[WouldLoveTo]

Originally Posted by Wilton2ParkAve

Where’s MrGompers when you need him? I thought pensions were all sub-$50k annually. The facts show otherwise. So much for being limited to Wilton teachers.

I could easily live on those increases alone.

[JayCT]

Originally Posted by MrGompers

Mill rates are a poor way to compare tax rates. At the min you would also have to know the increase/decrease of the towns grand list (aka taxable property) my town tells us the change in the grand list each year on the annual budget sheet they send out. I would assume most CT towns do the same.

A town already knows how much money it needs to operate. They only have to tweak the side of the equation to get to their budget number.

it would be x + y = z as long as you know 2 of the values you can solve for the 3rd value.

There are also other issues such as inflation, reimbursements by the state, property tax cap in MA, towns responsibilities vs state responsibilities (such as paving roads), among others.

Comparing mill rates in CT to other towns in CT would make a lot more sense since the baseline parameters among the CT towns are mostly equal.

That is correct. Mill rates are just one part of the equation. I doubt the residents of any of those towns would tolerate that significant of an increase year after year. The most I see is 2% to 3%. One year may be more because the town has decided to do something major like build or renovate a public building or buy land for preservation but even that is bonded over a long period of time so the direct impact on taxes is less. Rather than just comparing mill rates, they would be better to look at a homes tax history or the history of the towns budget. Jay

[DigitalMilford]

Originally Posted by WouldLoveTo

I could easily live on those increases alone.

How much were the increases!?!?!

[WouldLoveTo]

Originally Posted by DigitalMilford

How much were the increases!?!?!

62k to over 100k (above what they started at)

[Scottamemnon]

Originally Posted by MrGompers

Mill rates are a poor way to compare tax rates. At the min you would also have to know the increase/decrease of the towns grand list (aka taxable property) my town tells us the change in the grand list each year on the annual budget sheet they send out. I would assume most CT towns do the same.

A town already knows how much money it needs to operate. They only have to tweak the side of the equation to get to their budget number.

it would be x + y = z as long as you know 2 of the values you can solve for the 3rd value.

There are also other issues such as inflation, reimbursements by the state, property tax cap in MA, towns responsibilities vs state responsibilities (such as paving roads), among others.

Comparing mill rates in CT to other towns in CT would make a lot more sense since the baseline parameters among the CT towns are mostly equal.

But as someone comparing living in central CT vs living in western MA.. I don't give a you know what about the grand list and annual budget of the town. If one town 2 mins away from another town(say East Longmeadow and Suffield.. who have similar school qualities) can do something financially, but the other can not.. why would I move to the one that can not stay fiscally resposible without just passing on the cost year over year without fixing the issue.

The Mill rate is the number that affects me.. and one side of the border is raising out of control and the other is not. For many of us a 3% raise is a pretty good one year over year.. so when the town says it needs 4%, I see a long term problem that will negatively affect residents that are not already wealthy. Not all of us are millionaires.

If we are talking the value of the property going down is the reason why the mill rates go up, which is what you seem to be implying, we just spent multiple pages of you telling us that house values keep going up... so I am confused.

[DigitalMilford]

Originally Posted by WouldLoveTo

62k to over 100k (above what they started at)

Every pension was increased for 38K to over 100K? Over how many years?

This doesn't sound right...

[JayCT]

Originally Posted by Scottamemnon

But as someone comparing living in central CT vs living in western MA.. I don't give a you know what about the grand list and annual budget of the town. If one town 2 mins away from another town(say East Longmeadow and Suffield.. who have similar school qualities) can do something financially, but the other can not.. why would I move to the one that can not stay fiscally resposible without just passing on the cost year over year without fixing the issue.

The Mill rate is the number that affects me.. and one side of the border is raising out of control and the other is not. For many of us a 3% raise is a pretty good one year over year.. so when the town says it needs 4%, I see a long term problem that will negatively affect residents that are not already wealthy. Not all of us are millionaires.

If we are talking the value of the property going down is the reason why the mill rates go up, which is what you seem to be implying, we just spent multiple pages of you telling us that house values keep going up... so I am confused.

You do not seem to understand how property taxes are calculated here in Connecticut. There are two parts to a property tax calculation; the mill rate and the assessed value of the property. The assessed value is determined every 5 years by an independent assessment company hired by the town. Once the value of a home has been determined, the town will take 70% of that value to determine the taxes on it. The town also will adjust the mill rate up or down in order that they get sufficient taxes each year to cover the towns expenses. That adjustment may be why you saw a 6% rise in the mill rate. When coupled with a lower assessed value, the taxes on a home mostly likely stay the same or rise or are lowered modestly.

For the last 10 years inflation rates have ranged from 0.09% to 2.96% so just to keep up with it, a town must adjust its budget. Staff will get raises and towns implement major projects or purchases which add to the budget needs. I know of no town that is increasing their taxes 3% each and every year. Some years have no increase at all. Again, that is why you need to look at the budgets and assessments in addition to the mill rate otherwise I question your motives for even bothering. Jay

[MrGompers]

Originally Posted by Scottamemnon

But as someone comparing living in central CT vs living in western MA.. I don't give a you know what about the grand list and annual budget of the town. If one town 2 mins away from another town(say East Longmeadow and Suffield.. who have similar school qualities) can do something financially, but the other can not.. why would I move to the one that can not stay fiscally resposible without just passing on the cost year over year without fixing the issue.

The Mill rate is the number that affects me.. and one side of the border is raising out of control and the other is not. For many of us a 3% raise is a pretty good one year over year.. so when the town says it needs 4%, I see a long term problem that will negatively affect residents that are not already wealthy. Not all of us are millionaires.

If we are talking the value of the property going down is the reason why the mill rates go up, which is what you seem to be implying, we just spent multiple pages of you telling us that house values keep going up... so I am confused.

Assessed market value (taxable value) of a property is not equal to market value. Could be different in MA I don't know since I;m not familiar with property tax rules in the other 49 states.

As I said before if you want to compare two or more data sets you need to start with the same assumptions. I don't know that towns in MA are responsible for the same things towns in CT are responsible for.

A quick hypothetical is if MA reimburses towns for 50% of school building costs, but CT only reimburses 25% CT would be at a disadvantage. If would be more realistic to compare mill rates in CT town by town, since the assumptions in each CT town are probably the same.

You seem to have fallen into the "family budget" vs "Govt budget" conundrum in which people think a Govt can solve every budget issue by just sitting at the dinner table and deciding what to cut.

Budgeting doesn't work that way in Govt. for the main reason that Govt can impose, enforce, and collect taxes. A family doesn't have that power. It's even worse at the Federal level because the Feds can do all of that plus print money.

[WouldLoveTo]

Originally Posted by DigitalMilford

Every pension was increased for 38K to over 100K? Over how many years?

This doesn't sound right...

Maybe you should read the article. They listed a select group of people, their starting pensions and their increases over a certain time frame. Not all are the same.

The ones listed had increases of 62K to over 100K. Since 62K is more than I've made annually since 2004, my original comment stands.

[DigitalMilford]

Originally Posted by WouldLoveTo

Maybe you should read the article. They listed a select group of people, their starting pensions and their increases over a certain time frame. Not all are the same.

The ones listed had increases of 62K to over 100K. Since 62K is more than I've made annually since 2004, my original comment stands.

I did. That was the top 10. All MD and PhD level positions.

Don't you think it's fairer to look at averages? What kind of increase did the retired prison guard or DMV clerk receive?

You're making comparisons against people who ran hospitals and universities.