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Currently, there are following religions:
1. religion with a god or gods of choice
2. atheism, which is religion declining existence of any god
3. agnosticism, which is religion of intellectualism, not having gut to choose one of the above yet pretending to be pseudo spiritual
4. science as religion of those, who believe that they can find answers to any question by mechanical investigations and discarding any spiritual options
5. COVID. That is a new god.
Without you defining 'religion', your list means nothing.
Agnosticism is not "not having gut to choose one of the above yet pretending to be pseudo spiritual". Agnosticism is actually being open-minded.
it is fence sitting.
urk's description is quite apt.
waffling is another way to put it. can't make up their mind. nothing opening minded about waffling.
No, it's not fence-sitting. Fence sitting is not wanting to make a decision. Being agnostic is saying I don't have enough information to make a decision. There's a difference.
No, it's not fence-sitting. Fence sitting is not wanting to make a decision. Being agnostic is saying I don't have enough information to make a decision. There's a difference.
regardless of the excuses made, it is still "not making a decision." that is fence sitting.
i agree with the premise put forth in the opening post regarding "Science as a religion" that there are those who worship at the altar of science.
Except no one is doing this. Science is a tool that explains things better than the assertion a god just spoke things into existence, which explains nothing. So it can explain why we are moral beings (evolved group cohesion), and why we do immoral acts (out group morality / mental illness, etc), but it can not tell us how to be the most moral person possible. That requires logic, or philosophy based on that scientific evidence.
Yes, philosophy must be based on evidence, scientific or other types of evidence, otherwise we get bad philosophy such as Plantinga's tiger, which not only tells us nothing, it ignores the evidence we do have.
Once someone labels any valid arguments and evidence as scientism, they are no longer searching for truth, they are trying to avoid it. Scientism is often used as an ad hominem by the religious because they do not like what the evidence says, and I find it ironic that it is often used by those theists who pretend science supports their religion.
That's why I must take extended breaks from this place and will be doing so again in short order. The toxicity just overwhelms everything else. There is so much baggage among those who haunt this place that, quite literally, every thread quickly turns into the same thread. The same tedious, boring thread. Substantive posts quickly get buried beneath the seemingly endless sniping and carping, and it's just not worth the effort to try and ferret them out. I have better things to do with my time and my life.
Then why do you post since you also snipe and carp? You just bury your attacks in your substantial posts. Your misrepresentation of legitimate criticism as 'baggage', for example.
Well, yes, ID has come to be so closely identified with the Discovery Institute and Creationism that any mention of it is like waving a red flag in front of a bull. "Creationism," like "fundie," has come to take on an unwarranted pejorative connotation. All Christians are creationists in the sense of believing we live in a God-created reality, but the term Creationist has come to mean something like "whacked-out, anti-science Young Earth Christian and quite possibly a Flat Earther." And ID, of course, has come to mean something "dishonest and thinly disguised Creationism."
But the ID movement has done some fantastic work, and their argument that they are being shouted out of the discussion on strictly philosophical grounds seems entirely valid.
Not only do they use the same creationist arguments and methods, I even posted a list of ID proponents and their relevant qualifications that showed those same people were Christian creationists. This pretense that ID is different to creationism is not substantive.
Achtemeier - ID creator = God - Not qualified
Alcocer-Ruthling - ID creator = God - Not qualified
Alexanian - Works at DI - Young Earth Creationist - Not qualified
Atchison - ID creator = God - Qualified
Babuna - Creationist - Not qualified
Barnard - Creationist - Not qualified
Baumgardner - Young Earth Creationist - Qualified
Bearden - ID creator = God - Not qualified
Beaucage - ID creator = God - Not qualified
Behe - ID creator = God - Qualified
d'Abrera - Young Earth Creationist - Not qualified
When we're having to wade through someone's views and opinions, it's going have to be concise and to the point. The demands of long lengthy manifestos are rarely met here; i.e. rarely worth the time and expense.
One topic focused on is better than many jumbled together. The ability to write extensively in a forum isn't a sign of wisdom. Putting "truths" in the title guarantees nothing, including that one can talk something into becoming a truth.
God is very much the truth, and there is much in science that is truth, there are two arts here and there are other arts through Man's ideas ..... There is also other life forms in the earth, like the devil demons spirits fallen angels and powers of darkness which infest the earth in the unseen menace spirits who are very real and truth ......... See science is an art form which Man can discover many things in the physical plane, and God's art form is also a way to discover a different field of truth which are in the unseen spiritual world which are indeed are real and truth ...... to claim one of these art forms are wrong is error
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