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Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
34,690 posts, read 57,994,855 times
Reputation: 46171
Yes, cross posting is not allowed... And "comparing USA cities" is a pretty broad thread when someone is looking for a specific region, and Oregon is a pretty protective forum, not conducive to objective discussions with neighbors.
And also yes, californication of property values has directly impacted local residents from the western states. It cost me personally over $1m of my earnings (which I would have rather given to the needy, than spent unnecessarily in property taxes, and needless valuation increases. (All my assets are slated for charity, so increased home values, are of no value, just more wasted spending.). At least I had a job, so was not forced to leave (displaced) from my lifetime home, as were many retirees I help. Most had retired in the 1970's so there 'sequence of returns" (retirement income vs cash flows) were not adequate or available to increase to meet skyrocketing tax obligation. Many were living fine on less than $1000/ month. Which today is only a fraction of my property tax obligation alone. (Which used to be $800/ yr). I haven't had wage income for 19 yrs. Our company froze the wages of locals for 10 yrs, to cover the increased budget of allowing CA tranferees to retain their CA wages for the pain and suffering of moving to PNW. In some cases our much less qualified coworkers from CA were making 30-50% higher than our local wages. Everyday were got to deal with "Quit working so hard and putting out such high volume of work, you're making us look bad for our higher wages we must have for our Lacamas Shores homes" . It kinda ruined the great working environment and productivity we had strived and succeeded to create. Same with the community. Fire, EMS, library, and especially the schools are far degraded from the quality and efficiency we once had developed, largely by direct community commitment and involvement. When is the last time you worked side be side to better your community and services?.... (Crickets)
I got mine, I do what I want, I invest in what's important to me, my family is best and to be highest valued.... So goes the neighborhood. (Me first, me only). Welcome to northern (annexed) CA.
It's life, and it's not pretty to all. But a lot of people consider themselves and their interests very pretty. Makes for a very shallow community.
Yes, cross posting is not allowed... And "comparing USA cities" is a pretty broad thread when someone is looking for a specific region, and Oregon is a pretty protective forum, not conducive to objective discussions with neighbors.
And also yes, californication of property values has directly impacted local residents from the western states. It cost me personally over $1m of my earnings (which I would have rather given to the needy, than spent unnecessarily in property taxes, and needless valuation increases. (All my assets are slated for charity, so increased home values, are of no value, just more wasted spending.). At least I had a job, so was not forced to leave (displaced) from my lifetime home, as were many retirees I help. Most had retired in the 1970's so there 'sequence of returns" (retirement income vs cash flows) were not adequate or available to increase to meet skyrocketing tax obligation. Many were living fine on less than $1000/ month. Which today is only a fraction of my property tax obligation alone. (Which used to be $800/ yr). I haven't had wage income for 19 yrs. Our company froze the wages of locals for 10 yrs, to cover the increased budget of allowing CA tranferees to retain their CA wages for the pain and suffering of moving to PNW. In some cases our much less qualified coworkers from CA were making 30-50% higher than our local wages. Everyday were got to deal with "Quit working so hard and putting out such high volume of work, you're making us look bad for our higher wages we must have for our Lacamas Shores homes" . It kinda ruined the great working environment and productivity we had strived and succeeded to create. Same with the community. Fire, EMS, library, and especially the schools are far degraded from the quality and efficiency we once had developed, largely by direct community commitment and involvement. When is the last time you worked side be side to better your community and services?.... (Crickets)
I got mine, I do what I want, I invest in what's important to me, my family is best and to be highest valued.... So goes the neighborhood. (Me first, me only). Welcome to northern (annexed) CA.
It's life, and it's not pretty to all. But a lot of people consider themselves and their interests very pretty. Makes for a very shallow community.
Good example of the stereotyping the OP will face whether she's like that or not. It's one of your favorite repeated themes. Hopefully, you don't believe all Californians are like that. I mean you did marry one, so I'm assuming you're not lumping all into that same bucket of depravity even if it comes across that way in some of these posts.
