Remember the Waco Siege (Fort Worth: hotel, house, taxi)

[BobTex]

Originally Posted by EDS_

I'd agree LEOs and the FedGov. handled the Waco siege and ultimate confrontation horribly.

So law enforcement should be held to a high standard and act to that high standard and if they don't uphold those standards stuff can go terribly wrong (which it did)

Originally Posted by EDS_

DK did in fact leave the compound regularly.

So the whole damned catastrophe very likely could have been averted. DK taken into custody and separated from the group ... well, you know what they say about cutting off the head of the snake!

Originally Posted by EDS_

DK did engage in sexual activity with underage girls.....at least once marrying a 13/14yo by leveraging her parents to consent.

On the first part I just can't argue for or against as I was never around him in intimate settings as probably no one else was. The leveraging part is allegation and speculation. There are no witnesses in either they all dead .... or at least it is for the most part it's hearsay! Did DK perform his own marriage ceremony and is they a county certificate of marriage? That's some juicy stuff right thar!

Originally Posted by EDS_

DK had a machine shop built and a couple of guys converted 46 recovered semi-auto firearms into illegal automatic weapons. FFL or not that's expressly illegal. Further, one of the guys involved claims they modified ~100 long guns to automatic fire. If that's correct DK gave away or sold several dozen illegal automatic rifles.

I don't know about any of this. I know these were allegations by law enforcement. Were any of these firearms recovered or captured later after transfer and traced back to the BD. Can you provide a link to that as I'd like to read it. Thx

Originally Posted by EDS_

The radio "go" signal was, "Showtime"......the siege was called, "Operation Trojan Horse."
Undoubtedly the first shots fired the day of the fire were from Davidians.

I can find at least a dozen links calling the operation name "Showtime" and none listed it as the go signal. That's very different thangs right thar! I'd like that link too if you have it. I'm sure they (Feds) later (later in the operation maybe) changed the name to Trojan Horse because "Showtime" don't look good when you have all that death and mayhem.

Google page with dozens of sources naming the operation "Showtime" https://www.google.com/search?q=The+...&ie=UTF-8#ip=1

There are plenty of claims that law enforcement fired the first shots. It's all over news accounts.

There's facts, claims, statements, lies, and bovine scat throughout a lot of this.

[BobTex]

Originally Posted by spacecitytx

Lol, yea...keep telling yourself that.

Meanwhile, allow someone to kneel on your neck for almost ten minutes...see if you get up from that.

That'll solve that riddle.

Also, I live in Harris county...even went to the same high school as he did, although I didn't know him personally.

As stated before, everyone is well aware that he had a criminal past. I'm trying to figure out how that warrants having his neck stood on until death?

One involves feet and one involves knees (see what I was talking about earlier ... drama.

As Joe Friday says: "Let's stick to the facts, ma'am"!

[BobTex]

Originally Posted by As Above So Below...

Its a strategy. Dehumanize the person and explain why they deserved it thus feeling better about your own prejudices.

Speaking of prejudices !

Not to mention assigning motives while pulling that assignment out of thin air . . . or pulling it out of somewhere !

[spacecitytx]

Originally Posted by BobTex

"woke" community? Pulled that out of thin air but I never mentioned that. Maybe some drama because you definitely got into the drama scene as the thread progressed down to here. Drama and woke seem to go together like peanut butter and jelly.

As far as my mindset you don't even have a minute clue of it much less assigning a "mindset" to me. Get a grip !

I also never claimed anything about St. George never doing "anything" wrong. He was in fact in the commission of several crimes and undoubtedly had a hand in his own death but make no mistake that Derek Chauvin strong armed him with brutal force and was rightly convicted for his bad choice. No arguments from me. I ended my one paragraph on Sir George with "let the guilty" be convicted which relayed my sentiments on the man's death.

And let's also be clear that every saint ever was a sinner ! Sainthood does not exclude sinning.






Since when was home invasion and armed robbery "petty" in any sane person's mind? It was felonious assault and he threatened the life of a pregnant woman by holding a firearm to her protruding stomach. PETTY ...... nice ...... family values ...... might have only killed the "fetus" though and not a living being if he'd pulled that trigger! Between 1997 and 2005, Floyd served eight jail terms on various charges. Generally the gubmint don't jail folks for "petty" stuff because they ain't wanting to pay for your room, board, and medical and such unless one really needs their arse outta the general population for a while. While saying all this he still didn't deserve to be killed for being a scumbag IMO.



There are a lot of assumptions and assigning of emotions and motives which are utter lies !




BTW, "passing a fake bill" is stealing. Stealing is not a good thing !

Let me be perfectly clear. My bringing up Sir George of Floyd into this convo was due strictly to Trainwreck 20's comment about a black man being murdered : (quote " Funny, black man resists arrests and is killed, and it is 'he shouldn't have resisted'." ) Because of the immense publicity in that event I (maybe wrongly) brought up that case based on that sparse statement. But as quickly as possible in that post transitioned back into the Branch Davidians. Still don't grasp the applicability to his alluding to "a black man's" deaths because blacks surely died in the Branch Davidian Compound . . . black men, women, and children. And their color seems very unimportant in the case. hmmmmmmm

Who else outside of the "Woke" community would think that GF was the greatest man who ever lived?

Oh yeah, I'm pretty sure that I have SEVERAL minute clues as to your type of mindset.

