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Sincere apologies as I never meant my commentary to imply that Chicago has the market cornered on values, ethics and character, however, I am Chicago born and raised and I so love the city of Chicago so very much that I may come off as exceedingly biased about this city
You're absolutely right that those Midwestern values and ethics which are found in Chicago are found all over this country and in every region...NYC, Manhattan, Queens, Brooklyn, Bronx, Staten Island, California, just to name a few. Truth be told, I have even experienced Midwestern values and ethics in Canada, the countries of Europe and South America as well, so yes, indeed they do exist all over the world. It just goes to show you that they are not necessarily Midwestern values and ethics but rather point to a man's/woman's character wherever he/she may be from.
Best regards, sincerely
HomeIsWhere...
No, don't apologize. I was just trying to make a point that those differences people use to make a case against Chicago are probably a little exaggerated. I know there are regional differences because I grew up in a different region of the country. I'm not naive but some of the assumptions made on this site are ridiculous. An example of one is that all midwestern young women want to marry earlier than coastal women. I believe that statement is a myth without hard evidence.
No, don't apologize. I was just trying to make a point that those differences people use to make a case against Chicago are probably a little exaggerated. I know there are regional differences because I grew up in a different region of the country. I'm not naive but some of the assumptions made on this site are ridiculous. An example of one is that all midwestern young women want to marry earlier than coastal women. I believe that statement is a myth without hard evidence.
It is my personal observation. I have kept mental notes, although I haven't actually done an actual quantifiable study, but it IS based on observations. As a 32 year old guy, I simply meet a lot more unattached, yet eligible women in LA than in Chicago. Thats just my simple observation.
It is my personal observation. I have kept mental notes, although I haven't actually done an actual quantifiable study, but it IS based on observations. As a 32 year old guy, I simply meet a lot more unattached, yet eligible women in LA than in Chicago. Thats just my simple observation.
Well there's a chance you could be wrong. The census bureau does show that the average age of marriage was actually younger in California (men and women) than in Illinois from 2000-2003. I do realize that L.A. and S.F. are probably different but, I was still surprised by the state #'s.
I also think Chicago is big enough to find whatever you are looking for. The "big car, big home" image wasn't obvious when I visited downtown. However, cities like Chicago, San Francisco, and New York are known for their large, dense urban cores but have enough incorporated land that usually on the outskirts you can find the suburban sprawl with big lawns, and SUVs. I still remember riding into Chicago by train. I didn't know how close the train was to the city, but there came a time when I looked out the window and the shotgun-style urban homes just never seemed to stop coming.
But I've heard Chicago called "The Great American City" before. I always like asking international tourist about their travels in America. Some think downtown Manhattan is American as you can get, while others think an open field with a red barn and windmills is so Americana. If Chicago represent the old-school American city to you, go with it; you'll find it. For me, I'm fascinated by the style of the 1920s-1930s, so every time I visit I tend to hone in on the relics of that era: art deco, jazz, the theaters and so on. Kind of fun to relive the era in a sense.
Chicago is big enough to find whatever you're looking for except a good job.
For fos whose politics / social issues estranged them from "blood relatives" it is relatively easy to "forge friendships tonreplacemfamily"...
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Wait what? Forge friendship as your "chosen family"? This certainly has never happened in my lifetime. Most friends are like that. They will stick with you as long as you are OK. They may be at times little rude but its not end of the world. You hang out with them. As soon as something hits you hard, they act like they do not know you. And a lot of folks in Chicago are conservative folks from suburbs or outlying rural areas. If you give them any hint of liberal ideas they get mad. Some don't admit what they don't like, they just pull away without a say. You can be with them let say 6 months and they will act like you have never met.
Well there's a chance you could be wrong. The census bureau does show that the average age of marriage was actually younger in California (men and women) than in Illinois from 2000-2003. I do realize that L.A. and S.F. are probably different but, I was still surprised by the state #'s.
California is 50% hispanic. Thats why.
If you include the native born American population, you would probably see it flipped. But hey what do I know. I was just making an observation in my demographic.
Chicago was once an economic powerhouse, which huge numbers of in the TRADTIONAL manufacturing sectors, solid employment prospects for those in the skilled trades,mince balance of white collar employment.
Over the decades there has been a dramatic shift. Work that is not centered around the core financial services, law, and other professional employment is rare.
Further the shifts in age of the work force, compensation and general attitudes has sharply caused a strong tilt toward what is commonly called the "the Progressive" mindset. Even among the very well off that would generally be assumed to "conservation"'in the attitudes there is little desire to have "a big car" -- prefernce is probably first for "a short commute" and then "a luxury vehicle that is poltically acceptable".
Similarly a "big house" is seen as something likely tonne desirable only to first generation immigrants --- to be sure there is no lack of EXPENSIVE homes laden within a range of luxury features, served by high performing schools,misplaced from crime, but size is not the primary feature desired...
Even "family" is a shifting concept -- the majority of younger people living in around Chicago have almost certsinly lived somewhere else and /or had family move away for work related issues. Travel to someplace else is pretty common to "get tougher for the holidays". More or more fols in Chicago never marry, many do marry never have kids. For fos whose politics / social issues estranged them from "blood relatives" it is relatively easy to "forge friendships tonreplacemfamily"...
Freedom is also arguably not particularly a strong force in Chicago or the region as measured by the degree to which their is little support libertarian ideals including things like concealed weapons, gay marriage, legalized marijuana.
