Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Although I love my hometown, and would love nothing more than to see a greater appreciation of good food develop in the city I have to say the following about starting any food service business there: Terrible idea unless you're a chain or have a prime location with parking as people won't make the effort to go. Doesn't matter if you have the best food in town, offer it for an affordable price with many other shops and attractions within walking distance. People in Charleston want big portions, dirt cheap menu prices, a chain brand name attacked to it, and close parking so that they don't have to walk more than 10 yards to get to the door.
If you're a seasoned veteran of running food service operations its going to very difficult, and you'll have to be on hand for most of the hours of operation. No absentee owners, no hiring too much staff to do the work for you. The labor costs will suck you dry. I honestly wish the local climate was more conducive to supporting local restaurants as opposed to Darden Chains. Things appear to be changing very slowly, but isn't to a point where I would feel it viable to make a go of it in Charleston myself.
If you're dead set on opening your own place with your own style and flavor to it I wish you nothing but luck, but caution against anything that the locals would find to be "too weird". Unfortunately that includes just about any kind of authentic take on foreign cuisine. Even something as simple as a french bistro would struggle to find a stable flow of customers. Charleston could use a brew pub, or possibly some place that was dedicated to making good burgers (quality meat that you season yourself, well thought out toppings, and for the love of god a good hearty bun to put it on) for around $10 an entree. I feel that those two concepts are in demand and would have a better chance of remaining viable for a longer period of time.
I don't know where you get your information, but you should probably check your recourses again. A lot of new resturants, cafes, and "foreign cuisine. The village district has brought different styles of dinning experiences over the past 5 years and still does.
I do agree that opening a business in Charleston will drain a lot of your revenue, time, and energy!
We are opening the doors today. Come check us out. We had two mock runs this week. This place is awesome.
link removed by moderator - no advertising please.
looks really good!!! I hope you do well, and I might drive out there someday!
Last edited by atlantagreg30127; 02-19-2011 at 09:53 PM..
I don't know where you get your information, but you should probably check your recourses again. A lot of new resturants, cafes, and "foreign cuisine. The village district has brought different styles of dinning experiences over the past 5 years and still does.
I do agree that opening a business in Charleston will drain a lot of your revenue, time, and energy!
I don't live in Charleston, but I was in town visiting family as recently as a month ago. The progress of many of the restaurants in town is of great interest to me, and I've been following their successes and failures closely from afar for a little while now. You may very well be right about the viability of locally owned restaurants in Charleston, but from the evidence I've observed I don't believe that to be the case.
You're right, a lot of new restaurants have opened their doors recently in Charleston. How many are still there that have openend in Charleston within the last 5 years. How many are struggling, how many are turning a profit?
I wish you the best in your endeavors, but you need to understand what you're going up against. Its unfortunate, but you would be much more likely to be successful in other locations. I'm not trying to dissuade you from opening up a business in Charleston, it is my hometown afterall, but it is what it is. I would like nothing more than to see Charleston develop into a cosmopolitan center of Appalachian cuisine, but I don't believe the people in the area are willing to support that kind of restaurant scene. I'm not talking fine dining or upscale in the least. Just decent places that charge 15-20 for an entree or that use good ingredients and a great deal of prep in their menus.
What kind of background do you have in food and/or running a business out of curiousity?
I wish you the best in your endeavors, but you need to understand what you're going up against. Its unfortunate, but you would be much more likely to be successful in other locations. I'm not trying to dissuade you from opening up a business in Charleston, it is my hometown afterall, but it is what it is. I would like nothing more than to see Charleston develop into a cosmopolitan center of Appalachian cuisine, but I don't believe the people in the area are willing to support that kind of restaurant scene. I'm not talking fine dining or upscale in the least. Just decent places that charge 15-20 for an entree or that use good ingredients and a great deal of prep in their menus.