Saying that GF had a hand in his own death is basically like saying that everyone who dies in a car accident had a hand in their own deaths, since EVERYONE knows that fatal accidents are possible when driving. Therefore, you die in a car wreck, it's just as much YOUR fault as it is the persons who caused the wreck (assuming YOU aren't the cause itself).

See how damn silly that sounds?

I used the term "petty" in the sense that it was well known that GF had a wrap-sheet, but nothing (outside of the assault on the pregnant woman) that would garner him major years in prison. Perhaps I used the wrong terminology, but my point was to show that NO ONE thought he was a damn saint...yet you keep calling him "Sir" and "Saint", implying that those who defend his name thinks he was the greatest thing since sliced bread. THAT'S where my "assumptions" come from, and I stick by it.

[spacecitytx]

Originally Posted by PRND321

Tell that to your Saint Floyd

"My" Saint Floyd?

Again...please show me where I referred to him as such.

[spacecitytx]

Originally Posted by BobTex

One involves feet and one involves knees (see what I was talking about earlier ... drama.

As Joe Friday says: "Let's stick to the facts, ma'am"!

[BobTex]

Originally Posted by spacecitytx

Spot on. It's amazing how the dehumanizing factor works so smoothly. ”He shouldn't have resisted” is all you'll get from the likes of these though. As you said, they WANT people like Floyd to have ”done something to deserve his fate” so that they can feel good about it. Sad.

Your not sad about that. Please! Be accurate. Sir George is a by-line and you've gotten so far off track. At least your last 3 posts in this thread that you haven't even mentioned Waco, David Koresh, or the Branch Davidian. But you did manage to climb up on that high horse! Yippee!

Originally Posted by spacecitytx

You won't find me at any BLM marches or protests either, but I'm smart enough to know MURDER when I see it. Whoever the hell thinks that standing on a person's neck isn't severe enough to kill someone has a SEVERE case of the dummies.

There's that misnomer again

Originally Posted by spacecitytx

I only brought up the Floyd situation because Mr. Know-It-All thought fit to say that people who agree that he was certainly KILLED all think that he was Brother Teresa and never did anything wrong.

Assigning inaccurate motives and inaccuracies again I see. (quote: ”all think that he was Brother Teresa and never did anything wrong.”) And never, ever, ever, ever said anything about

Those with empty quivers call folks names. Mr. Know-It-All ! Stop it, you're killin me (tongue-in-cheek . . . don't get excited)

Besides . . . I'm not a smart man but I love my Jenny!

It's funny (not funny ha ha) how you picked one line out of literally hundreds that I've written here and went off track and stayed off track. Hyper focused on one remark out of dozens of points made. Not in the gist of the topic nor even my post. *sigh* At least you had plenty of company.

[As Above So Below...]

Originally Posted by BobTex

Speaking of prejudices !

Not to mention assigning motives while pulling that assignment out of thin air . . . or pulling it out of somewhere !

Take some Midol and lie down. I wasn’t even talking about you.

[EDS_]

Originally Posted by BobTex

So law enforcement should be held to a high standard and act to that high standard and if they don't uphold those standards stuff can go terribly wrong (which it did)



So the whole damned catastrophe very likely could have been averted. DK taken into custody and separated from the group ... well, you know what they say about cutting off the head of the snake!





On the first part I just can't argue for or against as I was never around him in intimate settings as probably no one else was. The leveraging part is allegation and speculation. There are no witnesses in either they all dead .... or at least it is for the most part it's hearsay! Did DK perform his own marriage ceremony and is they a county certificate of marriage? That's some juicy stuff right thar!




I don't know about any of this. I know these were allegations by law enforcement. Were any of these firearms recovered or captured later after transfer and traced back to the BD. Can you provide a link to that as I'd like to read it. Thx




I can find at least a dozen links calling the operation name "Showtime" and none listed it as the go signal. That's very different thangs right thar! I'd like that link too if you have it. I'm sure they (Feds) later (later in the operation maybe) changed the name to Trojan Horse because "Showtime" don't look good when you have all that death and mayhem.

Google page with dozens of sources naming the operation "Showtime" https://www.google.com/search?q=The+...&ie=UTF-8#ip=1

There are plenty of claims that law enforcement fired the first shots. It's all over news accounts.

There's facts, claims, statements, lies, and bovine scat throughout a lot of this.

1. Yes

2. Yes

3. I wasn't around for The Battle of Hastings but I'm pretty sure it occurred. Kiri Jewell testified in front of congress that DK forced her to have sex with him when she TEN. There's lots more if you actually look and so much for your hearsay claim. Ex-cult member David Bunds spoke at length declaring DK a pedophile.

4. https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/front.../treasury.html

5. It's back in Texas but I have book about various cults. It's called something like, "The Millennium Comes Violently." Don't remember the exact flow but the author is very clear the ATF officially referred to the siege as, "Operation Trojan Horse" and "Showtime" was either an unofficial name, used as a go signal or yelled out by one of the lead agent when agents were sent into to take the compound maybe all three. It's certainly possible the author was/is wrong but I doubt it.

6. I've seen nothing remotely convincing claiming the ATF fired the first shots. Two things matter we'll never really know who fired the first shots. And ATF agents came under determined fire almost immediately. Ergo who fired the first round does not really matter much.

[KathrynAragon]

Ok true story time!

I have a T-shirt I bought on the side of the road while the siege was ongoing. The T shirt says "We ain't coming out," and has a picture of the Branch Davidians looking out over the compound, with DK front and center. And you know what - they didn't come out. It's sort of creepy to have that shirt but oh well, I do have it.