'Prop 13 like' proposed change to WA property tax structure (Seattle: sales, renting)
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This is an interesting proposal to WA's current property tax system. Quote from WA Rep Jim Walsh:
"My constituents constantly ask me, as well as people from all parts of Washington, why we can't have a 'California Proposition 13' type of property tax system in this state. A system under which your property taxes are fixed, or fairly fixed, at one rate as long as you own your house or property. When I explain in order to do that, we would have to amend the Washington State Constitution, the response I usually get is, 'OK, let's do that.'
After living in CA and seeing the benefits of Prop 13, especially for long-term residents and retirees, I can see the value in improving the tax system in WA for long-term home owners. There are so many things which seem to favor the new residents and/or wealthier, what about those who have lived in WA a long time, paid off their homes and continue to see large increases to their property taxes?
I know this won't appeal to everyone and there will always be opposition regardless of the proposed changes. But it seems like its time to look for better solutions for long-term residents beyond taxing some out of their paid for homes - including retirees and those on limited incomes.
After living in CA and seeing the benefits of Prop 13, especially for long-term residents and retirees, I can see the value in improving the tax system in WA for long-term home owners. There are so many things which seem to favor the new residents and/or wealthier, what about those who have lived in WA a long time, paid off their homes and continue to see large increases to their property taxes?
I know this won't appeal to everyone and there will always be opposition regardless of the proposed changes. But it seems like its time to look for better solutions for long-term residents beyond taxing some out of their paid for homes - including retirees and those on limited incomes.
Derek
I'd love to see it, but it will never happen. Just like $30 tabs, we can vote it in again and again and the State Superior court will reverse it. The "new residents and/or wealthier" are going to see a reality of no one here to serve them, it's happening already. Whatcom county residents who had pipes freeze/burst during the cold were posting that they were getting 3-4 weeks lead times for a plumber, $140/Hour from the time his van leaves the shop....if anyone called back at all. How's 3-4 weeks with no water sound? Without changes, I believe operational viability will come into play for virtually every service aspect of life from construction trades to mechanics to even State workers in the public utility and transportation systems. I mean, you know it's bad when even the county assessor parks their motorhome at their son's place during the assessment season then retreats to Arizona for the rest of the year because their property taxes were too high
By 1997 it was much to late, as the Clinton Tax act drafted in the summer of 1996... removed the previous need to 'buy-up'. The favorite areas to flee from high property valuations had already been exploited, and home prices no longer matched to local wages and economy. (Worse impact on the 13 western-most states and those desireable areas adjacent to DC, NYC and Boston.)
This is an interesting proposal to WA's current property tax system. Quote from WA Rep Jim Walsh:
"My constituents constantly ask me, as well as people from all parts of Washington, why we can't have a 'California Proposition 13' type of property tax system in this state. A system under which your property taxes are fixed, or fairly fixed, at one rate as long as you own your house or property. When I explain in order to do that, we would have to amend the Washington State Constitution, the response I usually get is, 'OK, let's do that.'
After living in CA and seeing the benefits of Prop 13, especially for long-term residents and retirees, I can see the value in improving the tax system in WA for long-term home owners. There are so many things which seem to favor the new residents and/or wealthier, what about those who have lived in WA a long time, paid off their homes and continue to see large increases to their property taxes?
I know this won't appeal to everyone and there will always be opposition regardless of the proposed changes. But it seems like its time to look for better solutions for long-term residents beyond taxing some out of their paid for homes - including retirees and those on limited incomes.
Derek
I would oppose such a change.
Every problem he is talking about can be better and more fairly addressed through more generous homestead exemptions and retiree exemptions for people living in their homes. You could even index such exemptions to the rate of property inflation. And that doesn't require a constitutional amendment. We could even do things like defer property taxes completely for elderly residents of limited means who wish to continue living in their homes and then assess them on the estate later after they die. I would support that.
But bring Prop-13 to Washington? No. For example, should a wealthy retiree who moved to Arizona 20 years ago get a prop-13 style tax break on the home in WA that they haven't lived in for 20 years and are simply renting out as an investment property or renting as an AirB&B? When their neighbors next door who actually live in their home are paying higher property taxes because they bought more recently? That is inherently unfair in my book.
Someone has to pay for the schools, police, fire departments, local roads, and such. If you cut taxes for a privileged few (who are on average wealthier to begin with) based on length of ownership it just means that everyone else has to pay more.
Last edited by texasdiver; 01-15-2023 at 02:39 PM..
I'd love to see it, but it will never happen. Just like $30 tabs, we can vote it in again and again and the State Superior court will reverse it. The "new residents and/or wealthier" are going to see a reality of no one here to serve them, it's happening already. Whatcom county residents who had pipes freeze/burst during the cold were posting that they were getting 3-4 weeks lead times for a plumber, $140/Hour from the time his van leaves the shop....if anyone called back at all. How's 3-4 weeks with no water sound? Without changes, I believe operational viability will come into play for virtually every service aspect of life from construction trades to mechanics to even State workers in the public utility and transportation systems. I mean, you know it's bad when even the county assessor parks their motorhome at their son's place during the assessment season then retreats to Arizona for the rest of the year because their property taxes were too high
What you are describing has little to do with property tax rates in Whatcom County and everything to do with wealthy NIMBY types opposing any increase in density and construction of new housing. Which inevitably drives the price of housing through the roof. In another country, downtown and Central Bellingham would be full of high rise and medium rise housing to accommodate the obvious demand. The fact that this is all illegal in Bellingham is why plumbers can't afford to live there anymore.
