Live 1880, the best time in American history. (pressure, stoves, prevent)
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There was no income tax; there were no gun laws. The frontier was disappearing, but it was still there. If a man had nothing but a horse, saddle, and gun he could build an empire. Government in this country was small; the only blemish albeit a terrible one was the Northern invasion and conquest of the CSA. There was no welfare, mandatory schooling, or laws against child labor; families decided these things. But there were colleges and universities. People loved learning and knowledge. Except for the most depraved, feminine virtue was praised. A man who outraged a woman more often than not paid a terrible price.
The Industrial Revolution was in full flower. People with an idea and a tongue silver enough to raise capital could realize the fruits of their genius. The British government picked an American firm, Pratt and Whitney to retool Woolrich Arsenal. American farmers had the steel plow and the reaper. Steam tractors were on the horizon. Steam railroads crossed the continent carrying passengers and freight; refrigerator cars carrying ice in the heat and charcoal stoves in the cold brought California oranges to New York bankers and fresh oysters from New York harbor to Colorado miners.
Prospects for the future had never been brighter; people knew that they were living in a very special time.
We can't yet bring back the customs and mores of those days of splendor for society as a whole, but we can do so to some extent in our private lives. We can if we wish build our private worlds which can offer the most independence possible in today's America.
We can begin by adopting as much of that earlier technology as possible. For now, we'll need to deal with rules and regulations we despise, but we can put them in the backs of our minds and live as best we can like our forefathers. I'm using a water windmill to pump my water into a cistern. I'm now planning to build another cistern up the hill so that I can have good water pressure without an electric pump to bring water from the cistern into the house. Later projects will include a wood or coal-fired boiler for hot water. I do know how to use a wood cook stove. I've had mine for almost fifty years; my mother on a Thanksgiving visit roasted a turkey and prepared the rest of the meal. She'd learned how to use a cook stove as a girl and really had fun doing it.
I just did something else, more psychological perhaps, but I believe very worthwhile. I moved my computers, fax, credit card terminal, and all but three electric lamps into one room. The three I left out date from 1940 or earlier. I do need phone out in the rest of the house so I don't miss business calls, but even in two days I find I'm using the computer only as an adjunct to my library. My lighting is now courtesy of the Aladdin Kerosene Lamp Co. I realize, however, that I need some smaller lamps as well. I believe Dietz lanterns may do the trick.
I've always worn a mechanical watch, but a modern one. However, for the last few days I've been carrying a pocket watch in a hunter case dating from about 1920.. I do need a repeater (a watch that gives the time with chimes as well as a dial) so that I can get the time in the dark. Radium dials are rather modern.
I found a photograph of President Cleveland and plan to place it in my office (not the computer room).
Now I'll mention the practical: I'll be able to go not just off grid but to a technology from a time when there was no grid. As I become physically less dependent on the modern world I'll become less socially dependent. When I finish typing this post I'll turn off the computer and leave the modern technology room. I'll be back, but in the meantime it will be 1880. If I look out a window I won't see a horseless carriage.
I'm not planning to give up modern medecine, arms, or anything else that can preserve life, e.g., modern fire extinguishers. But the fire and CO alarms will be in very inconspicuous places.
The survivalist wishes to be as free as possible. Self-sufficiency, largely incompatible with the modern age, is one of the best sources of freedom. There were fifty million people in this country in 1880. Let's hope that events will restore that number today. We'll live far better lives.
It is rather amazing that between 1880 and 1918, the value of a dollar hardly inflated at all. You could therefore bury cash coins under your blanket and know you are not losing value in the holding of the future value. It was not ideal for all in America though .
Industrial revolution caused major mistreatment of working class life by big giant monopolies. There were terribly corrupt elite enterprises that took serious advantage of workers and buyers for frivolous profits. This led to railroad strikes, worker rebellions, socialist parties, religious revivals, and extremist views. And in the South the Dixie Democrats deprived non-whites of any chance of equal opportunity using unfair laws that would be found legal under Pressey vs Fergusson.