I don't think any state has the market on self-centered living. That's more of a human condition and equal opportunity offender or not depending on the individual.
I honestly believe the biggest gripe is that people come in with more money than some locals and that's just not fair! As in life's not fair since some have more than me... Maybe they were born into it or given the easy path to wealth or whatever the reason. But that's just life regardless of where one lives. If you didn't already know, wealthy folks moved into CA from all over the world and bought up much of the land and prices rose way before they did in these other smaller states. It's more a function of the US economy than some evil plot to take land or raise prices on the locals. That's just the way things work in every state in the nation which have desirable features. Demand is higher and so prices rise, simple as that... Same thing in the South in places like Charleston , SC I just visited on a business trip. Housing has shot way up as lots of north easterners have moved in for nicer weather and beautiful beaches. Some locals don't like that and blame them for all their troubles. But its a free country where folks move wherever they want. There's nothing wrong with it if one understands US economics. I mean how many states have you moved into and bought land in as a non-local including the PNW? Doesn't that move from an outsider cause their values to go up when multiplied across the nation and world? Isn't that what you're doing with all your properties you buy in these places? It's seems a bit hypocritical...
Derek
Last edited by MtnSurfer; 04-22-2023 at 11:33 PM..
I know WA doesnt have the income tax, but I don't know if that is offset by other taxes being higher? Higher sales tax / property taxes?
It is currently not. Property tax in OR and WA is roughly 1% of market value, +/- 0.25% depending on how hot or cold the market is. Sales tax is 8.6% in Vancouver, but groceries/insurance/rent/loans/medicine/feminine hygiene products are not subject to sales tax. So really, it's mostly cars that you will notice sales tax on. Even stuff like utilities is cheaper in WA than when I compare to friends and family in OR. WA is in better fiscal shape than OR due to having higher value businesses and a much bigger higher income population than OR. Plus Seattle's financial situation is way better than Portland's situation, so it provides a bigger boost to the rest of the state.
WA did get a new carbon tax this year which I anticipate will cause a lot of costs to rise. Comparing Costco gas across state lines, before the new carbon tax, prices were roughly the same per gallon, and now the WA side Costco gas is ~$0.35 per gallon more expensive than the OR side.
Also, WA has a minimum salary for overtime exempt workers of $65k, which is scheduled to go up quite a bit in the next few years, so that may be of benefit also.
I'm looking to relocate within the next year or so to the PNW and trying to get some info from the locals.Moderator cut: see note
I'm looking to relocate within the next year or two. Yes I have visited already, both WA and OR. I am not a big city person (no thanks traffic, smog, crime) but I like rural or suburban areas - anything where I can can commute to a job within 30 min. Vancouver has really caught my eye in general but not sure if some parts are better than others, or if a nearby suburb is better? Someone suggested Camas WA which looked very nice but was a bit above my budget. What do you like vs dislike about your area? Is there an affordable suburb / safe area near or in Vancouver within a 30 min drive to basic office jobs?
I'm single, 38, no kids, not looking for a big nightlife or dating etc, I would like to make a few good friends, join a new new animal rescue in the area, maybe find a nice church, be near some dining options and grocery stores, and within a 30 min commute to office jobs (I'm an office admin currently). I notice that your minimum wage is actually higher than ours in CA even though your apartments cost about $1000/month less than hours, which I find interesting, even though I never work for minimum wage since I have 20 years work experience. I am vegetarian, have tattoos, enjoy football, music / concerts, shopping / spas, movies, not big into politics and political debates, nor do I like religious debates but I do attend church, non denominational. I'm giving you this info so if you know the area you can make suggestions that you think would be a good fit.
Last edited by Count David; 04-25-2023 at 11:46 AM..
Reason: read the TOS, you are violating it by making these sorts of comments. Your threads were moved to more appropriate forum(s).
