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When I went to school in West Germany in the early 70’s and we had a much more efficient system than this American school system by far.
It was shocking how much more efficient it was.
We had a rotating class schedule where we took classes for 4-5 hours straight instead of this inefficient 45-50 minute thing we do here.
The 45 -50 minute classes are very inefficient when you consider how long it takes the class to get rolling and then when it is going good it is time to stop the classes momentum and waste near 25% of an hour to start learning something in the next class, only to repeat this cycle day in and day out.
How many valuable hours are lost per year?
What might that percentage be?
We also had testing on what skills we excelled at and got shifted into those areas.
Some became skilled craftsmen at young ages some went on to science and engineering, again at young ages.
Most all had a path to become self sufficient.
None had to worry about student loans.
My mom was an engineer.
One of my aunts drove a train before becoming one of the best dress makers in the Atlanta Georgia Area.
My other aunt was a plumber that could weld before she settled down with a mechanical engineer and became a homemaker.
I’m sure a lot of you think that testing and being placed where you do best is not fair, I get that.
How about the rotating schedule of longer classes ?
Why we haven’t ventured there is beyond me.
I’m just scratching the surface about how they are more efficient in their schooling system and how much more we could be.
Bottom line is that they take it more serious and are not the only country that has these ideas.
Seems like this is a bad business plan that is not doing well to me.
Just my thoughts.
Those are not hard to find. Much of the world LISTENS and LEARNS and is far above USA in innovative education (and why I prefer to hire a foreign educated workforce). It is also fun and encouraging to network with worldwide educators who are leading in successes and new education innovation.
Sweden. #1 in Well-developed public education system. ...
Denmark. #2 in Well-developed public education system. ...
Germany. #3 in Well-developed public education system. ...
Canada. #4 in Well-developed public education system. ...
Norway. #5 in Well-developed public education system. ...
Finland. ...
United Kingdom. ...
Netherlands.
We, and several friends moved to Singapore about the time our kids were ready for school. Those who were able to stay for 10 yrs, kid's came home and ACED the ACT and SAT's and got free college of their choice in high end USA colleges & US Military academies, others did WW colleges and excelled with excellent lifelong international careers (and spouses).
Private senior care dollars flow very freely +/-, but the best care I've found in the USA is in midwestern towns where the community funds and staffs senior care centers. The community wins (as it does with community owned power, which doesn't happen much in PNW, we prefer the foreign countries reap our wind, solar, and enjoy and use those profits in their foreign countries.)
One does not have to wonder why SWWA has always been a hotbed of homeschooling. (Moore Foundation circa pre 1980).
There were over 300 in our CW homeschool group when Mill Plain and 164th was a 4 way stop. Vastly improved in all forms and availablility of schooling (except one).
They’re certainly not hard to find, however I was curious which aspects of those countries you would like to see implemented here.
A quality Education does not need to include athletics.
If edu was to be run as a business, with the deliverable being education leading to lifelong contributions to the community, economy, and society.... It would be very easy to calculate the ROI and effective outreach of all their programs ( music, skills training, business, health, technology...and sports). There is a bundle of money tied up in sports facilities, staffing, programs at USA schools. None of this sports emphasis took precedence over edu in the many countries we lived and worked worldwide,. And my worldwide employee hires were not of lessor value or capability than USA hires. Quite to the contrary. In fact, ww hires often know far more about fitness, health, and sports than their USA counterparts. Usually more active, healthy, adventurous than their USA coworkers. Definitely more traveled and diverse in their understanding and ability to work cross-culturally and certainly better communicators across age groups within the workplace and customer base.
Room for improvement in Washougal and beyond.
Rethink the value of athletics and the whole package of education.
Are we being effective?
Just go hire a bunch of recent grads or students, and find out for yourself.
I normally agree with most of your ideas StealthRabbit but not so much on this one.
I’m totally for cutting out the fat just not what “I” think is essential .