I prefer honestly the Transcendental era of New England Emerson/Thoreau 1830s
I was lucky enough to be able to walk through and examine a home around here that was built in the late 1860s. It was the typical large colonial style that was common among the early Mormons. And amazingly, none of the people who have lived in the home since it was built took out the original technology. It did not have a fireplace. What it did have was a small wood stove in every room and the large wood/coal cooking cooking range in the kitchen. It was basically modular heating based on where the occupants were on a given day/time of day. What an inspirational home! It was solid masonry and in as good of condition now as the day it was built. It was built just before the late Victorian era brought in the very popular Queen Anne style that is quite prevalent around here. This one looked more mid-Atlantic Civil War Era. A spin-off of the earlier Hall & Parlor homes of the 17th and 18th century.
From what I've read, actual fireplaces were not all that common after about 1840, when the cast iron stoves began replacing the earlier large cooking hearth (fireplace). Of course, there were still multiple chimneys, but connected to wood or coal fired stoves. Fireplaces were "nostalgic" by the 1890s and early 1900s, and often included in the Later Victorian Manses, much as they are today--more decoration than actual utility.
Of course, for some of the population, a fireplace for warmth and cooking was a reality far into the iron stove and even central heat era, just as kerosene was sole lighting used by some through the 1950s... take my father for instance. He had no electricity or running water until he joined the navy in 1955 and left the family farm and small homestead.
I know that artificial fireplaces were common before 1900. I recall reading that the White House had them by 1898. I have an artificial fireplace box that has an electric heater and features artificial glowing coals. The coal is made of glass; it rests on a grate near the top of the box. Underneath two light bulbs mount on the bottom. The rising heat from the bulbs turns two pieces of metal with breaks or slots which sit above them. The overall effect is very pleasing.
People in the old days weren't unobservant; They knew that most of the heat from a fireplace went up the chimney. Benjamin Franklin designed his stove in the middle of the eighteenth century. People bought them although they weren't very good. If he hadn't gone into politics just think what he might have done. Instead of being known as a great thinker and inventor he is known for his supposed membership in Sir Francis Dashwood's "Hellfire Club". In his defense, however, I must say that he proposed having the turkey instead of the eagle as the symbol of these United States (perhaps I should say those). The last eagle I saw was standing on the road near here eating something dead. If the founding fathers had followed his advice the famous gold coin would now be called the Double Turkey.
People who have eaten food cooked on a hearth and in an oven claim the hearth is superior. I have a cookbook published about 1900 written by a lady who grew up on a plantation in the antebellum South. She describes the food in glowing terms. The kitchen was a distance from the house, partly because of heat, but more because of fire hazard. Ruled by a tyrannical "Mammy" the kitchen turned out food better than Delmonico's.
Food historian Ivan Day has a hearth in his home where he holds small classes several times per year.
Authoress Bee Wilson has eaten there; she sang his praises to the house tops in Consider the Fork.
The best restaurants still had hearths in the late nineteenth and early twentieth centuries. Mechanical spits had generally replaced those turned by small boys by that time. I suspect that clockwork was far more dependable.
"The survivalist wishes to be as free as possible. Self-sufficiency, largely incompatible with the modern age, is one of the best sources of freedom. There were fifty million people in this country in 1880. Let's hope that events will restore that number today. We'll live far better lives."
So OP, let me get this straight. You're hoping for the massive die-off of a few hundred million people or a mass exodus so that you can live your dream life?
"The survivalist wishes to be as free as possible. Self-sufficiency, largely incompatible with the modern age, is one of the best sources of freedom. There were fifty million people in this country in 1880. Let's hope that events will restore that number today. We'll live far better lives."
So OP, let me get this straight. You're hoping for the massive die-off of a few hundred million people or a mass exodus so that you can live your dream life?
Not only that:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy in Wyoming
Now, let's ignore government schoolteachers past or present, imported leftists, and members of whining minority groups. We can mourn the fact that we can't handle them as our ancestors but since it's fruitless to dwell on the subject let's get back to having fun.
He is also wishing we could deal with all the "whining minorities" the way they were dealt with in the 1800s. I can only infer what he means by it but this would not be the first time we have seen such comments from him
First, let me thank everyone who's made a positive contribution to this thread.
