Why is Chicago's Unemployment Rate Performing Poorly? (Atlanta, Detroit: condo, house)

[Flamedown]

Originally Posted by yoyoniner

There are skills gaps everywhere, not just Chicago.

One thing I've noticed is the downright fear and general malaise that is different in Chicago than it was, let's say, 5-10 years ago. Former Chicago boosters like myself (look at my old post history) are now looking to leave. My wife who has been here her whole life is trying to get us to move to Wisconsin so at least we have some sense of stability. People at work (I am a doctor at Rush) now talk about leaving Illinois and how horrible our government has become here, where 5 years ago this was never discussed. Even die hard Democrats here are unhappy. No one is enthusiastic about Illinois anymore and I really think that is what is missing. There is such a general malaise here that didn't seem to exist even a few years ago, that I imagine at least some of these numbers have to do with businesses hiring and expanding elsewhere. If you had a business and hundreds of jobs on the line would YOU choose to expand your business here in this fiscal environment? This has to have something to do with it, if business owners are feeling like some of us are feeling.

I am talking specifically about the constant ring of terrible news about our government's financial situation. I feel things really changed for me and my colleagues when Illinois raised income taxes so much and still chose not to reform any spending or pensions. When you raise income taxes 67% (on everyone!) and things just get worse financially there is a big problem.

800 teachers in March and over 1000 in June just in the CPS alone were laid off, yet the remaining teachers got a $93 million salary raise last year after going on strike, despite a looming budget shortfall of over $600 million. The state legislature is now prompt in their action to sue the governor to get their paychecks, but can't reform the worst in the country pension debt and improve the worst in the country bond rating given six months of supermajority control. Both of these are just some glaring examples of how screwed up things have gotten here, and I think a lot of people (and business owners) now have a sense of fear that just wasn't there before. It doesn't make it easier when you look an hour north of here and see Wisconsin's finances and unemployment rate for comparison.

This is one other reason why I am hesitant to move to Chicago besides the employment situation. It is believed Chicago itself has nearly 36 billion in pension debt. I do not see how there is anyway in avoiding the hurt that it is eventually going to cause. Perhaps businesses avoiding Chicago and Illinois is why the unemployment rate is doing worse than most other large similar metros despite the economic recovery happening nationwide.

[Chicago76]

Originally Posted by Vlajos

Every CPS employee I know, sends there kids to a CPS school.

I also know a family that was sending their kids to one of the best private schools in the City, realized it wasn't worth it and are now sending them all to CPS next year. It isn't due to financial hardship either. They are doing very well.

I think suburban boosters really overestimate the quality of education one gets from district to district. When adjusting for income there is usually little difference in schools. I understand this is very threatening to suburbanites.

I have teacher friends who have taught on four continents including North America (in the US), they currently teach in a fancy american school in Europe. They will be first to tell you that the single most important factor in a child's education is the parents.

This. Just to put some numbers behind it, here are the non-low income #s for students on the ISAT.

Composite reading/math/science, % exceeding standards, meets standards, below standard, warning.

CPS: 46%, 46%, 7%, 1%
Naperville: 51%, 44%, 4%, 0%

PSAE, achievement gap is wider:
CPS: 16%, 46%, 32%, 6%
Naperville: 28%, 51%, 19%, 3%

Just looking at non-low income kids in aggregate eliminates most of the gap, but it's still a pretty heterogeneous group. I suspect if we were able to look at things in a more granular manner, (e.g., kids in two parent households, both parents native speakers and with college degrees, making between X and Y per year as a household) the gap would be statistically insignificant.

[Vlajos]

Originally Posted by Chicago76

This. Just to put some numbers behind it, here are the non-low income #s for students on the ISAT.

Composite reading/math/science, % exceeding standards, meets standards, below standard, warning.

CPS: 46%, 46%, 7%, 1%
Naperville: 51%, 44%, 4%, 0%

PSAE, achievement gap is wider:
CPS: 16%, 46%, 32%, 6%
Naperville: 28%, 51%, 19%, 3%

Just looking at non-low income kids in aggregate eliminates most of the gap, but it's still a pretty heterogeneous group. I suspect if we were able to look at things in a more granular manner, (e.g., kids in two parent households, both parents native speakers and with college degrees, making between X and Y per year as a household) the gap would be statistically insignificant.