Sports are actually only part of the athletic programs.
There are some other lessons in there that not only do help all but can be money saving investments.
Health practices and proper diet fundamentals are very important lessons and can save us all money down the road.
Team work/team building and learning good productive social skills are most youths first lessons in leadership skills and athletic programs do cultivate that type of learning.
I’d consider this a good investment as well.
There are a few other benefits in this as well.
All the best.
Andy.
Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
34,694 posts, read 58,012,579 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MechAndy
...
Sports are actually only part of the athletic programs.
,..
Team work/team building and learning good productive social skills are most youths first lessons in leadership skills and athletic programs do cultivate that type of learning.
I’d consider this a good investment as well.
...
That's fine, we all are aware of what we've seen work well for development and education.
I have not recognized a huge value in sports, tho my kids lettered in 6 + sports each, (from SWWA schools). That's fine too, but it was instrumental in their development of social skills and personal commitment. Likewise, foreign nationals whom I'm around every day don't splay far more social awareness than their USA peers.
YMMV, , no problem.
My ideas are not 'right', they are just not conventional. (That's my purpose, expand your thoughts and ions.
Personally, i'd replace the stadium with something to get folks in the community moving, for better health not sitting being entertained. The cost vs daily utilization of of stadiums and sports fields of pubic HS and Middle Schools in western WA is pretty pathetic. (Since we're talking school spending here). I expect your views and opinions to be different.
That's fine, we all are aware of what we've seen work well for development and education.
I have not recognized a huge value in sports, tho my kids lettered in 6 + sports each, (from SWWA schools). That's fine too, but it was instrumental in their development of social skills and personal commitment. Likewise, foreign nationals whom I'm around every day don't splay far more social awareness than their USA peers.
YMMV, , no problem.
My ideas are not 'right', they are just not conventional. (That's my purpose, expand your thoughts and ions.
Personally, i'd replace the stadium with something to get folks in the community moving, for better health not sitting being entertained. The cost vs daily utilization of of stadiums and sports fields of pubic HS and Middle Schools in western WA is pretty pathetic. (Since we're talking school spending here). I expect your views and opinions to be different.
Organized sports are not for everyone. I never played them nor do I watch them except maybe the Super Bowl. And commercials can be more entertaining depending on who is playing.
That said, I do have kids who have played on either a sports team (soccer) or in the band for football & basketball games. And those have been positive experiences for them. I've also met folks who received sports scholarships who went on to university. And this really helped them during a difficult period in their young lives. Some came from poverty and it was their way to pursue higher education due to excessive cost in the US. So, I see value there beyond my own personal hobbies and interests (mostly outdoor nature sports).
Football, basketball, soccer, gymnastics, swimming, volleyball, etc... are a big deal in the schools not only for the players but the band members, cheerleaders and other students involved depending on the sport. They gain a greater sense of team work in such programs vs. individualized endeavors. So, the value is more than merely playing a game or encouraging them to stay in school but helps them learn to work with a team and also have some fun. My younger, more cynical self was less inclined to see any real value there since I never really liked those things. But over time its become more apparent from seeing our kids and their friends. While not as essential as the 'three Rs,' school sports can have a meaningful impact upon young students' lives. Though they are not for every student. At Hockinson High, for example, the band experience was phenomenal for our middle daughter. It really extended her love for music even if I had to sit through those games in the rain and cold. lol
Derek
Last edited by MtnSurfer; 04-03-2023 at 06:27 PM..
Organized sports are not for everyone. I never played them nor do I watch them except maybe the Super Bowl. And commercials can be more entertaining depending on who is playing.
That said, I do have kids who have played on either a sports team (soccer) or in the band for football & basketball games. And those have been positive experiences for them. I've also met folks who received sports scholarships who went on to university. And this really helped them during a difficult period in their young lives. Some came from poverty and it was their way to pursue higher education due to excessive cost in the US. So, I see value there beyond my own personal hobbies and interests (mostly outdoor nature sports).