Perhaps it's the cool rainy day that's made me think of solar cooking. We don't really associate solar anything with the good old days, but I'd be amazed if people didn't come up with it innumerable times independently. I've played with solar ovens. While I like the concept there's a great deal lacking in the execution. They're flimsy and have insufficient heat retention whether they're fabricated from scraps or purchased. There's a dramatic drop off in temperature when the sun sets and temperatures plunge. But suppose we use heavy cast iron or heavy aluminum painted black; that should change the picture. There was a time not so long ago when it was possible to find old cast iron stoves and buy them at scrap prices. I'm wondering if even now we could find panels and boxes to make usable ovens that would hold heat long after sunset or in the event of rain. I can easily imagine using them in the dead of winter at high altitude.
When I lived at 8500' and had double digit subzero weather I learned that if I waited until the sun had been shining on a vehicle for a while I could open the door that had a metal handle without gloves. The car would start as if it were a warm summer day. I'm at about 5500' now; that's not high enough for the effect. 7500' is inadequate as well. The threshold seems to be above 8000'.
Has anyone else ever experimented with this? I wonder how a cast iron bath tub painted black with a cast iron cover would work; it seems too big. Cooking vessels are too small. I do believe that I'm on to something, however. using black cast iron I believe that cooking at any altitude or season may be possible provided that there's sunlight.
Rumford fireplaces were and are quite efficient for a fireplace. But Rumford's ideas weren't always fully understood and a lot of odd variations were produced over the course of the past 2 centuries. If you happen to read A.J. Downing's house pattern books and read the sections on heating and ventilation you'll find he wasn't too fond of the fact that stoves were replacing the fireplace by 1850. He showed some interesting ideas of the time for ventilating houses to improve air quality where stoves were used instead of fireplaces. Even he gave the Rumford fireplace design a back that leans forward though, but he kept the important curved throat and angles of the sides of the firebox and proportions of the depth and opening (square opening, firebox 1/3 as deep as the width, back is 1/3 the width of the opening and the sides slant to that to reflect the heat).
I found this extraordinary and obviously unique brooch today. Having associations with Montana, the Columbian Exposition, and Mrs. Potter Palmer I suspect more than a few folks would kill for it. MTSilvertip: I think you'll like this.
The history of fashion can give us a great deal of information about recreating fashion of the period. While we can find plenty of information on cowboy attire we're sometimes at a loss when we wish to know what others wore. We can find plenty of photographs of workmen and should study their costume. But it's enthralling to see a special gift for Mrs. Potter Palmer who was the acknowledged leader of Chicago society.
There are numerous books available on fashion, primarily ladies' fashion. For the gent who wishes something authentic there's an interesting publication treating Victorian and Edwardian men's fashion accessories. My choice discovery there was a device for holding a napkin at the throat. Apparently it was something a gentleman could comfortably do at the time. Many fashion accessories are inexpensive and regularly appear on ebay. It is necessary, however, to learn to identify them. They often appear at yard or jumble sales at very low prices because the sellers have no idea what they are. Here's another idea for a home business activity.
A pile of old costume jewelry can be a source of treasures, not all of which are cheap and tawdry.
That is a fantastic pin HIW! Thanks for posting it.
Love the sapphire. Hope it's a real Yogo.
Not an exact copy of the seal, but close enough. To my mind, the figures of the Miner and Farmer should be included on the seal instead of just the pick, shovel and plow.
Montana actually became a state in 1889, so that follows with the theme of this thread too!
The Trappers and Hunters were the first to come, but the gold rushes are what started the towns, farming is what made permanent settlements.
If someone wants to see what life was like in the 1860-1880 time frame, the towns of Bannock and Nevada City are basically walk through museums of the mining towns of the period. Virginia City is still a living town.
The history of that area is fastinating, The Innocents and the Vigilantes, Sherriff Henry Plumber working both sides, and when the Vigilantes hung him, he claimed to have enough gold to bribe them, "with their weight in gold". They didn't take the bribe so the legend of Plumber's gold was born and people still go down there to try and find it.
Lot of pretty wild history there, they even have Club-foot George Ive's foot in the museum at Virginia City. He was hung by the Vigilantes and burried on boot hill, (still there), and several years later somebody dug it up to confirm it was actually him in the grave.
Still a lot of gold in that area....
Last edited by MTSilvertip; 06-11-2014 at 03:37 PM..
