The fallout of the Riverchase Galleria shooting for Hoover and Greater Birmingham's image (Pelham: credit, how much)

[steveklein]

Crump saw the footage.

Crump and the family is awfully quiet.

Sounds like to me, the Hoover Police might not be at nearly as much fault as we thought a week or 10 days ago.

But that's just speculation right now. The facts will come out in time. I certainly don't fault Hoover PD ALEA for getting their ducks in a row before releasing information after the fiasco immediately following the incident.

[steveklein]

Originally Posted by _OT

21-Year Old US Army Veteran

...who didn't even complete basic training. He got a general discharge (not the more usual honorable discharge; you can research why that is viewed so differenty). Obviously this alone doesn't deserve a death sentence... but parading pictures of this guy in uniform like he was a war hero when he flamed out of basic training is a slap in the face to our other military men and women

Originally Posted by _OT

Shot from behind
In the head, neck, and back
While Leading shoppers to safety

This is according to a report completed by someone hired by the family, correct? Not saying the information is incorrect (in fact, I'd be really surprised if he wasn't shot in the back) but we don't really know if he was "leading shoppers to safety".

Originally Posted by _OT

Forensics reports officer should be charged with a crime.

Not sure what you are saying here. Also, are you implying that if someone is shot in the back, it couldn't possibly be justified? Because that is just patently ridiculous. Again, I'm not saying the shooting *was* (or was not) justified. I don't know how anyone could say that without seeing all the evidence.

I do know that if you matched the description of a suspect, showed or brandished a gun and were running away (turned back) from a scene where there was an active shooter in a mall with thousands of people, that you could be seen as a threat.

Originally Posted by _OT

Hoover also won’t release footage

Until their own and the ALEA investigation is complete. The footage was shown to Crump (family's lawyer) and I get the sense that Hoover is itching to share the footage but ALEA wants to make sure they have all their ducks in a row before doing so. I'm anxious to see the footage too, but I understand the reasoning for taking their time.

Originally Posted by _OT

Oh boy, it’s not looking pretty for Hoover and HPD.

It isn't looking particularly bad for them either, with the exception of how they bungled the initial reporting. I believe they established the deceased knew both the original shooter and the victim. That tells me even though he may not have been a part of the plot to hurt or kill someone, it is very unlikely he was just a totally innocent bystander minding his own business. The fact that he brought a gun into a place where guns are not permitted, while obviously not worthy of a death sentence, does not reflect the narrative that some in the media/protesters are trying to paint right now of a "good guy with a gun" being murdered in cold blood by a racist cop.

It seems *most likely* to me that he was peripherally involved in the situation and was running from the scene with a gun. But it's best to just let the investigators do their job and hopefully we will all get some answers... even if it the truth isn't what we were hoping for.

[bfmx1]

Yeah this will be a hairy situation to say the least. I mean if I'm a cop and I see a dude flinging a gun around and he's near the skirmish, I would probably shoot. I assume he's either the shooter or going to shoot.

My point is that, the incident could have probably been swept under the rug as far as a national blemish on Bham... But the protesters are ensuring that Birmingham's name be tarnished.

Is it wrong to make a thread on here that candidly discusses the racial aspects here? It would be interesting to hear yalls perspective. I can argue both ways I think. Or will that thread get totally nuked?

[cherokee48]

Originally Posted by steveklein

Crump saw the footage.

Crump and the family is awfully quiet.

Sounds like to me, the Hoover Police might not be at nearly as much fault as we thought a week or 10 days ago.

But that's just speculation right now. The facts will come out in time. I certainly don't fault Hoover PD ALEA for getting their ducks in a row before releasing information after the fiasco immediately following the incident.

I don't know where you got that the family has been quiet, from what I've seen on CNN recently(yesterday) they have been very visible and consistent in asking that the tape be released to the public. I understand that they were able to view 30 seconds of footage with the lawyer and nothing before or after the 30 seconds and still no public viewing of the video evidence or release of the officer involved's name. I do hope that Hoover and ALEA get their ducks in a row and are transparent because it appears that they are seeking to hide or cover up something and the national media is crafting that narrative and it looks terrible and suspicious for Hoover and Alabama:

https://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...203-story.html

https://bismarcktribune.com/news/nat...bcf9caa85.html

https://pilotonline.com/news/nation-...5455c6e7b.html


https://news.vice.com/en_us/article/...-autopsy-finds

Dad of man killed by police in Alabama mall gets apology but few answers | State | bradfordera.com

https://www.chicagotribune.com/subur...207-story.html

Originally Posted by bfmx1

Yeah this will be a hairy situation to say the least. I mean if I'm a cop and I see a dude flinging a gun around and he's near the skirmish, I would probably shoot. I assume he's either the shooter or going to shoot.