Curious, you already had this other thread going, were you not able to get the info you needed?
I had to post and re-post because the moderators of this site constantly relocate your posts elsewhere. It's very annoying and makes getting the info you are looking for difficult.
Good example of the stereotyping the OP will face whether she's like that or not. It's one of your favorite repeated themes. Hopefully, you don't believe all Californians are like that. I mean you did marry one, so I'm assuming you're not lumping all into that same bucket of depravity even if it comes across that way in some of these posts.
I don't think any state has the market on self-centered living. That's more of a human condition and equal opportunity offender or not depending on the individual.
I honestly believe the biggest gripe is that people come in with more money than some locals and that's just not fair! As in life's not fair since some have more than me... Maybe they were born into it or given the easy path to wealth or whatever the reason. But that's just life regardless of where one lives. If you didn't already know, wealthy folks moved into CA from all over the world and bought up much of the land and prices rose way before they did in these other smaller states. It's more a function of the US economy than some evil plot to take land or raise prices on the locals. That's just the way things work in every state in the nation which have desirable features. Demand is higher and so prices rise, simple as that... Same thing in the South in places like Charleston , SC I just visited on a business trip. Housing has shot way up as lots of north easterners have moved in for nicer weather and beautiful beaches. Some locals don't like that and blame them for all their troubles. But its a free country where folks move wherever they want. There's nothing wrong with it if one understands US economics. I mean how many states have you moved into and bought land in as a non-local including the PNW? Doesn't that move from an outsider cause their values to go up when multiplied across the nation and world? Isn't that what you're doing with all your properties you buy in these places? It's seems a bit hypocritical...
Derek
Thank you Derek! For anyone who is curious, no I am not moving to OR or WA with a bunch of CA money to buy up land, or trying to make more income than the current locals. Im sure some rich CA people do relocate there and buy land, but I am not one of them. I am a hard working middle class single woman who just struggles to make the insane rent on her apartment here in CA and is sick of working 2 jobs 7 days a week to get by with a small apartment here in CA while in WA/OR the rents are $1000 less per month on average. This move just makes good sense and it does not do any disservice to any current residents.
I understand the frustration of out of state people making property values rise, because we here in CA constantly have a flood of people coming in to CA from literally all over, which means if you (as a CA born and raised native) can no longer afford the crazy rent, there is a line of people waiting to take your spot. We actually have very few white people here now, as most have relocated recently to affordable places including TN, GA, AL, AZ, NV, CO, TX most commonly. We mostly have indians, asians, and persians flooding in and buying up all of our homes. So believe it or not, it's just as frustrating for all the CA people to be pushed out by our own prices flying up huge amounts every year by the influx of people who are not from here but come here with their large families and family money. This is not just an OR / WA problem. There is always someone else coming in from somewhere making prices go up, and pushing out the middle class to make room for the rich!
For anyone who is curious, no I am not moving to OR or WA with a bunch of CA money to buy up land, or trying to make more income than the current locals. Im sure some rich CA people do relocate there and buy land, but I am not one of them.
I am a hard working middle class single woman who just struggles to make the insane rent on her apartment here in CA and is sick of working 2 jobs 7 days a week to get by with a small apartment here in CA while in WA/OR the rents are $1000 less per month on average. This move just makes good sense and it does not do any disservice to any current residents.
Then you really shouldn't be relocating there. From what I heard, they only (barely) allow rich transplants there!
All kidding aside, the rich people in CA are not relocating anywhere else! Only two types of people getting the heck out of CA. Smart people who either retired and/or made a gnarly profit by selling their homes or those who are like you and I; single, living paycheck to paycheck, renting and can no longer deal with insane COL in this otherwise wonderful State.
To me, CA is also too crowded, warm and full of pretentious people. I am also very ready for a change of scenery, lifestyle in a cooler climate place.
Last edited by Count David; 04-25-2023 at 11:47 AM..
Reason: c'mon
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From CA to Vancouver WA area