Football, basketball, soccer, gymnastics, swimming, volleyball, etc... are a big deal in the schools not only for the players but the band members, cheerleaders and other students involved depending on the sport. They gain a greater sense of team work in such programs vs. individualized endeavors. So, the value is more than merely playing a game or encouraging them to stay in school but helps them learn to work with a team and also have some fun. My younger, more cynical self was less inclined to see any real value there since I never really liked those things. But over time its become more apparent from seeing our kids and their friends. While not as essential as the 'three Rs,' school sports can have a meaningful impact upon young students' lives. Though they are not for every student. At Hockinson High, for example, the band experience was phenomenal for our middle daughter. It really extended her love for music even if I had to sit through those games in the rain and cold. lol
Derek
Other countries like Germany and Norway don't have school sports. But they have public community sports and sports facilities that operate youth sports. And I promise you that is a MORE expensive way to do it than the way we do here where we piggy back youth sports on the schools and use school grounds and school facilities and pay teachers a pittance to coach.
If you want to pull sports out of the schools and then build community sports centers all across the region with full-time paid staff, new playing fields, gyms, pools, etc. like they have in Nordic countries then fine. But it is going to cost a LOT more tax dollars then just keeping them in the schools like we do now. Norway, for example, is littered with lavish community centers that have 50 meter pools, tracks, playing fields, gyms, etc. That is where kids play youth soccer and youth basketball instead of at their public schools. It is still tax dollars either way.
And if you want to say that they richest country on the planet and the richest country that has ever existed on the face of the earth can't afford to provide athletic opportunities to its youth I'd say your priorities are extremely haywire.
Other countries like Germany and Norway don't have school sports. But they have public community sports and sports facilities that operate youth sports. And I promise you that is a MORE expensive way to do it than the way we do here where we piggy back youth sports on the schools and use school grounds and school facilities and pay teachers a pittance to coach.
If you want to pull sports out of the schools and then build community sports centers all across the region with full-time paid staff, new playing fields, gyms, pools, etc. like they have in Nordic countries then fine. But it is going to cost a LOT more tax dollars then just keeping them in the schools like we do now. Norway, for example, is littered with lavish community centers that have 50 meter pools, tracks, playing fields, gyms, etc. That is where kids play youth soccer and youth basketball instead of at their public schools. It is still tax dollars either way.
And if you want to say that they richest country on the planet and the richest country that has ever existed on the face of the earth can't afford to provide athletic opportunities to its youth I'd say your priorities are extremely haywire.
Norway and Germany like many other developed nations offer free or near free higher education to its citizens. So, sports performance is not tied to a chance at going to college like it is here in the US. And from my POV, they are doing things better. If someone is good at sports, it does not matter where they go to school or if they will continue. There is support for higher ed regardless. Unfortunately, like many things, Americans are too arrogant to learn from other thriving nations with higher QOL than us. We assume our way is the best and twist it into a political 'anti-American' slogans and agendas rather than learn from others or change. While the richest, we certainly don't have the highest QOL nor the greatest access to higher education for all.
Norway and Germany like many other developed nations offer free or near free higher education to its citizens. So, sports performance is not tied to a chance at going to college like it is here in the US. And from my POV, they are doing things better. If someone is good at sports, it does not matter where they go to school or if they will continue. There is support for higher ed regardless. Unfortunately, like many things, Americans are too arrogant to learn from other thriving nations with higher QOL than us. We assume our way is the best and twist it into a political 'anti-American' slogans and agendas rather than learn from others or change. While the richest, we certainly don't have the highest QOL nor the greatest access to higher education for all.
Derek
Well yes. And athletic scholarships are kind of a scam in many ways.
But my larger point was that keeping youth sports in schools is actually cost effective. It would be more expensive to manage all youth sports through community sports centers like they do in many Euro countries.
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