Every problem he is talking about can be better and more fairly addressed through more generous homestead exemptions and retiree exemptions for people living in their homes. You could even index such exemptions to the rate of property inflation. And that doesn't require a constitutional amendment. We could even do things like defer property taxes completely for elderly residents of limited means who wish to continue living in their homes and then assess them on the estate later after they die. I would support that.
But bring Prop-13 to Washington? No. For example, should a wealthy retiree who moved to Arizona 20 years ago get a prop-13 style tax break on the home in WA that they haven't lived in for 20 years and are simply renting out as an investment property or renting as an AirB&B? When their neighbors next door who actually live in their home are paying higher property taxes because they bought more recently? That is inherently unfair in my book.
Someone has to pay for the schools, police, fire departments, local roads, and such. If you cut taxes for a privileged few (who are on average wealthier to begin with) based on length of ownership it just means that everyone else has to pay more.
WA also has no income tax. If Prop 13 comes to WA expect to see more levies, cut services, and diminished quality.
As A Democrat, I wish CA had not originally passed Prop 13 as it made sales tax higher and more regressive to those least able to afford it. The proposition also punished those in poorer districts as wealthy districts could pass levies or supplement with parent fundraisers for schools / other services.
I would be lying if I said my parents personally have not benefited from it. They are middle class and purchased their home somewhere around 1984 or 1985. I wasn't born yet. I think they bought a home in a good part of Oakland was about 100-150k but now all homes in that neighborhood are worth more than $1Million. There's is a middle class neighborhood so not the worst neighborhood but not the richest. Their property taxes would be through the roof if it were repealed. A repeal at this point there would do them more harm that good. As for us in WA, there are other ways for the state to get money esp if we still maintain no income tax (which is fine by me). No need to reward investors or hamper local services.
Outside of the Seattle area, Spokane is still relatively well priced esp compared to the Idaho side.
I would be lying if I said my parents personally have not benefited from it. They are middle class and purchased their home somewhere around 1984 or 1985. I wasn't born yet. I think they bought a home in a good part of Oakland was about 100-150k but now all homes in that neighborhood are worth more than $1Million. There's is a middle class neighborhood so not the worst neighborhood but not the richest. Their property taxes would be through the roof if it were repealed.
This is also partly DUE to Pro-13. It creates a very powerful economic incentive for people to hang onto properties that they would otherwise gotten rid of long go. This sort of market intervention is a contributing cause of property value escalation in California. This is because due to Prop-13 there are much fewer homes coming on the market in any given year, which drives up the price of all the rest.
The same exact thing would happen here. It is simple supply and demand. If you want to increase home prices in WA then do things that reduce the supply of homes in WA. Prop-13 is one of those things.
What you are describing has little to do with property tax rates in Whatcom County and everything to do with wealthy NIMBY types opposing any increase in density and construction of new housing. Which inevitably drives the price of housing through the roof. In another country, downtown and Central Bellingham would be full of high rise and medium rise housing to accommodate the obvious demand. The fact that this is all illegal in Bellingham is why plumbers can't afford to live there anymore.
Nope, we are getting the mid-rises all over town in the Urban Villages along Samish Way and in the Fountain District as well as in Cordata and Woburn areas.
Plumbers can well afford to live here and other employees (lower paid service) join roommates.
What’s wrong with being a NIMBY? We stopped a huge development in our area 15 years ago that would have multiplied density by 80 times and incurred huge upgrades to infrastructure which would have burdened our rural neighborhood. Btw, we are not wealthy but our gentrifying neighborhood is (wealthy neighbors weren’t here when project was fought).
I'd love to see it, but it will never happen. Just like $30 tabs, we can vote it in again and again and the State Superior court will reverse it. The "new residents and/or wealthier" are going to see a reality of no one here to serve them, it's happening already. Whatcom county residents who had pipes freeze/burst during the cold were posting that they were getting 3-4 weeks lead times for a plumber, $140/Hour from the time his van leaves the shop....if anyone called back at all. How's 3-4 weeks with no water sound? Without changes, I believe operational viability will come into play for virtually every service aspect of life from construction trades to mechanics to even State workers in the public utility and transportation systems. I mean, you know it's bad when even the county assessor parks their motorhome at their son's place during the assessment season then retreats to Arizona for the rest of the year because their property taxes were too high
Don't Whatcom Co. residents insulate their pipes for winter? Seattle residents do.
This is also partly DUE to Pro-13. It creates a very powerful economic incentive for people to hang onto properties that they would otherwise gotten rid of long go.
And the loss of tax revenue to the State is what caused a very painful transition when Prop 13 first went into effect. Overnight, UC Berkeley's budget got slashed. That's when they greatly increased the number of grad students teaching courses, instead of faculty. All UC budgets were cut, including groundskeeping and building maintenance. Something like that would be devastating to the UW and other state schools.
OTOH, it's not really a good thing for lifelong residents to be taxed out of their homes. There must be a compromise solution somehow...
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