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I have to ask you: where would an infant get milk if mommy in unable to nurse? They would need to et it from a cow in order to get enough calcium. Now in the rare case a baby is allergic to cows milk, then, of course substituting soy is better than no milk at all.
I think there are good arguments on both sides; vegetarians versus meat eaters: not probably as many good arguments for veganism.
Meat eaters who really do eat healthy eat a lot of veggies, and fruits. and can be very healthy. Vegetarians might be able to get all the protein they need simply from their diet but they have to work a lot harder at it.
The notion about eating whole proteins was pushed in the 60s by a Adele Davis, who got rich on stressing the need for whole proteins. She, of course wasn't the only one who did this. I will add, I followed her advise for many years including eating organ meats at least once a week. She died from stomach cancer I will add. I look back on it now and think she was way over the top. The best part of her theories was the information on preservatives and how bad they are. At that time no one ever talked about preservatives.
I still maintain would doubt the information written in the Huffington Post and still hold to the theory of complete protein, but if one is healthy, feels good and can get what they need, nutritionally without meats that is fine.
There are formulas on the market that do not contain dairy, so those would be used to feed a human baby. Milk intended for a baby cow is not the answer.
It is not difficult at all to get protein as a vegan or vegetarian. All protein comes from plants. Meat eaters are filtering their protein through the body of the animals they eat, vegans and vegetarians are going right to the source. But, there is no reason to be so concerned about protein at all. We have been told, by the meat, egg, and dairy industries, that we need SO MUCH protein. Gee, I wonder why? Oh yeah. To sell meat, eggs, and dairy. If you are eating enough calories, you are getting enough protein, period. (unless you are doing some weird extreme thing like eating Twinkies and nothing but Twinkies, but if you are doing that, you have bigger issues than lack of protein)
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You dont need to "combine" proteins at single meal, you eat a variety vegetable foods, your body keeps amino acids around and combines them as needed. I mean exactly how many people have you ever seen that were actually protein deficient??? Protein of one sort or another is in nearly everything you eat. Seriously. Lot more chance of some vitamin deficiency disease and you dont even see lot of that in modern world. People may not get optimum amounts, but not lot people with rickets or beri-beri or pellagra. Usually only see that anymore in famine areas with people literally starving.
B12 is also in various bacteria and maybe some fungus. So if you arent super antiseptic about removing every microscopic bit soil from your veggies, you no doubt get B12 from soil bacteria. And some have said the more animal based foods you eat, the more B12 you need. But of course its plentiful in those animal based foods.
Hey if you wanna believe you need to eat a whole cow every couple days, go for it.
The cultures that traditionally ate meat heavy diets actually ate a FAT heavy diet. These were wild animals and many times aquatic so there were lot vitamins and minerals stored in that FAT. Your confinement raised industrial ag animals in modern world have no such store of vitamins and minerals in their FAT so better eat your veggies..... course they maybe not as nutritious as wild plants eaten during human hunter and gatherer stage of civilization.
Babies need milk. If they can't get human milk--and please don't start with "every mother can successfully breastfeed"--there's no better time for them to utilize milk from another mammal species. I simply can't fathom how processed beans could be better for them than the fresh milk of a goat or cow, even if you have to adjust it a little bit to make it more like human milk. If you had orphaned kittens, would anyone claim that soy formula would be better for them than letting them nurse from a small mother dog?
Babies need milk. If they can't get human milk--and please don't start with "every mother can successfully breastfeed"--there's no better time for them to utilize milk from another mammal species. I simply can't fathom how processed beans could be better for them than the fresh milk of a goat or cow, even if you have to adjust it a little bit to make it more like human milk. If you had orphaned kittens, would anyone claim that soy formula would be better for them than letting them nurse from a small mother dog?
Human babies need human milk or replacement formula. Before formula, people used what was called a "wet nurse" when mother couldnt produce milk or enough milk, another woman already producing milk for her own baby. Other mammal milk is not a substitute for newborns.
Human babies need human milk or replacement formula. Before formula, people used what was called a "wet nurse" when mother couldn't produce milk or enough milk, another woman already producing milk for her own baby. Other mammal milk is not a substitute for newborns.
Yes, I'm familiar with the concept of a wet nurse. I'm talking about now. Do you believe that in cases of necessity, a "formula" made with beans is superior to a "formula" made with the milk of another mammal?
Please--don't deflect again. Not every mother in the world who can't breastfeed has access to either a wet nurse or a breastmilk bank.
Please--don't deflect again. Not every mother in the world who can't breastfeed has access to either a wet nurse or a breastmilk bank.
Are you saying wet nurses are still around? I thought they existed only in Shakespearean times (like the Nurse character in "Romeo and Juliet") and maybe Victorian times.
Last edited by MillennialUrbanist; 02-27-2020 at 06:48 PM..
Are you saying wet nurses are still around? I thought they existed only in Shakespearean times (like the Nurse character in "Romeo and Juliet") and maybe Victorian times.
No, not really, not in the Western world. The closest thing is a "breastmilk bank," where women lucky enough to have an oversupply can donate the surplus to those who don't have enough. But if you don't have access to that, I guess beans are good enough for your baby.
But if you don't have access to that, I guess beans are good enough for your baby.
I'm childfree. But if I were to have a kid, I'd be VERY hesitant to give soy products to a baby boy. Soy contains phytoestrogens, which, as the name suggests, are molecularly similar to estrogen. They may affect his male development, both physical and physiological. Not to mention, many soy crops are GMO'ed beyond recognition. But I'm not sure what other plant-based milks or baby formulas are out there.
I read somewhere that goat milk has fewer ill effects than cow milk. Possibly because goats are more of a niche animal, and are less likely to be mass-raised on factory farms, like cows are. So there's that. But it's an option only for vegetarians and not for vegans.
Last edited by MillennialUrbanist; 02-27-2020 at 07:23 PM..
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They are not cows.
I thought they existed only in Shakespearean times (like the Nurse character in "Romeo and Juliet") and maybe Victorian times.