My point is that, the incident could have probably been swept under the rug as far as a national blemish on Bham... But the protesters are ensuring that Birmingham's name be tarnished.

Is it wrong to make a thread on here that candidly discusses the racial aspects here? It would be interesting to hear yalls perspective. I can argue both ways I think. Or will that thread get totally nuked?

I don't see this being a blemish on Birmingham at all as Birmingham has totally sidestepped any and all association to the incident, Hoover and especially Alabama are getting absolutely roasted in the national media right now though. Every article and TV headline has ALABAMA front and center and Birmingham has barely been mentioned other than being the location CNN has interviewed family from and buried in a few articles as Hoover being a Birmingham suburb. I think that it's fine to make a thread with race as a topic since this incident is relevant to the Birmingham metro forum provided that the forum posting rules are followed. His perception as innocent rather than the shooter as was first reported, as a soldier rather than a flame out that shouldn't even be seen in military regalia, "good guy with a gun" rather than thug, running away from shooting rather than brandishing a gun are all dictated by his race rather than his actions in large part and that is relevant and should be discussed, it certainly is on a national level.

[drro]

An incident like this has happened before(from here on city-data): Thugs already shooting up Top Golf. It is really concerning when there are shootings in the more upscale areas where the golf courses and large malls are. These incidents will certainly damage Birmingham's reputation.

[_OT]

There was never a shooting at TopGolf, nor did it damage the reputation.

[jero23]

Originally Posted by bfmx1

Yeah I know, it has not been widely publicized mainly because of the other news going on right now.. Everything with Trump and of course GHW Bush. This would probably be 2nd page news but it looks like the protestors are not satisfied with that..

Don't misunderstand me, i feel for the people and agree with their voices/concerns being heard loudly! But, they're going to ensure that negative news land in Hoover/Bham and that's not good.

Maybe this is a good time to think more about regional cooperation and annex hoover into Bham ha.

The protests were going on for 2 weeks now. There has been plenty of lulls in the news cycle prior to GHWB passing to push this to the forefront and it did not occur. The global press has not tied this to Birmingham other than Hoover being a suburb because they even know it is not a part of the actual jurisdiction. Hoover wouldn't allow that annexation even if Birmingham was open to, so Hoover created this mess for themselves then they will have to clean it up on their own. Honestly, this attempt by some of you bringing regional cooperation shows that you don't understand that jurisdictions have to handle the consequences of unnecessary governmental segregation and balkanization on their own. This situation is a prime example of it.

[steveklein]

Originally Posted by _OT

There was never a shooting at TopGolf, nor did it damage the reputation.

A bullet shot from a gun most definitely found its way to the TopGolf property. Would you sit here and argue that there wasn't a shooting at the Harvest 91 music festival because the shots were fired from the Mandalay Bay hotel? And how on earth can you sit here and say it didn't damage its reputation. It was a reminder to everyone that it's just a short hop from some dangerous territory. Did it ruin the establishment? No. Did it damage it? Yeah. And to pretend otherwise is being willfully ignorant.

[cherokee48]

Originally Posted by steveklein

A bullet shot from a gun most definitely found its way to the TopGolf property. Would you sit here and argue that there wasn't a shooting at the Harvest 91 music festival because the shots were fired from the Mandalay Bay hotel? And how on earth can you sit here and say it didn't damage its reputation. It was a reminder to everyone that it's just a short hop from some dangerous territory. Did it ruin the establishment? No. Did it damage it? Yeah. And to pretend otherwise is being willfully ignorant.

I recall hearing about this incident last year. From what I remember it was a dispute over money between 2 people off of the property and one of the errant shots broke a window. To my knowledge that was the extent of the damage to the facility and there has yet to be any media reporting an impact to business's viability as a result, every time I'm at or around Uptown it is either packed or very busy.

[mcalumni01]

Originally Posted by cherokee48

I recall hearing about this incident last year. From what I remember it was a dispute over money between 2 people off of the property and one of the errant shots broke a window. To my knowledge that was the extent of the damage to the facility and there has yet to be any media reporting an impact to business's viability as a result, every time I'm at or around Uptown it is either packed or very busy.

It open last december, the close by off site shooting happen 2 days before christmas.

Topgolf officials estimated a 500K total attendance for the first year of opening. (Dec. 1, 2017 - Dec. 1, 2018)

CBS 42 reported back in April that since opening on Dec. 1, 250K had already attended. Remember the incident happen in Dec. and by April, half the total estimated had already been there. So there you have it.