is a mixed breed with something more acceptable to landlords like Lab or Golden Retriever? If so then list him or her as that type of mix. You may have trouble getting home owners insurance in the future. I don't know about renters insurance. It is especially important that you spend extra time socializing and making sure your dog is not only a good citizen but an excellent citizen. With a Cane Corso an action that a golden or lab could get away with could cost the dog his/her life if someone complains that they are aggressive. In any event your best bet for finding housing is in rural unincorporated areas with little to no animal regulations.

I'm sorry that this advice is more life/general than you were looking for but my life experience tells me that your situation isn't very good and stepping back and re-prioritizing things may work more in your favor than finding a city with fun activities.

[robertgoodman]

The breed ban in Denver is for American Pit Bull Terrier, American Staffordshire Terrier, and Staffordshire Bull Terrier.

Breed Ban Law

Either city is a good choice for what it sounds like you both do in your free time, and what you are looking for as to overall feel. Of course there's slight differences between the two cities which I am sure you have seen in detail on other threads, but in comparison to other US cities they are pretty similar.

As far as the job market is concerned your GF may have a bit better luck in Denver with the BLM having a large presence in Lakewood (Denver Federal Center). We do not have a large entertainment industry in Denver but there's small niches that exist here. A friend of mine used to work for National Cinemedia in Centennial and that sounds like something right up your alley. Getting a job anywhere right now is still tough, and early in the recession it looked like Denver would be better off, but our unemployment has gone back to the national averages. I'd like to say your ideal job will be here if you move here, but I doubt it.

[FreeStone]

Hate to hear you're not into LA after just 8mo. There is so much to do in this city and so much to see within the region. I guess it depends on where you are, but it's typically safe. There are a lot of great recreation options here too. I guess the flip side is, that the cost of living is so high that if you're not making good money it's hard to justify taking time off or spending the $ to get out of town for a few days. I will say that it does suck to go to trailheads and wonder if you're going to come back to your car to find it broken into...

After 5 years, I'm moving from LA, back to Denver next month. I work in the entertainment industry (Post Production) and have a bit of an insight to whats going on there. I will say that there is a small but solid brand marketing industry in Denver. Not so much for entertainment & music, but there are some opportunities and the city's reputation is growing. There are a few regional and national cable networks based in Denver (Starz/Encore being the biggest) as well as Dish Network and Direct TV. So there is a possibility to find in-house entertainment marketing outside of the ad agencies that are in Denver. Don't overlook CP+B up in Boulder too (I guess it's CO's equivalent to Portland's W+K). Outside of entertainment there are more options within the field of marketing. Resorts & sports teams would be an obvious place to start. There are plenty of mid to large size companies based on the Front Range that likely do in-house marketing and may offer a chance to step up from being a barista. I really couldn't tell you how the social media marketing side of the industry is doing in Colorado, but I have a feeling CP+B would be one of the best places to look for that specific skill set. Also look into ADCD(Art Directors Club of Denver), AIGA Colorado, and The Denver Egotist for some insight onto the marketing scene in Denver/Colorado.

The wildlife biology market is tough everywhere right now. My brother, a recent masters program graduate from one of the top wildlife bio schools, is having a tough time finding work. Looks like it's mostly temp technician jobs that last 3 or 4 months. (He's currently in one with the NPS). He hasn't mentioned seeing anything permanent in CO that he qualifies for. He has however applied to a few jobs in Oregon. It seems there are more agencies active in Oregon than Colorado.
About 6 years ago, there was a fear that there would be a shortage of people to fill roles as the older generation retired. Once the economy tanked, that all changed and a lot of people began holding off on retiring.

Colorado offers a lot of what you would want recreationally and in nightlife. If a band is doing a major US tour, it's likely they'll stop off in Denver on their way across the country. There is a good bar scene, and some of the clubs are ok I guess.

Seattle and SLC may also be good towns to check out for the both of you as well. SLC has a McCann World Wide office (McCann SLC), and there are other marketing ventures there as well. Seattle obviously has a lot of places, with technology (Microsoft) being at the top of the list. REI is headquartered there too.

[80skeys]

Originally Posted by ksherm

We crave a mix of big city life and community feel.

The only thing I would say is that you'll find Denver to be more of a "big town" than an urban city. You'll get a little bit of the big city feel in a few places but not real extensive. I've known people who moved there, liked it and enjoyed it for a couple years, and then found themselves craving a more urban experience and moved to larger cities like San Francisco or Chicago.

The thing about Denver is that there aren't any large cities close by, so it's not like living in San Diego and being able to drive up to L.A.

[suzco]

Originally Posted by 80skeys

. . .The thing about Denver is that there aren't any large cities close by, so it's not like living in San Diego and being able to drive up to L.A. . .

In my lifetime, it has turned out that Metro Denver is home.

I did live in San Diego for a few years, and must admit, that I never drove up to LA to fulfill any unmet needs, nor did I ever feel anything lacking that would require a drive to LA. The reasons I didn't stay in San Diego had nothing to do with lacking anything for which I might need to drive to a larger city, nor do I feel any such lack in Denver.

I guess I'm a small town girl, both San Diego and Denver are big enough cities, on their own.