Movies often portray a very different imagine of Chicago that reality.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChiGuy2.5
I don't agree. Chicago is not in the top 10 of most populated cities in the world, but it certainly is within the top 10 of GDP producing cities in the world. Mckinsey rated Chicago as the 5th highest GDP producing city in the world. Atlanticinsider listed Chicago as the 4th most economically powerful city in the world behind only New York, London and Tokyo. Down home midwestern values? What are those? I grew up in the suburbs and live in Chicago now. I have never once heard of anyone mentioning midwestern values. Maybe please and thank you, or holding doors open count? Don't forget that blues brothers is predominantly filmed in the suburbs, same with waynes world. The only scene I am aware of that is filmed downtown for blues brothers was the scene with Marina Towers and that one bar they got in a fight at.
Its a great city, but I just got the impression you felt like it had a "small town" feel which is not the case in my opinion.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ToriaT
There are many versions of Chicago. It all depends on where you are observing. There are still extended families living in the area that get together. Yes there are the families that live in other places to get together. There are the recent immigrants. 3rd and 4th generation decendants of those who came here from Europe like myself. Transplants from other cities and the suburbs. Those who still want a mc mansion in the burbs. Those that want a short commute and smaller vintage abode in the city. Poor people. Rich people. Whatever version of Chicago you want, you can find it if you look.
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Originally Posted by emathias
I think it's more influential in the world than you may realize. You know how everything you buy these days has "Made in China" stamped on it?
50 years ago, everything had "Made in Chicago" stamped on it. Even today, Chicago has more manufacturing space than any other city in the U.S. - including Detroit.
In 1900, Chicago was the 5th-most-populous city in the world. In 1950, it was still the 8th-most-populous. Not bad for a city that didn't even exist in 1800. It's method of growth and structure has been a model for many other cities. It didn't necessarily invent all aspects of that, but it implemented them to great effect for the first time.
And if you think Chicago is all down home Midwestern values, you don't know much about the drug trade in the U.S. (Chicago is one of the biggest heroin marketplaces in the world and Cook County Jail has the highest rate of opiates in the system of arriving prisoners or any big-city jail in America), you haven't read much Nelson Algren (read Never Come Morning, and Chicago, City on the Make and you'll be dispossessed of seeing Chicago as built on all comfortable Midwestern families).
I'm not sure what you really mean by "comfortable familiarity." The grid system in Chicago makes it easy to learn quickly and get around with a minimum of directions or experience. The fact that it's downtown-centric may also make it more comfortable in some senses, because it gives it sense of order than cities without one strong core may lack. It's quite a bit more orderly in structure than any Latin American city or Asian city I can think of, and even more than many European or other American cities. But the order in structure doesn't mean everything is predictable or familiar.
Basically, I think that attempts to pigeon-hole Chicago miss a lot of the city. Yes, you can have a "Home, Alone" sort of life in the Chicago suburbs, or a "While You Were Sleeping" sort of experience even in the city itself. But you could also live the lives you see in "The Wire." You could meet people who live lives similar to the characters in "The Namesake" or "A Better Life." It's a city of retired factory workers, drug mules, writers, artists, traders, investment bankers, lawyers, plumbers, teachers, professors, students, professional waiters, steelworkers, assembly-line workers, tech startups, serial killers, prostitutes, addicts, priests, hindus, orthodox churches, synagogues, mosques, catholic cathedrals, buddhist temples, insurance agents, merchandisers, current ethnic neighborhoods with Chinese, Vietnamese, Korean, Indian, Russian Jews, Mexicans, Polish, Puerto Ricans, Ukrainian and remnants of previous immigrant neighborhoods that served Swedish, German, Norwegian, Italian, Czech, Japanese, Appalachians, people from the American Deep South, Persian, and more dispersed populations of many other ethnicities.
Chicago is, in other words, a real city, not some Disneyland of a city that serves as some sort of urban theme park for Middle America, but a real city with real problems (and, sometimes, real solutions) that attracts real people from around the world. You're right that it's not first in people's minds like New York or Paris or Tokyo. But then again, we're less than half as old as New York, and less than 1/10th as old as Paris or London or Tokyo.
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Originally Posted by ChiNaan
John Hughes was from the world of affluent suburban white people, so he portrayed that in his films, and did it well. That's hardly representative of Chicagoland as a whole, though.
It's possible that "middle America" can relate to the Chicago area more easily than to NYC or L.A., but there's not exactly a shortage of successful films set in those cities.
It is my personal observation. I have kept mental notes, although I haven't actually done an actual quantifiable study, but it IS based on observations. As a 32 year old guy, I simply meet a lot more unattached, yet eligible women in LA than in Chicago. Thats just my simple observation.
I don't doubt it. Surprisingly, it's much easier to meet women in LA than Chicago.
there is no ideal population for any city or any metropolitan area. but if there were, I have a feeling they would be somewhere more towards the means than the extremes.
where one puts those parameters is a matter of choice and perception. for me, I'd take a city of about 3 million people in a metropolitan area of, say, 10 million. Why? those numbers give the critical mass that generate the best a city/metro can match, the numbers to make it all work and give the endless choice. those numbers can give you a city and a metro area that can offer so much of what one finds in cities/areas the size of NY and LA......but in a much more manageable setting.
conversely, those 3 million/10 million can give one of the charm of setting of more inmate places like Boston or San Francisco but with for more possibilities because of its size.
So you take the critical mass of NY and LA while allowing you the more manageable size of SF and Bos, taking the best of the bigger and the smaller.
Now I must admit that i have one and only one city and metro in mind with my 3 million/10 million. and that city goes along with that whole "not too big, not to small, but just right" that was Baby Bear's contribution to the goldilocks story. Of course, if the whole idea of "the three bears" gives you a clue of which city/metro I'm talking about....that's fine with me, too.
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