Thanks, I was too lazy to look up the numbers. And you are absolutely correct if you could adjust this for ELL in addition. My kids go to school with a significant number of eastern Europeans who are not low income but speak their native languages at home.

[emathias]

Originally Posted by Chicago76

...
I suspect if we were able to look at things in a more granular manner, (e.g., kids in two parent households, both parents native speakers and with college degrees, making between X and Y per year as a household) the gap would be statistically insignificant.

I think it's not only the academic quality of the school that concerns parents.

It's also a culture issue - parents who value education want their kids to be in a school where the other parents also value education.

It's also a risk issue - parents want their kids to go to a school that doesn't have gang infiltration.

And it's also a peer issues - parents know that "steel sharpens steel," so they want their kids to socialize and compete with kids they perceive to be at or above their own kids' level.

[Vlajos]

Originally Posted by emathias

I think it's not only the academic quality of the school that concerns parents.

It's also a culture issue - parents who value education want their kids to be in a school where the other parents also value education.

It's also a risk issue - parents want their kids to go to a school that doesn't have gang infiltration.

And it's also a peer issues - parents know that "steel sharpens steel," so they want their kids to socialize and compete with kids they perceive to be at or above their own kids' level.

I totally agree on safety and gangs. No one in their right mind would want to send their child to a school in an environment like that. I also agree with being in an environment where education is valued is important.

I'm not sure that your third point makes any difference.

[emathias]

Originally Posted by Vlajos

I totally agree on safety and gangs. No one in their right mind would want to send their child to a school in an environment like that. I also agree with being in an environment where education is valued is important.

I'm not sure that your third point makes any difference.

I think the third point is important, but those who are about it may 100% overlap with those who care about the first two.

[Vlajos]

Originally Posted by emathias

I think the third point is important, but those who are about it may 100% overlap with those who care about the first two.

I care about the first two, not about the third or at least it never occured to me or my wife to care about it.

[Vlajos]

Originally Posted by Chicago76

This. Just to put some numbers behind it, here are the non-low income #s for students on the ISAT.

Composite reading/math/science, % exceeding standards, meets standards, below standard, warning.

CPS: 46%, 46%, 7%, 1%
Naperville: 51%, 44%, 4%, 0%

PSAE, achievement gap is wider:
CPS: 16%, 46%, 32%, 6%
Naperville: 28%, 51%, 19%, 3%

Just looking at non-low income kids in aggregate eliminates most of the gap, but it's still a pretty heterogeneous group. I suspect if we were able to look at things in a more granular manner, (e.g., kids in two parent households, both parents native speakers and with college degrees, making between X and Y per year as a household) the gap would be statistically insignificant.

I find this fascinating.

[lawrencecondo5724]

I actually moved out of Chicago and my skills were absolutely some of the best in the Financial arena that money could buy. I moved to Texas and had no problems acquiring that dream job that i had spent 1.5 years attempting to find in IL while watching my IDES benefits nearly disappear. My family and i were forced to leave since our cash inflows were simply not enough to combat the VERY HIGH COST of living in Chicago that in most cases is NOT JUSTIFIED. I was not even that picky and i had ended up contracting just 6 out of those 17 months i was unemployed simply because there were SO MANY people willing to take ridiculously low wages to do the exact same thing while these contract jobs would only last no more than 2 months )NO HEALTH BENEFITS MIND YOU). The problem is quite simple: The population is too high, tax structures are too business unfriendly, and there just are not enough well paying jobs to keep up with the increasing population. If you dare move to IL make sure you have a job lined up and do your research on that company which may end up leaving the state like my last two companies did. The past two years have been some of the best i have ever had financially and apparently my move worked out because unemployment has shot up to all time highs in IL making it one of the worst places to work in the country.

[Jesse69]

Yeah, Chicago has a lot of mfg companies that I apply to jobs to yet I've been unemployed 5 years now. I even tried for entry level Mech Eng jobs at $45,000 / year yet I didn't get called for an interview.