Perhaps it's the cool rainy day that's made me think of solar cooking. We don't really associate solar anything with the good old days, but I'd be amazed if people didn't come up with it innumerable times independently. I've played with solar ovens. While I like the concept there's a great deal lacking in the execution. They're flimsy and have insufficient heat retention whether they're fabricated from scraps or purchased. There's a dramatic drop off in temperature when the sun sets and temperatures plunge. But suppose we use heavy cast iron or heavy aluminum painted black; that should change the picture. There was a time not so long ago when it was possible to find old cast iron stoves and buy them at scrap prices.
I actually use small cast iron dutch ovens in my solar oven. They work great, retain the heat longer if a cloud goes in front of the sun or the sun angle is getting low. Also, they tend not to dry out the food as quickly as graniteware can if you leave the food in too long.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy in Wyoming
I found this extraordinary and obviously unique brooch today. Having associations with Montana, the Columbian Exposition, and Mrs. Potter Palmer I suspect more than a few folks would kill for it. MTSilvertip: I think you'll like this.
The history of fashion can give us a great deal of information about recreating fashion of the period. While we can find plenty of information on cowboy attire we're sometimes at a loss when we wish to know what others wore. We can find plenty of photographs of workmen and should study their costume. But it's enthralling to see a special gift for Mrs. Potter Palmer who was the acknowledged leader of Chicago society.
There are numerous books available on fashion, primarily ladies' fashion. For the gent who wishes something authentic there's an interesting publication treating Victorian and Edwardian men's fashion accessories. My choice discovery there was a device for holding a napkin at the throat. Apparently it was something a gentleman could comfortably do at the time. Many fashion accessories are inexpensive and regularly appear on ebay. It is necessary, however, to learn to identify them. They often appear at yard or jumble sales at very low prices because the sellers have no idea what they are. Here's another idea for a home business activity.
A pile of old costume jewelry can be a source of treasures, not all of which are cheap and tawdry.
Interesting broach. Historical fashion (authentic) can be found on ebay at times. Also there are a couple of websites that specialize in reproduction Victorian women's and men's fashions. Some of their stuff is a bit trite and stereotypical and obviously aimed at the younger crowd (clothing "for effect"), but there are some very nice authentic styles as well. Other sites go into women's and men's hairstyles, hats, shoes, etc. And even undies.
If someone wants to see what life was like in the 1860-1880 time frame, the towns of Bannock and Nevada City are basically walk through museums of the mining towns of the period. Virginia City is still a living town.
That area is fascinating; I've been there at least three times. It's an easy drive in the summer because I can go through Yellowstone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisC
I actually use a small cast iron dutch ovens in my solar oven. They work great, retain the heat longer if a cloud goes in front of the sun or the sun angle is getting low. Also, they tend not to dry out the food as quickly as graniteware can if you leave the food in too long.
What about just setting the Dutch Oven in the sun or setting the small Dutch Oven in a larger one? I live in an area of high winds where sturdiness is always a desideratum.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisC
Interesting broach. Historical fashion (authentic) can be found on ebay at times. Also there are a couple of websites that specialize in reproduction Victorian women's and men's fashions. Some of their stuff is a bit trite and stereotypical and obviously aimed at the younger crowd (clothing "for effect"), but there are some very nice authentic styles as well. Other sites go into women's and men's hairstyles, hats, shoes, etc. And even undies.
You should have looked around the website. I know that Clara Bow is your ideal but consider this damsel from 1860. Would you object to journeying through life with her at your side?
Two sundry hints for those who love the old times: if you are researching kerosene lamps also search "oil lamps"; if you are searching Blue Willowware also search "Transferware". They're much better search terms overall.
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We don't really associate solar anything with the good old days, but I'd be amazed if people didn't come up with it innumerable times independently. I've played with solar ovens. While I like the concept there's a great deal lacking in the execution. They're flimsy and have insufficient heat retention whether they're fabricated from scraps or purchased. There's a dramatic drop off in temperature when the sun sets and temperatures plunge. But suppose we use heavy cast iron or heavy aluminum painted black; that should change the picture. There was a time not so long ago when it was possible to find old cast iron stoves and buy them at scrap prices. I'm wondering if even now we could find panels and boxes to make usable ovens that would hold heat long after sunset or in the event of rain. I can easily imagine using them in the dead of winter at high altitude. 
Many fashion accessories are inexpensive and regularly appear on ebay. It is necessary, however, to learn to identify them. They often appear at yard or jumble sales at very low prices because the sellers have no idea what they are. Here's another idea for a home business activity.
