Are cities in southwestern Ohio moving-violation crazy? (Cincinnati, Hamilton: house, to buy)

[kjbrill]

Originally Posted by ram2

Uh, when you cannot buy gas you cannot drive. When you do not drive, you do not have auto accidents. Remember those long gas lines during the "Arab oil embargo"?

Frankly NO, cannot remember when I could not buy gas. May have been a little inconvenient, but I cannot remember sitting in any long lines. And that Arab Oil Embargo lastest all of what - two months.

[t45209]

Originally Posted by kjbrill

No, the current 70 mph limit is dangerous due to the fact the condition of the roadway is nowhere close to when they were first built. I drove on the brand new interstates, and believe me they were a dream to drive on. The current roadways scare me at 65 mph let alone 70.

Are you sure that it's the speed limit of 70 and not your age of 70 that's the issue here? I mean seriously, my dad freely admits that he doesn't feel as comfortable behind the wheel as he did when he was 30, which he describes as his "driving prime."

Back in the '50s and '60s, those fine Interstates weren't the only roads with 70 mph posted speed limits. There were plenty of 2-lane rural highways with the same speed limit. My dad talks about flying at 80 mph in a '49 Ford up US 42 and US 68 going to Indian Lake. Those roads certainly weren't engineered for that, but people did it.

I'll grant you, our infrastructure is in terrible shape, and there is clearly planned obsolescence built into our roads. However, I find it pretty easy to drive 70 or 75 mph on them. I wouldn't want to try to drive 150 mph, but then again, they weren't designed for that.

I have driven the Autobahn in Germany and so while I might not be old enough to remember Eisenhower's roads, I know what good roads are like. The Germans probably spend a lot less on wheel alignments and broken struts than we do, but other than that, our roads are completely serviceable for 70 mph speeds.

[joe from dayton]

Originally Posted by ruteger

Besides the Elmwood Place speed camera fiasco, I've been reading that both Hamilton and Middletown to the north are just as bad, except they're a bit more clever than the greedy folks in Elmwood Place. In particular, there's the final stretch of OH-129 going west into Hamilton past the route 4 by-pass exit where it stops being a divided, four-lane highway with a speed limit of 65mph. It's a steep downgrade, where OH-129 quickly turns into a four-lane residential street (High Street) and the speed limit rapidly drops from 65mph all the way down to 35mph (or even 20mph during school hours due to a school situated on a side-street nowhere near High Street!).

But the thing that makes this really bad is the city of Hamilton uses an unmarked, white Ford Escape equipped with a mobile speed camera and have parked this unmarked Escape along High Street for as much as three times a week (including Saturdays). News reports state that since its inception up through 2012, the Hamilton mobile speed camera on OH-129 has accounted for more speeding citations than the rest of those issued within Hamilton, combined.

To me, this is an even worse situation than Elmwood Place. Sure, Elmwood Place ran their speed enforcement cameras 24/7 with no warning that they were going up. But at least after the initial period of 'shock and awe', you knew they were there and could avoid them. But in Hamilton, that white Ford Escape can be placed anywhere, anytime, including an area where the speed limit seems to drop quickly.

I think I'll just keep on moving when traveling anywhere on I-75 through the automated speed-camera/red-light happy municipalities of Cincinnati, Hamilton, and Middletown in southwestern Ohio. Well, until they start putting speed cameras on I-75, anyway...

The state has laws on how fast speed limits may change and how speed limit signs must be posted. People like to use these "speed trap" excuses because it is easier to blame the police than to admit that they ignored the "reduce speed ahead" signs and the speed limit signs. I used to drive that stretch from Dayton to Hamilton on regular basis and never had an problem going the speed limit. I have zero sympathy for "speed trap" cry babies.

[rrtechno]

Originally Posted by ram2

I guess those "Speed Limit 75" signs I used to see along the Turnpike were imaginary. Why don't you ask the Ohio Turnpike Commission for clarification?

Maybe you can help me find a source that verifies that, besides your memory. I have not been able to find anything indicating that the legal speed limit on the Ohio Turnpike has ever been anything higher than 70 mph.

[jmecklenborg]

>"ka chock, ka chock" for hours over the concrete slab seams.

I remember in the 80s going on roads where asphalt had been laid over one lane but not the other. Also, there was much more litter on the side of the interstates. Seemingly everybody used to throw the cups and wrappers from fast food drive-thru's out the window.

Also, way more haze in the air from air pollution. Driving into Cincinnati, in the summer there was a haze as soon as you came down from any of the hills. We don't even hear about the smog in Los Angeles anymore.

[ruteger]

Originally Posted by joe from dayton

I used to drive that stretch from Dayton to Hamilton on regular basis and never had an problem going the speed limit.

Doesn't sound like you've driven it in quite a while, either.

[kjbrill]

Originally Posted by t45209

Are you sure that it's the speed limit of 70 and not your age of 70 that's the issue here? I mean seriously, my dad freely admits that he doesn't feel as comfortable behind the wheel as he did when he was 30, which he describes as his "driving prime."

Back in the '50s and '60s, those fine Interstates weren't the only roads with 70 mph posted speed limits. There were plenty of 2-lane rural highways with the same speed limit. My dad talks about flying at 80 mph in a '49 Ford up US 42 and US 68 going to Indian Lake. Those roads certainly weren't engineered for that, but people did it.