I will comment on the above as I'm a native Charlestonian who now lives in Atlanta, and as others on here will probably agree with if they've lived elsewhere, you sometimes do gain a different perspective of things when you leave Charleston for a while and then come back. It makes comparisons easier and allows you to see what is good (and bad) about the "home town" business scene. I also for a period of around 10 years worked in the restaurant business a few years ago, from simply waiting tables, to training wait staff for General Mills Restaurants, to managing two places as well. Got out of the business, but here are my observations of common mistakes I see people make:
My list of observations (long - sit down, this'll take a while):
1) You are only as good as your weakest link: If the chef is bad, you'll suffer even if everything else about the place is excellent. If your manager isn't fully experienced (or you, if you run it yourself), then it wouldn't matter if you have the best chef in the world. If the chef and management is good, but the wait staff and/or prices aren't just right - bingo - it's not going to work. It's incredibly hard to get all the pieces in the puzzle together to make the picture complete. You must have good management, good staff, good food quality, and good pricing - all of it, or eventually, the place will fail.
2) Location is key: Ample parking, easy access, safe neighborhood. If you try to save 20% on your rent by opening in a place where there are hookers walking around outside or people might get carjacked going back to their cars, it won't matter if you have the best food in town. No more need be said.
3) Comfort: Having a sit-down restaurant with $16+ entrees is all fine, but if you have uncomfortable seats that are fast food style/quality, it's not going to work. Far too many people open places that look like a sandwich shop but charge the prices of a steak house. Have a good mixture of comfortable booths, as well as tables/chairs with comfortable seats - unless your goal IS to own a lower-priced sandwich shop, in which case you can scale things back a bit. But higher prices should equal a higher class/comfort interior. Red, Orange, Yellow and tons of white are fine for faster food places, but if you want a sit-down relaxing place, use Greens, Browns, Tans, Maroons - Earth tones, and lower lights. Be VERY careful of your selection of music, how loud it's played, etc.
4) Market Research: Know your clientele. Opening a Vegan or Vegetarian restaurant in a blue collar town of meat and potato eaters might not fly over very well. Then again, if it's a decent sized city and there are NO other options of that type, ONE place might make a killing if it's strategically located, marketed, priced, etc. Charging $12 for a salad bar in such a town however, won't cut it. Variety is usually key in smaller cities - offering Vegan/Vegetarian dishes on the same menu as other items might fly better, rather than just having one type of food. The restaurants that fail the quickest are the ones that ONLY sell one style of food (steak houses, BBQ, Seafood, etc) while the ones that tend to survive the longest are the ones that offer a variety of different types of food.
5) Keep drama at home: There is no place in a restaurant/business for personal drama, especially if it manifests itself where customers are exposed to it. Dress well, and even if it's a casual restaurant, you can still look neat. If it's a family business, keep family drama/fights AT HOME. All staff should be clean, neat, and act accordingly. Nothing says "Don't come back" more than if someone peeks into a kitchen and sees a cook with 50 tattoos and body piercings and a dirty t-shirt cooking their meal, or sees a waitress texting hate texts to her boyfriend in the corner, or hears the owner and his wife bickering. Keep it home, or take it to the alley out back.
6) Pricing: Ok, I regularly look at online menus (when places have them) in Charleston restaurants, and I do see pricing issues. I see places charging $9 for a cheeseburger, $25 for a steak, and $16 for fish, when here in Atlanta where I live now, I can go to a pretty NICE restaurant that has those exact same portioned items of good quality for $7.50, $22.00, and $12,99, respectively. Considering the average household income in Atlanta is easily 20% to 30% or more (in some neighborhoods even higher) than it is in Charleston, that makes the price difference that much larger. Check your vendor pricing. Compare. Don't try to get rich overnight. There are places in your restaurant where you can be "cheaper" and save money, but don't try to hike the food prices up to an unreasonable level.
7) Internet Presence: Speaking of "online menus"... this is 2011, and it's extremely important that you have a web site for your restaurant/business up, running, and updated regularly. You don't have to pay someone $$$ to do it, but you also don't want it to look like cousin Bertha Mae slapped it together in 5 minutes, either. Tons of "drag and drop" options and services are out there from Intuit web sites and tons of others, so there's no excuse for not having one. Have a way for people to email you and check the emails daily... and respond! Restaurants in Atlanta are now also using Twitter to "Tweet" instant, one-day only coupons to their followers, and some report a measurable increase in sales on the days they do that. Last harp - don't be tech stupid - it makes a difference.
Take a breath... almost done...
Last) Cleanliness: Keep it CLEAN. Floors, windows, tables, bathrooms, etc. If you are not spotless, folks will not come back... period. And remember that YOUR idea of "clean" at home might not be quite as high as what the general public's idea of clean is when eating out. Clean in restaurants should = "spotless". Do NOT make your wait staff clear the dirty tables - think about it... someone grabs dirty plates and glasses people have been drinking out of, takes them to the back, and then grabs plates of fresh food to be taken out for customers to eat seconds later (and we know they don't wash up in-between)??? No. And using that one same dirty rag in a little bleach water the entire day to wipe off a table? Double no. Wait staff delivers food and drinks - hire a busboy to clear/clean tables or do it yourself if you don't want to pay for one.
Ok, end of LONG rant. Still want a restaurant? The point is, I've done it enough that I can say that 8 out of 10 restaurants that open have a whole list of things being done wrong when they do open. Five out of 10 won't survive longer than 1-2 years, tops. Whether it be inexperienced owners, poor staffing, pricing, or over-ambitions based on the area they're in, etc... many places need quick "tweaking" and people need to learn how to fix the mistakes quick, otherwise they won't last.
It's not doom and gloom out there, but there's A LOT to think about, and A LOT of small things to put together.
Last edited by atlantagreg30127; 02-19-2011 at 10:39 PM..
The new Pie's and Pints on Capitol Street is really nice. The pricing is the same as the one in Fayetteville, and the food is just as good. It will do really well downtown, as it is packed every night for dinner. It's a perfect fit in Charleston.
Also, i tried Angela's On The River in Saint Albans this past Friday night. It is located in the Chilton House. I must say, it was a very good experience. The food was better than you would get at a Logan's or Texas, or even Olive Garden. Think a more blue collar version of Chop House with Applebee's pricing! My wife and i had appetizer, two entree's, wine and beer for under $40. I can't think of too many places that you can eat that quality of food for that price.
The new Pie's and Pints on Capitol Street is really nice. The pricing is the same as the one in Fayetteville, and the food is just as good. It will do really well downtown, as it is packed every night for dinner. It's a perfect fit in Charleston.
Also, i tried Angela's On The River in Saint Albans this past Friday night. It is located in the Chilton House. I must say, it was a very good experience. The food was better than you would get at a Logan's or Texas, or even Olive Garden. Think a more blue collar version of Chop House with Applebee's pricing! My wife and i had appetizer, two entree's, wine and beer for under $40. I can't think of too many places that you can eat that quality of food for that price.
I really enjoyed Pies and Pints in Charleston when I went last month. That place would easily make a killing up here in Pittsburgh or many other bigger cities.
I really enjoyed Pies and Pints in Charleston when I went last month. That place would easily make a killing up here in Pittsburgh or many other bigger cities.
I totally agree, it's the best pizza place i've been to. I'm just waiting for Guy Ferretti to come do a show about it on Food Network. It's bound to happen.
I tried to go to Thelma Fay's Cafe for brunch Sunday. After the newpaper article they were swamped. They had run out of food by 1:00. Anyone been there?
I tried to go to Thelma Fay's Cafe for brunch Sunday. After the newpaper article they were swamped. They had run out of food by 1:00. Anyone been there?
where is that? Is it new?
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
THE List....