I'll grant you, our infrastructure is in terrible shape, and there is clearly planned obsolescence built into our roads. However, I find it pretty easy to drive 70 or 75 mph on them. I wouldn't want to try to drive 150 mph, but then again, they weren't designed for that.

I have driven the Autobahn in Germany and so while I might not be old enough to remember Eisenhower's roads, I know what good roads are like. The Germans probably spend a lot less on wheel alignments and broken struts than we do, but other than that, our roads are completely serviceable for 70 mph speeds.

I will only admit to not feeling compelled to go fast. On a brand new resurfaced road I have no problem going 70. Problem is they don't stay that way very long. Before you know it the lane seams from where they lay the asphalt are separating and chunks coming out. It is like they laid the asphalt cold and it wouldn't bond. The quality control appears to be totally lacking.

I-65 between Louisville and Elizabethtown Ky is one of my least liked sections of road. It is such a washboard it is like driving on railroad ties. I have a big heavy car and even it feels bouncy on that road. Thankfully our daughter moved to Lexington so we don't have to make that trip anymore.

I-275 is a perfect example of what not to do. The various widening projects done with all asphalt are constantly falling apart. In the matter of a few months the heavy trucks compact the asphalt and you can see plus feel the depressions in the roadway. Then in the winter the water seeping down into the depressions causes the freeze/thaw cycle and the road literally begins coming apart.

I understand the pressure to keep the traffic moving. But this should be balanced against the quality and longevity of the roadwork being done. Today's roadwork has no longevity, it is constant rework. So the public is paying over and over for the same thing. When a highway needs widening, one direction should be shut down completely. If that requires a detour so be it. It may pique a lot of people off, but so be it. Excavate the widened lanes, put down and compact a decent roadbed, and pour reinforced concrete for the expansion. The compression carrying load of reinforced concrete versus asphalt is so much superior it is not even close. This is one case where the Asphalt Institute will overwhelm you with misinformation. Of course we all know what the Asphalt Institute really is - an oil industry lobby.

As you dig down you will likely find large sections of the original concrete still doing its job. It is the layers of crumbling asphalt which have been put on top of it which are the problem. Scrape the asphalt away. As you pour the new lanes, pour another 8" of steel reinforced concrete on top of the original. In other words, build a road this technologically advanced country can be proud of. Sure it takes more time and inconveniences a lot of people. So what? It may still be functional with minimal maintenance another 40-50 years from now. That is what measures real progress.

[kjbrill]

Just thought I would throw in a little personal observation here. I spent my working career at a machinery manufacturer supplying a lot of heavy industries, including automotive. So I had a broad exposure to manufacturing processes of all kinds, aerospace, aircraft, automotive, down to oil derricks and wells in the Gulf.

My formal training was as a Mechanical Engineer. The biggest thing I remember from that was something called the Factor of Safety. What this boiled down to was after all of our sophisticated analysis and proclaimed expertise there was always a doubt as to just how right we were. So the Hedge Amount, or the Factor of Safety was introduced. This amounts to take your stength calculations and multiply them. If you are using a minimal FS of 120%, multiply the base calculations by 1.2. If you are in a extremely hazardous environment such as a bridge or skyscraper, you may increase that to as high as 3.5 indicating a degree of uncertainty and also vulnerability. If you are wrong, Ho*y Sh*t it may really hit the fan.

I do like and respect the cars I owned. This is reflected by the fact I only traded one in from 1962 to the present. I grow an attachment to them. The one car I had a big attachment to was a 1966 Dodge Monaco Hardtop Convertible with a 385 Hemi Engine. I had taken our 1962 Dodge Dart slant six in for service, my first new car and also newly married. The Dart was not yet ready so I go an sit in the front showroom. That was when I noticed the Monaco being driven out front. Anytime you sit in a dealer's showroom you are going to be inundated.

Now remember, this is 1966 and I am there to pick up my Dart from service. To make the story shorter, about 4 hours later I drive the Monaco home, trying to figure out how to tell the wife I just bought our second car for $3,200. It had chrome inside, outside, everywhere.

It is the only car I will admit to severely exceeding the speed limit. I drove it to Pittsburgh across I-70. I was definitely over 80 mph, Hell I may have been over 100 as it was capable of that.

But the US automotive manufacturers back then could not make a body with any longevity. The body on that Monaco turned into a piece of rust from day one. The rear fender panels turned into swiss cheese as did the quarter panels under the doors. I loved the engine and drive train, best running car I ever owned. But when it looks like a rust bucket your enthusiasm diminishes.

But back to the Factor of Safety. When you are barreling down the road have you any recognition of this?

[Ohiogirl81]

Could be worse. Could be Linndale.

Linndale, Ohio - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I thought Ohio cops couldn't use unmarked cars in speed traps ...

[ram2]

[quote=kjbrill;30656137
It is the only car I will admit to severely exceeding the speed limit. I drove it to Pittsburgh across I-70. I was definitely over 80 mph, Hell I may have been over 100 as it was capable of that.

[/quote]

I drove 80-100 today going to work.